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  #13  
Old 09-11-2014, 12:40 PM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

Yeah -- real simple, and >$10K later....If it were simple, why was their an "install team"?

Great choice in gear. I bet it sounds great. I wouldn't say upgrading the Alpine system is "simple" for anyone. Simple = swapping some coaxials in, + sub + amp, and "go". That's not possible here.

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  #14  
Old 09-11-2014, 04:39 PM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

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Originally Posted by kkreit01 View Post
Yeah -- real simple, and >$10K later....If it were simple, why was their an "install team"?
Greetings,

As I said in the writeup, I did not what to be bothered by car install and I do not have the time work on it even if I wanted to.

The hard part was saving up for this and getting the gear over a course of 2 plus years.

Best for now.
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  #15  
Old 09-16-2014, 10:16 PM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

do you have a wiring diagram of how things come out of the head unit? I'm wondering how wires are sent to all 19 speakers of the HK system. 19 channels, or 7.1 channels then split by cross overs at each location. Wondering if doing a wireline to 5VA to amp to better speakers would be good. I could through in a parametric EQ to flatten things out and control the sub better. As much as I would love to do a full system overhaul like you did, I'd like to keep my head unit from the Summit and just change the speakers out while gaining fine control over the EQ. Right now I'm at 0/9/9 and am happy with it with SD/USB/Pandora App. SXM still sounds like ass and HD Radio somehow has added sibilance to make it sound more "HD" so I need to turn down the treble to 5 when I'm on HDRadio.
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  #16  
Old 09-17-2014, 12:11 AM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

Quote:
Originally Posted by frydryce View Post
do you have a wiring diagram of how things come out of the head unit? I'm wondering how wires are sent to all 19 speakers of the HK system. 19 channels, or 7.1 channels then split by cross overs at each location. Wondering if doing a wireline to 5VA to amp to better speakers would be good. I could through in a parametric EQ to flatten things out and control the sub better. As much as I would love to do a full system overhaul like you did, I'd like to keep my head unit from the Summit and just change the speakers out while gaining fine control over the EQ. Right now I'm at 0/9/9 and am happy with it with SD/USB/Pandora App. SXM still sounds like ass and HD Radio somehow has added sibilance to make it sound more "HD" so I need to turn down the treble to 5 when I'm on HDRadio.
Greetings,

I have posted the reply over at the HK thread for others to share. I hope you do not mind.


From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System

Best for now.
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  #17  
Old 09-17-2014, 10:53 PM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

Nice setup and a great writeup. I bet it sounds excellent, but I would not consider it simple especially if there is a changeout of the HU. Installation behind the seats takes precious cargo space and takes away the fold-down utility.

I would be perfectly happy with HK/Summit quality sound in my Overland.
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  #18  
Old 09-17-2014, 11:14 PM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chieftain View Post
Nice setup and a great writeup. I bet it sounds excellent, but I would not consider it simple especially if there is a changeout of the HU. Installation behind the seats takes precious cargo space and takes away the fold-down utility.

I would be perfectly happy with HK/Summit quality sound in my Overland.
Greetings,

Thanx.

I considered the impact on the fold-down utility and finally went for it. It does limit me a little. The cover is constructed very well and I have put my portable table saw on it with no problem. This was part of my sacrifice for achieving my goal. I have not tried a heavy miter saw on it yet. I did wish the JGC had more for me to use.

The bottom line in terms of simplicity, I am used to dealing with a large amount of audio equipment and the various methods of connecting them up. In the future, more amps will have built-in DSP units which allow for far less equipment. However, the price will be high for a while.

There are many ways one can improve the sound in Alpine system. Their are a couple of great threads here on how they did it. Being an audiophile, I just went all out.

Best for now.
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  #19  
Old 10-08-2015, 10:49 PM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

1stJeepGC, your system looks awesome. It's the best designed system I've seen in all the hunting I've done on replacing the WK2 Alpine system. I also think you give excellent advice in other audio threads.

Based on your advice and my research, I believe HATs are definitely the best choice for speakers. I would like to replace some of the Alpine speakers in my Altitude to start with and see how it goes from there. Down the road I may replace the amp/dsp.

I have a couple of questions. Do you see any issues with going a little higher is the lineup, as in Unity or Clarus components for the front doors and tweeters and still running off the Alpine amp? It's not that big a jump in price from the Imagine speakers I was considering. The Unity/Clarus lines have slightly smaller tweeters which I think would be almost a perfect fit in the existing cutouts. I also don't mind investing in slightly higher end for the long term.

Would a HAT L32V 3.7 work as replacement for the centre speaker and do you think either of the two HAT 8" subs would work in the Alpine enclosure? I've purchased some Dynamat which I'm planning on using on the enclosure.

That would be my Stage 1. Appreciate any advice you can provide.
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  #20  
Old 10-09-2015, 08:51 AM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

Greetings,

It is just about 2 years now that I had installed the HAT's and I fully happy with my decision. The main reason that I finally settled on the HAT was the tweeter, L1 Pro R2. As I have stated many times here, the JGC for an SQ surround system only needs one (1) pair of tweeter. This tweeter has great imaging and in particular, the off-axis is greatly improved.

Now, in regard to your situation, the Stage 4 Clarus, IMHO, to get the full potential will require amplification. With out application, the tweeter should be fine, but the mid bass punch will be lacking. It very well be that in your taste, the mid bass is good enough for you until you decide to go for the next stage.
The Unity is also the same thing. It comes back to the mid bass punch. In this case I do believe that the OE amp should have an easy time with this one.

