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  #37  
Old 04-16-2011, 09:14 PM
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I found this link after about 15 min of googling: http://www.onesource.com/free/Richar...ile/80028406-3. It's a start...I'd track down this guy and explain the situation. Worth a try...as a business owner you would hope he would want to make it right.
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  #38  
Old 04-16-2011, 09:22 PM
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Re: It's Official, I Regret My Purchase

Some times its better to go somewhere else. You don't sound happy so move on, it sounds like the dealership doesn't want you either. I once got into a pissing match with a service manager and was told to look somewhere else for service, fair enough as to them I was more of a pain than it was worth.
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  #39  
Old 04-16-2011, 10:28 PM
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Re: It's Official, I Regret My Purchase

The first thing I would do is demand the vehicle be returned to the dealership and I would take it elsewhere for service. When you take it in for repair that is why it is there not for some weekend joy ride. The fact that they didn't even ask should tell you everything you need to know about that place. I would find another dealer and go in and explain to the service manager and he should be happy to pick it up from there. They will be able to get all the info on it from chrysler. In my opinion this stuff about collecting more info is BS. Everyone knows some of these have a shudder issue that seems to be from the torque converter. My first WK2 spent a month in the shop which is why I no longer own it. It did not have a shudder problem, but it had it's own drivetrain issues. I am now on WK2 number 2. From my experience Chrylser needs to really work on the customer service. It seemed mostly what I got when I was having problems was lip service. All I heard was were sorry your having these issues and no real answers.
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Old 04-17-2011, 03:04 AM
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Re: It's Official, I Regret My Purchase

Get a lawyer and get the Jeep lemoned.

Go on the local news and have them do a story about Chrysler, Jeep, and that dealership. Mention everything they did poorly and how you were treated and their names.

I test drove a 2011 Porsche Cayenne today! The Cayenne with the colors and options I want is on it's way from Germany. Now just to tell them I want it and negotitate a price I can afford. Thank you for sharing your experience. Sorry for your troubles.

Back to the Cayenne forums for me!
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  #41  
Old 04-17-2011, 07:25 AM
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Re: It's Official, I Regret My Purchase

Report it Stolen!!
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  #42  
Old 04-17-2011, 08:54 AM
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Re: It's Official, I Regret My Purchase

I'm certainly not saying the way the GM treated you was acceptable but it's not uncommon for the service manager to take a vehicle with driveability problems home, especially if he lives far enough away to really give it a test. The "problem" here is he didn't communicate that to you and get your permission. Based on the updates prior to this it was looking like the service manager was doing a pretty good job of sorting out the issues and I personally would give him the benefit of the doubt. In his mind he may have thought he told you what he was doing or "assumed" you understood that he was going to drive it to get more data. The really STUPID thing the dealership did was treat you the way they did, they obviously have little to no clue how to manage customers. Had the GM simply gotten the service manager on the phone and had him apologize to you for not thoroughly explaining what he was doing I'm sure your blood pressure would have dropped, the GM could extricate himself from the situation and the service manager would learn that he needs to be more explicit when talking to customers. What happened is a classic case study in how NOT to manage customer complaints and I agree 100% that it should be raised to the owner personally and rationally, business man to business man. I do not, however, agree that at this point you should become adversarial with the service manager and yank the vehicle and take it to another shop unless you want to start all over again AND risk the infamous "they all do that, it's normal" diagnosis.
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  #43  
Old 04-17-2011, 04:35 PM
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Re: It's Official, I Regret My Purchase

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjw930 View Post
I'm certainly not saying the way the GM treated you was acceptable but it's not uncommon for the service manager to take a vehicle with driveability problems home, especially if he lives far enough away to really give it a test. The "problem" here is he didn't communicate that to you and get your permission. Based on the updates prior to this it was looking like the service manager was doing a pretty good job of sorting out the issues and I personally would give him the benefit of the doubt. In his mind he may have thought he told you what he was doing or "assumed" you understood that he was going to drive it to get more data. The really STUPID thing the dealership did was treat you the way they did, they obviously have little to no clue how to manage customers. Had the GM simply gotten the service manager on the phone and had him apologize to you for not thoroughly explaining what he was doing I'm sure your blood pressure would have dropped, the GM could extricate himself from the situation and the service manager would learn that he needs to be more explicit when talking to customers. What happened is a classic case study in how NOT to manage customer complaints and I agree 100% that it should be raised to the owner personally and rationally, business man to business man. I do not, however, agree that at this point you should become adversarial with the service manager and yank the vehicle and take it to another shop unless you want to start all over again AND risk the infamous "they all do that, it's normal" diagnosis.
Well put.
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  #44  
Old 04-17-2011, 09:41 PM
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Re: It's Official, I Regret My Purchase

