Go Back   Jeep Garage - Jeep Forum > Jeep Platform Discussion > Grand Cherokee - WK2 - > Trouble Shooting/Problems/Service

Join Jeep Garage Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
  #49  
Old 11-21-2010, 11:05 AM
xmonger's Avatar
Member
My Jeep: 2003 4.7 HO WJ
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Holmdel, NJ
Posts: 193
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 1933
xmonger will become famous soon enough
Re: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6L Pentastar V6 BLOWN-UP ENGINE!

Agreed.

My point was more to the possibility that the tech found some minor evidence of water and immediately concluded hydro-lock, when that may not be the case. I also wanted a pic just to see the path to the plenum.



Quote:
Originally Posted by MSCA View Post
I think some of the members here are making too much of the air intake and gasket(s). For the most part, you have to completely submerge the air intake in order to even have a chance at causing hydro-lock. That's because the air will always be "sucked up" easier than water. So even if some water enters the tube, it's the air that will enter the engine for the most part. Some water may enter too, but in order to hydro-lock the engine, the cylinder(s) have to have enough water in them to fill the volume of the cylinder(s) at top dead center of the compression stroke.

In a V6 of this size, the amount of water necessary is approximately 65ml to fill the combustion chamber enough to cause hydro-lock. And since the water is likely to be somewhat evenly distributed between the cylinders, you can multiply that by six to get a realistic estimate of what it would take to hydro-lock this engine. Unless somehow all the water got into a single cylinder, which seems highly unlikely.
__________________

__________________
2003 WJ Overland 4.7 HO
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 11-21-2010, 11:10 AM
MSCA's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 799
Thanks: 0
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Rep Power: 2381
MSCA is on a distinguished road
Re: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6L Pentastar V6 BLOWN-UP ENGINE!

Quote:
Originally Posted by xmonger View Post
Agreed.

My point was more to the possibility that the tech found some minor evidence of water and immediately concluded hydro-lock, when that may not be the case. I also wanted a pic just to see the path to the plenum.

Yeah, based upon the limited info we have here, I don't think the engine hydro-locked at all. It just doesn't make any sense. Still, something obviously went wrong and caused that puncture in the pan. I just don't see how it could have been hydro-lock.
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
  #51  
Old 11-21-2010, 11:12 AM
xmonger's Avatar
Member
My Jeep: 2003 4.7 HO WJ
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Holmdel, NJ
Posts: 193
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 1933
xmonger will become famous soon enough
Re: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6L Pentastar V6 BLOWN-UP ENGINE!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherodude View Post
Here is a pic of the V6 Pentastar engine bay taken from an online review in about June 2010. The air inlet and box look pretty much like the Hemi's which were shown in earlier posts on this thread.
Thanks.

The plenum is fairly close to the air box, but it's hard to see how it would get water infiltration without a major submersal of the air box.
__________________
2003 WJ Overland 4.7 HO
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 11-21-2010, 11:38 AM
whatevrworks's Avatar
Member
My Jeep: 2011 5.7L WK2
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 527
Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 2692
whatevrworks has a reputation beyond reputewhatevrworks has a reputation beyond reputewhatevrworks has a reputation beyond reputewhatevrworks has a reputation beyond reputewhatevrworks has a reputation beyond reputewhatevrworks has a reputation beyond reputewhatevrworks has a reputation beyond reputewhatevrworks has a reputation beyond reputewhatevrworks has a reputation beyond reputewhatevrworks has a reputation beyond reputewhatevrworks has a reputation beyond repute
Re: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6L Pentastar V6 BLOWN-UP ENGINE!

You may want to see if you can get the data from your nav pulled. Almost all modern Nav systems create a record of where the car has been and at what time, also usually there are certain professions that are able to reconstruct exact speed and other data from your nav system. So if this is the case you have proof of where you were and when you were there. Might be useful to overlay on a map and shop you were on 700 miles of constant roads when it blew. Not sure what nav system you have but may want to contact garmin or navteq.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 11-21-2010, 12:23 PM
RedRocker's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 326
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 2279
RedRocker has a reputation beyond reputeRedRocker has a reputation beyond repute
Re: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6L Pentastar V6 BLOWN-UP ENGINE!