As you go up the line with HAT with the mid bass drivers, the faster the mid bass attack happens. So the key here is determine which driver meets your music genres. How loud you want to play it with out losing the sound quality. Remember these drivers are not for the SPL pounding.

On the to the center channel speaker, the L3V2 is a good match to either one of the Stage 3 or 4 lines. I would wait until you upgrade the DSP/AMP first. As you have read from my other posts also, the key to the surround is taming the L/C/R which the OE system does allow you to do. If you go for it now, it is no doubt an improvement over the junk that is it now.

Based up on your proposed setup, in your next stage, I have been recommending to go with DSP/Amp combos. Look into the Helix P - 6. This an excellent unit to configure the fronts and subs while integrating into the factory DSP to maintain the surround sound. This is the fine tuning that I always talk about. Unless you can get a MS-8 on e-bay really cheap and do the configuration like I did. That is a budget issue.

Helix P SIX DSP 6-channel car amplifier with digital signal processing €” 120 watts RMS x 6 at Crutchfield.com

I am most likely to install this some time next year.


Ok, now the sub question. When I looked at the factory enclosure when it was finally out, I am still not convinced that it can get now to the low frequencies. Now, many here have done various improvements and they are happy with it. Some have done the mods and later brought the Stealthbox. The 8 inch HAT will be looking for power. To me, a sub should not sound like a mid bass speaker. It should get down low and just touch the beginning part of the mid bass frequencies. I would wait until you get the money to this stage correctly.

Best for now.
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  #21  
Old 10-09-2015, 08:19 PM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

1stJeepGC, Thanks for the great advice. I will follow your advice and not move too quickly on replacing some of the speakers, like the sub, without better amps.

I am intrigued by your comments on the tweeters you went with, the L1 Pro R2. Would they be a consideration for a starting point on a staged upgrade. I'm just wondering how much better they are than the other lines and would they work OK in the Alpine system if I was to buy just those to start. That might be most of my Stage 1 budget, but the Alpine tweeters to my ears are probably the weakest link.
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Old 10-09-2015, 09:55 PM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

[QUOTE=David360;1227553]

I am intrigued by your comments on the tweeters you went with, the L1 Pro R2. Would they be a consideration for a starting point on a staged upgrade. [QUOTE]

Greetings,

That is a very good question.

When I ran all the HAT's off the factory DSP/AMP and the new Pioneer HU, you could hear the difference which was night and day. With me, it did not sound right because of the way it was setup via the factory system and the way I love to here my music (BTW, which is many different types).

Once you get them, you are committed to get the center channel next which will be the L3SE. This will match the timbre to the tweeter. The upper mid range frequencies will blend in perfectly. I do not know if the sell single of this, unless you can get a dealer to get for you.

It is very possible at this point you could get them into your budget. I would give 12 Electronics a call and find out about getting a single L3SE. If you play thru good sources and not SirusXM, it might good enough for you to get by. Remember you and I hear sound differently. Your concept of starting with tweeters is right. The question is could you hold out to the next stage.

Hybrid Audio Legatia SE Speaker Systems

With that being said, the next phase will be the 6.5 drivers. You could continue with the HAT's for this one. Or, you get another raw driver from another manufacture. I was pleasantly surprised once the L6SE broke in, the amount of air it pushes. A high quality DSP unit will able to adjust crossover points and filters to achieve the running. In any event, you are now committed to get the aftermarket DSP and amplification. As you know, wave good bye to the green stuff at this point.

On the other hand for next phase could very will be a new headunit. If the Maestro iDatalink is out working by then, I would go for a Kenwood Headunit. Then you system will really start to come a live. Their is a thread here that goes talks about the Maestro or call them and get an update. They are extremely friendly to talk to.


My philosophy is the front stage of a surround sound system has to be done correctly in order to appreciate it. It is about the balance and separation of the channels to create the wall of sound. If done incorrectly, it will sound like 3 mono channels.

The off-axis results of the L1 Pro R2, IMHO is worth it. The tweeter takes advantage of the front windshield and windows for the sound effect. So, think about this carefully before you pull the trigger.

Best for now.
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http://www.jeepgarage.org/f155/2011-...ver-79121.html
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  #23  
Old 10-10-2015, 01:17 PM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

Thanks for the further insight. I think the L1 Pro R2 tweeters will be a good investment to start and I agree I should pull the trigger on the L3SE at the same time.

Fortunately, we have a HAT dealer here in Canada that lists exactly the same prices as 12 Electronics in Canadian funds with free shipping. I'll phone them and see if they can sell a single L3SE.

FYI, I do play through a good source, a 6th Generation iPod Touch, loaded with mostly HQ albums ripped from CD to Apple Lossless or purchased from iTunes. Like you, it's many different types of music.

I'll let you know my impressions when I get the stuff and get in in. I'm sure it will sound great.
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Old 10-12-2015, 07:20 PM
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Re: 2011 Alpine simple make over

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Originally Posted by 1stJeepGC View Post
Greetings, Part 4

The tweeter had to be modify by trimming the ring in order to get into the OEM enclosure. We put a black speaker cloth as the finishing component.

Front Tweeter





Best for now.
Appreciate your very detailed posts on your installation.

Do you think it would be at all possible to install the tweeters without trimming the ring? From the mechanical drawings it looks like the threaded portion should fit through the OEM opening with just the ring sitting outside the enclosure, although hanging over to some degree. Since I'll be doing the install DIY I'm a little reluctant to start trimming the tweeters myself.
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