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjw930 View Post
I'm certainly not saying the way the GM treated you was acceptable but it's not uncommon for the service manager to take a vehicle with driveability problems home, especially if he lives far enough away to really give it a test. The "problem" here is he didn't communicate that to you and get your permission. Based on the updates prior to this it was looking like the service manager was doing a pretty good job of sorting out the issues and I personally would give him the benefit of the doubt. In his mind he may have thought he told you what he was doing or "assumed" you understood that he was going to drive it to get more data. The really STUPID thing the dealership did was treat you the way they did, they obviously have little to no clue how to manage customers. Had the GM simply gotten the service manager on the phone and had him apologize to you for not thoroughly explaining what he was doing I'm sure your blood pressure would have dropped, the GM could extricate himself from the situation and the service manager would learn that he needs to be more explicit when talking to customers. What happened is a classic case study in how NOT to manage customer complaints and I agree 100% that it should be raised to the owner personally and rationally, business man to business man. I do not, however, agree that at this point you should become adversarial with the service manager and yank the vehicle and take it to another shop unless you want to start all over again AND risk the infamous "they all do that, it's normal" diagnosis.

I understand what your saying, but I think I would still take the vehicle to another dealer. If the service manager already said he felt the shudder why does he need to drive it anymore until a repair is made? The other thing is the service manager is not the one normally that is going to troubleshoot it. It would normally be the drivetrain tech. This problem is a known issue it's not like they are trying to find something they never heard of before. I also disagree that it's common for dealers to do this. When my vehicle was in for weeks I had a concern they would want to drive it home, but they never did it's against policy. When someone takes it home you don't know what they are doing with it or who is driving it and how they are driving it.
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  #45  
Old 04-17-2011, 10:24 PM
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Re: It's Official, I Regret My Purchase

Techs taking a customer's vehicle home for some real-life testing in not all that uncommon. Usually it's a sign of dedication to getting the job done well, but they absolutely, postively should ask your permission first.
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  #46  
Old 04-18-2011, 05:17 PM
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Re: It's Official, I Regret My Purchase

I took the advice of some on this forum (thanks for all the feedback) and had already thought about it Saturday afternoon. I was able to track down the owner of the dealership and left him a voicemail at his other business first thing this morning. As I got off the phone with his answering machine the service manager called me. He said he heard I had come by Saturday looking for my car and apologized that it wasn’t there. He said he took it because they wanted to continue to build data around the problems. He told me based on the data Chrysler determined that my drivetrain control module is the wrong one and outdated. It is causing the software to engage the drivetrain/4WD improperly. He said they think that makes sense based on what I see and feel. He verified everything I said about the car and what it was doing. He felt it all. Thank God.

He said he heard I talked to Dan, that it was heated, but didn't know the details. He said Dan was really putoff by my voicemail from two weeks ago. I said, Ok let’s say that my voicemail was rude. Don’t you think it warrants a call back? The service manager said that he stepped in at that point and told Dan he would take care of it. I said, Ok well a big part of my problem is with my sales guy who told me that there are loaner cars available at this dealership during negotiations. That is a big part of what I called to tell him. We would never be having this conversation if had been honest because I wouldn’t have bought the car. It's that big a deal to me. I was certainly unhappy on the service side but Dan needed to know about my experience from the beginning. I told him I am glad he stepped in but if Dan was hurt or angry he still should have picked up the phone. We agreed he should stay neutral since Dan was his boss.

The service manager believes my car should be fixed mid-week. He thinks this will take care of it all but said they have one more contingent from Chrysler if it is still problematic.