If hydolocking was the culprit, wouldn't there be evidence of water in the intake tube (after the filter) as well as evidence of water in the air filter itself (especially if you have an OEM paper filter). Water in the bottom of the air box means nothing and proves nothing.

Additionally, if water came from a mud puddle, there should be evidence of mud (now dried) on the face of the filter.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old 11-21-2010, 01:33 PM
xmonger's Avatar
Member
My Jeep: 2003 4.7 HO WJ
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Holmdel, NJ
Posts: 193
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 1933
xmonger will become famous soon enough
Re: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6L Pentastar V6 BLOWN-UP ENGINE!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedRocker View Post
If hydolocking was the culprit, wouldn't there be evidence of water in the intake tube (after the filter) as well as evidence of water in the air filter itself (especially if you have an OEM paper filter). Water in the bottom of the air box means nothing and proves nothing.

Additionally, if water came from a mud puddle, there should be evidence of mud (now dried) on the face of the filter.

The original post mentions that water was found in the plenum, not just the air box. Still, for it to get there the puddle had to be a lot deeper than 12" and the speed of travel > 5mph.
__________________
2003 WJ Overland 4.7 HO
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old 11-21-2010, 01:45 PM
rdalcanto's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Salt Lake City
Posts: 622
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 2154
rdalcanto has a reputation beyond reputerdalcanto has a reputation beyond repute
Re: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6L Pentastar V6 BLOWN-UP ENGINE!

Quote:
Originally Posted by xmonger View Post
The original post mentions that water was found in the plenum, not just the air box. Still, for it to get there the puddle had to be a lot deeper than 12" and the speed of travel > 5mph.
And the engine would not have run another 675 miles...
__________________
2011 WK2
Overland 4x4 Hemi with Off-Road II
Mineral Gray, Saddle Interior
Tech Package, Rear DVD
Ordered September 18th, 2010
Delivered 1/14/11
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 11-21-2010, 02:36 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 67
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 1803
Grn4Frk is on a distinguished road
Re: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6L Pentastar V6 BLOWN-UP ENGINE!

That's Total BS. I was hoping the ridiculous way Chrysler's warranty are sometimes would end once they got rid of Cerebus and Daimler. If you were doing something legit bad then I understand but you weren't. I have a cold air intake in one of my cars ( 04 stratus coupe) and go through 6-8in of water all the time going about 20 (Live in Boone NC..floods everywhere)t & it's never had a problem. I think something was messed up in your engine; NOT caused by you. Hopefully Corporate reads this forum and seeing what BS you're being put through and that when they are being a shitty cheapass company to their customers then it really shows how much they've "changed". I guess they still don't care about you after you buy the car and they obviously still don't want repeat customers. I had really high hopes and just reading how dumb they're being.. It makes me furious. esp for such a new car. they should at least work with you on a new engine.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 11-21-2010, 02:41 PM
rdalcanto's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Salt Lake City
Posts: 622
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 2154
rdalcanto has a reputation beyond reputerdalcanto has a reputation beyond repute
Re: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6L Pentastar V6 BLOWN-UP ENGINE!

