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  #13  
Old 02-10-2011, 07:35 AM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

Virginia Lemon Law Statutes

Their defense would be proving that the problem does not "significantly impair the use, market value, or safety of the motor vehicle" which I bet they could successfully do.

Lemon laws usually only cover problems where the vehicle is inoperable or unsafe. i.e., if the vehicle has an unfixable problem, but it's still capable of getting you safely from point A to point B, then lemon law usually doesn't apply. Virginia's law seems to lean that direction, too.
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Old 02-10-2011, 07:48 AM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

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Originally Posted by dicephalous View Post
Well, I don't think they are going to issue bulletins if they don't have a part to fix the problem. That's probably why no one's heard of it. The torque converter I had replaced, had metal shavings and was scored on the interior according to my service reciept. Certainly some kind of issue there.
And I don't see how a mount would fix a shudder which is clearly felt only during certain speeds, shifting, changes on uphill and downhill slopes, and gets more violent when weight is added to the vehicle. Clearly it is related to the powertrain itself.

Another member of this forum just had his isolators replaced only to get the vehicle back and still have the shudder.

Metal shavings in the TC = metal shavings in the transmission. You might have more issues down the road if you keep this vehicle. (the filter/magnet will pick up most of the debris but not all)
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  #15  
Old 02-10-2011, 09:25 AM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

I had the isolator replaced with no success.

I also questioned the dealer about long term issues arising from this issue, they gave the scripted answer that they have 100,000 mile powertrain warranty that would cover any of those problems.
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  #16  
Old 02-10-2011, 12:43 PM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

Wow, I am shocked by reading this and so many questions come to mind. It also makes me really paranoid. How in the world do they have two torque converters for this car? Is that two torque converters for V8 4x4 or V8 QDII? Does this mean they are finally acknowledging that something is wrong? And what is the difference between the old and the new? How do they plan to roll this out to existing owners? Will there be a formal recall?

I am not too worried about them taking these things apart and putting them back together. At least it is all fairly new and corrosion or stripping bolts is unlikely. It is all designed for repair and replacement. But I hadn't thought about the Torque converter causing problems for the transmission. Yikes!

When I took mine in (twice) the dealer told me that "Let the torque converter get through it's 6k mile break-in period. This is all normal. You are well within the 36k miles and 100k miles warranty. So don't worry." Why do I feel like if my car (which has some similar weird issues with shudder and downshifting / acceleration) has to go through these replacements I will be compelled to buy the Chrysler extended warranty to make sure that I don't pay for this down the road?

Has anyone heard from Milous on this issue? He always seems to have the inside scoop on these things. I would be curious to hear what Chrysler is planning to do about this.

Good luck with the lemon law. I think you'll have more luck getting them to swap it for something new.
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  #17  
Old 02-10-2011, 03:56 PM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

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Originally Posted by lweisenb View Post
Michigan's law is similar but you are responsible for use (not sure how that is calculated)
it is based off of the miles used. so the longer he keeps it the less they wll refund. like a pro rated tire warranty
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Old 02-10-2011, 04:25 PM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

Yeah i knew it was based on time/miles, just not sure how its calculated. (ie. is it .20/.50 per mile, 1/10000 of vehicle purchase price per mile, etc.)
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Old 02-10-2011, 04:40 PM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

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Originally Posted by lweisenb View Post
Yeah i knew it was based on time/miles, just not sure how its calculated. (ie. is it .20/.50 per mile, 1/10000 of vehicle purchase price per mile, etc.)
i would bet it is something like purchase price / 36,000 miles * miles used, if i had to guess
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Old 02-10-2011, 04:50 PM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

I find this all very interesting considering I thought the 5.7L drivetrain, including the transmission were brought over directly from the RAM pickups. It seems odd that WK2's would see a problem that hasn't been widespread on the Ram's. The 5.7L and 545 trans are one of the few things in this "totally redesigned" Grand Cherokee that aren't new!