As I got off the phone with him the owner called me back. He said he was aware of the voicemail because Dan had called him and told him about it today. I believe that means Dan expected me to escalate this and wanted to head me off at the pass. The owner said that Dan is a standup guy and that my voicemail put him off. He said my voicemail was disrespectful. I said, “Ok. Let’s assume that you are correct and my voicemail was disrespectful. Wouldn’t you think someone who is so upset that they left a voicemail informing you that they are unhappy enough to warn people against coming to your dealership deserves a call back? Wouldn’t you like to know why? Aren't you guys curious about how I got to that place?” I also told him that the service manager has been a standup guy. He is an excellent service manager and I appreciate all of his help. I said he should be commended for his effort. He told me the service manager is new but he really likes him. He told me that Dan has worked for him for six years and he is a stand-up family man. He said he has never been disrespectful and takes care of everyone at the dealership (including the janitor). He said that if there was a pattern of complaints it would be different. (I interpret that to mean I am an irrational jerk of a customer). He also reminded me that they don’t make the cars. (Really? A statement like that just pisses me off. If you sell it, stand behind it. If you don't want to stand behind it, close your doors. My company uses a lot of components we don't make but I sell them with others we do. If the customer has a problem with something it's on us. We may go back to the supplier but I would never tell a customer, "Well, we don't make that. So don't blame us." What a cop out!) I told him that Dan was a little different than he described on Saturday. I said, “I went up to get something from my car Saturday afternoon and the vehicle wasn’t there. All I wanted was for someone to tell me where my car was. Since nobody could help me I asked for Dan because he is seemingly in charge. Before Dan knew who I was he told me, ‘I don’t have time for you.’ Then when he found out who I was he told me, ‘I have a word of advice for you, don’t start out a voicemail with… blah blah blah. I don’t have time for you.’ Even if I was an angry customer screaming profanity in your showroom that is still unacceptable behavior from a GM. They are in the GM position because they are supposed to rise above any situation. I am a sales manager for a manufacturing company. If a customer left me the voicemail I left Dan I would be mortified and call them back. I would want to know what made them so upset because it would have to be a really bad set of circumstances. I would want to know about it so I could do everything within my power to turn a warning to others into a referral source to many. The first thing I would do is tell them how sorry I am. If a sales rep EVER said what the GM said to me on Saturday I would fire him on the spot. Even if he was a superstar, he’d be gone. No questions asked. It’s your business and I am not going to try to tell you how to run it. I appreciate the call back, it means a lot. But as a Sales Manager I would want to know about this, and I thought you should know about my experience. What you choose to do with it is up to you. But again, I appreciate the call back. It speaks volumes about the type of business person that you are to even pick up the phone.” He said he’d talk to Dan but he really appreciates my business and that they’ll get my car fixed. He never apologized for any of this. Nobody has ever apologized for any of this.

So I think I have the answer that I need (he backed his GM). It is basically what I expected. At least I did my part. In this 5 months of hellish vehicle ownership I have encountered others who have stopped going to this dealership for reasons similar to mine. It's not me, but if they want to believe it is - ok. Ignorance is bliss. But if this GM is half the guy the owner says he is I would think he would call me back to clear up the misunderstanding... We'll see.

On the service side I want to give a huge amount of credit to the service manager and tech who helped with this. It sounds like the tech does not get paid for this type of above and beyond diagnosis. That is wrong on so many levels. Their extra effort found, in my eyes, a huge flaw with my vehicle. I may still have a huge beef with the front end of the business and I wish the back-end had told me they were taking my car for the weekend BUT they really, really stepped up. I will never forget that, because given the tone of the leadership at this business, they were both empowered to ignore drivetrain complaints.

On the car front I have to admit I am very unhappy. I have driven around this thing for nearly 7,000 miles with the wrong computer? I don't know enough about that particular module. I have no idea what kind of impact that has had on the car. I don't even know what to ask about possible excessive wear and tear or future problems. All I know is that it scares me, especially when I reflect on the total vehicle repairs to date. In 4.5 months its needed a new side view mirror (it was defective), a new amplifier (it fried itself), two new blower motors (so I'm told), a new rear flipper window, key fobik batteries (or a new fobik?), a front tweeter speaker, front axle isolators, and now the drivetrain control module (DTCM). What did they build an Overland with Laredo parts? Holy crap! I know sometimes one or two things get missed. It happens. But all of this on one freaking car? Ugh! It scares me for my future with this car.

Bottom Line: Where's the "undo" button; I wish I hadn't bought this car. I would never buy another car from this dealership and would not recommend anyone else do so. I might give the Service Manager a shot again but I would always be concerned about the two at the top. I will probably never buy another Chrysler product again. It would be great if someone would take a look at this situation from start to finish and try to do something to make this right (in my world that is exactly what I would do). Even with a fixed car supposedly on the way I have endured far more than any one person should reasonably have to. Perhaps my expectations are simply too high for the new Chrysler.
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  #47  
Old 04-18-2011, 06:34 PM
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Re: It's Official, I Regret My Purchase

Wow - I just committed to purchase a 2011 Overland with the 5.7. I am extremely concerned, and since I haven't signed I'm seriously reconsidering.

I know it's a new car, and with all I've heard I was willing to take the risk. After hearing this, $45K is a big risk.
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Old 04-18-2011, 06:55 PM
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Re: It's Official, I Regret My Purchase

litespeedz: I don't think your expectations are too high. However, this is just the way things are at many dealerships - Chrysler or other brands. Sorry to hear about all your troubles.
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