Time to lawyer up....
__________________
2011 WK2
Overland 4x4 Hemi with Off-Road II
Mineral Gray, Saddle Interior
Tech Package, Rear DVD
Ordered September 18th, 2010
Delivered 1/14/11
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old 11-21-2010, 02:52 PM
GR33N D3M0N's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: down south
Posts: 5,469
Thanks: 0
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Rep Power: 14451
GR33N D3M0N has a reputation beyond reputeGR33N D3M0N has a reputation beyond reputeGR33N D3M0N has a reputation beyond reputeGR33N D3M0N has a reputation beyond reputeGR33N D3M0N has a reputation beyond reputeGR33N D3M0N has a reputation beyond reputeGR33N D3M0N has a reputation beyond reputeGR33N D3M0N has a reputation beyond reputeGR33N D3M0N has a reputation beyond reputeGR33N D3M0N has a reputation beyond reputeGR33N D3M0N has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via Skype™ to GR33N D3M0N
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdalcanto View Post
Time to lawyer up....
X2!!
__________________
MOE
2006 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo (sold)
2011 Mazdaspeed3 w/tech package
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoopCooper View Post
Herpes is better than a Prius. Lol.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I really hope my next car has brembros and a panorama roof
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 11-21-2010, 03:16 PM
DJ BoNiOmArIo's Avatar
Senior Member
My Jeep: 2006 3.7L WK
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Lone Star State
Posts: 10,324
Thanks: 5
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 12415
DJ BoNiOmArIo has a reputation beyond reputeDJ BoNiOmArIo has a reputation beyond reputeDJ BoNiOmArIo has a reputation beyond reputeDJ BoNiOmArIo has a reputation beyond reputeDJ BoNiOmArIo has a reputation beyond reputeDJ BoNiOmArIo has a reputation beyond reputeDJ BoNiOmArIo has a reputation beyond repute
Re: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6L Pentastar V6 BLOWN-UP ENGINE!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MSCA View Post
I think some of the members here are making too much of the air intake and gasket(s). For the most part, you have to completely submerge the air intake in order to even have a chance at causing hydro-lock. That's because the air will always be "sucked up" easier than water. So even if some water enters the tube, it's the air that will enter the engine for the most part. Some water may enter too, but in order to hydro-lock the engine, the cylinder(s) have to have enough water in them to fill the volume of the cylinder(s) at top dead center of the compression stroke.

In a V6 of this size, the amount of water necessary is approximately 65ml to fill the combustion chamber enough to cause hydro-lock. And since the water is likely to be somewhat evenly distributed between the cylinders, you can multiply that by six to get a realistic estimate of what it would take to hydro-lock this engine. Unless somehow all the water got into a single cylinder, which seems highly unlikely.
X2

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedRocker View Post
If hydolocking was the culprit, wouldn't there be evidence of water in the intake tube (after the filter) as well as evidence of water in the air filter itself (especially if you have an OEM paper filter). Water in the bottom of the air box means nothing and proves nothing.

Additionally, if water came from a mud puddle, there should be evidence of mud (now dried) on the face of the filter.
X2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grn4Frk View Post
That's Total BS. I was hoping the ridiculous way Chrysler's warranty are sometimes would end once they got rid of Cerebus and Daimler. If you were doing something legit bad then I understand but you weren't. I have a cold air intake in one of my cars ( 04 stratus coupe) and go through 6-8in of water all the time going about 20 (Live in Boone NC..floods everywhere)t & it's never had a problem. I think something was messed up in your engine; NOT caused by you. Hopefully Corporate reads this forum and seeing what BS you're being put through and that when they are being a shitty cheapass company to their customers then it really shows how much they've "changed". I guess they still don't care about you after you buy the car and they obviously still don't want repeat customers. I had really high hopes and just reading how dumb they're being.. It makes me furious. esp for such a new car. they should at least work with you on a new engine.
Hence the reason why I wanna stay away from Chry-co ... Poorly built cars and horrible customer service!
__________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old 11-21-2010, 03:23 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 67
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 1803
Grn4Frk is on a distinguished road
Re: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6L Pentastar V6 BLOWN-UP ENGINE!

FYI I just mentioned this on twitter @Chrysler....maybe that will give some attention to it.
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Just got my 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee sleepy93 Members Rides 28 10-27-2011 12:53 AM
i have a 2000 grand cherokee with a blown 4.0 563srt8 Engine Performance/Intake/Exhaust 2 10-01-2010 07:55 AM
2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee mangoe Grand Cherokee - WK2 - 4 07-06-2010 09:56 AM
2011 Grand Cherokee/jeep future info on CNBC-Jeep ceo Scottina06 Grand Cherokee - WK2 - 6 04-01-2010 05:45 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:10 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2012 - JeepGarage.Org
The Jeep Grand Cherokee Owners Community

JeepGarage.org is in no way associated with or endorsed by Chrysler Group LLC.