If it's load related then mine will get a dose real quick when I hook up my 5000 lb enclosed trailer and haul it 3000 miles in April..........

Edit: I did some quick digging on dodgeforum.com and the stutter issue is widely know and Dodge does not have a fix at this point. Seems to be 4X2 or 4X2 (rules out the transfer case isolators) and is most pronounced when it's in MDS mode. That might explain why there's a new TC coming out since it might be an issue on their entire 5.7L MDS Hemi lineup. http://dodgeforum.com/forum/4th-gen-...rom-dodge.html
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  #21  
Old 02-10-2011, 04:58 PM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

I would be careful. I went through a lemon law case back in Fl. In 2001. I bought a new chevy S10 blazer and sometimes it would not start or it would just plain die while I was driving it. It took over a year to get it solved. During that whole time I was forced to drive a car that at any time would die on me. Finally when GM admitted there was a problem the deducted miles and wear and tear on the vehicle. They didn't deduct miles when the problem started it was when I turned it in. I had it die on me when it had less than 50 miles on it (less than 24 hours of ownership). When I turned it in it had around 12,000 miles on it. They ending up deducting just about what I owed on it after making payments on it for over a year. And when it was all said and done I got about $200.00 back. I paid over $7,000 in payments over the year. I lost $6800.00 on the deal.
I was very upset and swore to never buy or drive another GM product again.
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  #22  
Old 02-10-2011, 04:58 PM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

Actually just googled michigan, the manufacturer has the option to replace your vehicle or your can demand a refund minus the usage cost which is (the mileage at your first report of the problem/100000) * purchase price.

florida as stated above is total miles are return time /120000 * purchase price
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  #23  
Old 02-10-2011, 05:43 PM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

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Originally Posted by mjw930 View Post
I find this all very interesting considering I thought the 5.7L drivetrain, including the transmission were brought over directly from the RAM pickups. It seems odd that WK2's would see a problem that hasn't been widespread on the Ram's. The 5.7L and 545 trans are one of the few things in this "totally redesigned" Grand Cherokee that aren't new!

If it's load related then mine will get a dose real quick when I hook up my 5000 lb enclosed trailer and haul it 3000 miles in April..........

Edit: I did some quick digging on dodgeforum.com and the stutter issue is widely know and Dodge does not have a fix at this point. Seems to be 4X2 or 4X2 (rules out the transfer case isolators) and is most pronounced when it's in MDS mode. That might explain why there's a new TC coming out since it might be an issue on their entire 5.7L MDS Hemi lineup. http://dodgeforum.com/forum/4th-gen-...rom-dodge.html
Mate, this same shudder issue has been a bug-bear right through the original WK too with this driveline. There's no need to include Rams, there's a TON of info on here about it in the WK area

That is why many of us who own or owned WK's with the Hemi, are so looking forward to a completely new transmission, as after six + years of trying, they haven't been abl;e to cure the problem.
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Old 02-10-2011, 05:50 PM
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Re: Stuck between Jeep and a hard place.... lemon law time.

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Originally Posted by Marlin View Post
Mate, this same shudder issue has been a bug-bear right through the original WK too with this driveline. There's no need to include Rams, there's a TON of info on here about it in the WK area

That is why many of us who own or owned WK's with the Hemi, are so looking forward to a completely new transmission, as after six + years of trying, they haven't been abl;e to cure the problem.
I read references to the issues with the WK but since very few in this section of the forum seemed to be making the link I went looking to someplace where the engine/trans package is more widely used and is subject to higher loads to see if there were any similar complaints.

I'll admit I'm brand new to Jeep and for that matter Chrysler products. Although I've owned over 40 different cars and trucks in my adult life none of them have ever been Jeep or Chrysler products. Staying mostly in this section of the forums you can see how it would seem like it's only a WK2 problem and one that people seem surprised about.
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