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  #325  
Old 05-08-2015, 12:38 PM
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I'm sure they have a contract otherwise when jeep is fw us to HERE, HERE would say that the model is not supported. But the silence definitely proves a confidentiality clause on the contract.

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  #326  
Old 05-08-2015, 01:32 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee Map Update

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Originally Posted by silvermax04 View Post
I agree a 1-1.5 year lag as a "normal" for indash maps is bullshit but that is often ( not always) the approximate update cycle on these indash systems throughout the auto industry. Fighting an update cycle like that you are taking on nearly all manufacturers and that is a much larger issue but i agree it is definitely an issue.
To be honest, that's typical for even standalone GPS systems aside from high profile upgrades.

Unless you're in South Texas where they start roads, only to have them end randomly, 1 - 1.5 years is going to be pretty accurate. The trouble starts when you get beyond that since you go into a second or even third construction season.
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  #327  
Old 05-08-2015, 01:58 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee Map Update

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Originally Posted by 1stJeepGC View Post
Greetings,

One of the things that elude me, is what percentage of Jeep owners lease and what percentage are have purchased their Jeeps. Then you have take those of who purchase their Jeeps and figure what percentage will trade them in a within 4 to 5 years. When all those figures are determine, it should represent a small number of purchasers who will be stuck with on going problem, the minority. With a vast majority who upgrade thru a lease or a trade-in which my include going to another brand all together. Does this majority reflect the opinion that the problem will be solved with a most recent year model? That is why I have always called this a niche problem.

I find it interesting when you here how people upgrade and find themselves in the same predicament. With even stories how the system became worse. Does anybody know if the 2015 models are facing the same problem down the road? History has a tendency to repeat itself.

I still think the mindset of FCA affects everybody across the board whether if you are a short-term or a long-term owner. Forget about cause and effect with the GPS, it matter's the most on sales figures for new cars delivered. Is FCA telling us that an in-dash system is just for show with an extra admission ticket tacked onto your purchase or lease price and if you want a better guidance system use either a PND or a smartphone?

Best for now.
granted the economy is much stronger now and so people are buying much more frequently but the average ownership of a NEW car was 71.4 months in 2012:
Average length of U.S. vehicle ownership hit an all-time high - Kelley Blue Book

(this link actually has month numbers in the 90's for 2013 and 2014: http://www.autonews.com/article/2014...ty-study-says_

so i really dont think the majority lease or dump the cars in 2-3 years and dont notice this nonsense. JMHO
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  #328  
Old 05-08-2015, 02:06 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee Map Update

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Originally Posted by Jakkall View Post
I'm sure they have a contract otherwise when jeep is fw us to HERE, HERE would say that the model is not supported. But the silence definitely proves a confidentiality clause on the contract.
You mean a message something like this?

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Product Not Found

The product you requested, could not be located.
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  #329  
Old 05-08-2015, 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted by NetworkTV View Post

To be honest, that's typical for even standalone GPS systems aside from high profile upgrades.

Unless you're in South Texas where they start roads, only to have them end randomly, 1 - 1.5 years is going to be pretty accurate. The trouble starts when you get beyond that since you go into a second or even third construction season.
I get new upates for my garmin about quarterly and my freebee navigation app for my phone it prompts me to download a new 2GB map database about monthly. Roads my not have a lot of changes from 1 month or quarter to the next but POIs in the map data base can and do change frequently. My portables have always been more reliable than my vehicles but 3 year old maps with this jeep takes the cake I've never seen a gap like that before for any.
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  #330  
Old 05-08-2015, 02:20 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee Map Update

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Originally Posted by silvermax04 View Post
I get new upates for my garmin about quarterly and my freebee navigation app for my phone it prompts me to download a new 2GB map database about monthly. Roads my not have a lot of changes from 1 month or quarter to the next but POIs in the map data base can and do change frequently. My portables have always been more reliable than my vehicles but 3 year old maps with this jeep takes the cake I've never seen a gap like that before for any.
I'll grant you, my phone has updates at least once a month. My Garmin GPS, while usually at least every 6 months, would go as long as a year between updates.

I think the difference is in what the models cover.

For example, phone-based units often have traffic info and speed camera information while standalone models don't often include that except on higher end units.

The Nav system in the Jeeps can do that stuff, but only if you continue to subscribe to the traffic data, which I believe is part of the XM subscription.
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  #331  
Old 05-08-2015, 02:32 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee Map Update

Here is the Consumer Reports response I received today from my email. Its just a form response but maybe it will spark a little interest from someone there. The more they hear it the better so if anyone has time to send one to them it may help.


Thank you for taking the time to contact Consumer Reports®. I want to express how much we value your choice of our products and services to help you make informed purchasing decisions.

As you know, monitoring and promoting both the quality and safety of automobiles is an integral part of our mission. We value your help in this effort. You have provided us with important feedback on your 2014 Grand Cherokee, for which I thank you. I have forwarded your correspondence to our Auto Test Division and Editorial Staff for their review and consideration for future reports. I am sure that they, too, will find your experience to be of value.

You may also want to share your experience with the following organizations, which may be able to provide you with information and/or offer assistance:

• Center for Auto Safety (CAS), 1825 Connecticut Ave, NW, Ste. 330, Washington, DC 20009-5708. The CAS compiles information on defective automobiles, ranging from transmissions problems to paint problems. If you wish, you may send them a letter sharing your experiences with them. Should they have any information on your particular automobile, they will forward it to you, along with helpful information and advice within 10 days from date of receipt of their letter. They ask, but do not require, a $.60 SASE to help keep their costs down. Or you can visit their website at The Center for Auto Safety.

• Council of Better Business Bureaus, Inc. at 4200 Wilson Boulevard, Arlington, VA 22203; 1-703-276-0100. The council of Better Business Bureaus, the umbrella organization for the BBBs, also provides programs and publications for consumers, and helps to settle disputes with automobile manufacturers through the BBB Auto Line program.

• National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, 1200 New Jersey Avenue SE, West Building, Washington, DC 20590, 1-888-327-4236 or 1-202-366-0123. The NHTSA assures compliance by domestic and foreign motor vehicle and equipment manufacturers with motor vehicle safety standards, automobile recalls, and airline problems. You may wish to visit their Website at Home | National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), where you will be able to obtain information on air bags, child safety seats, and automobile crash test results. You can also search through an extensive list of automobile and automobile equipment recall notices, and report any problems that you have encountered with your automobile.

• Your State Attorney General’s Office, which resolves individual consumer complaints, conducts informational and educational programs, and enforces consumer protection and fraud laws. You can find their telephone number in the blue section of your telephone book or by visiting the following URL: http://www.naag.org/current-attorneys-general.php.

Consumer Reports is committed to making your experience positive and informative.

Sincerely,

Rachel Thompson
Representative
Customer Relations Department
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  #332  
Old 05-08-2015, 02:44 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee Map Update

Lots of thoughts- bear with me- feel free to ignore. ;-)

I don’t think the status of HERE in regards to being sold really matters at all. As someone posted above all the GM vehicles got upgrades before the timeframe we are in. Its not HERE, in general, that is an issue. Something else is going on. (PS- latest bit is US silicon vallery companies like UBER are looking to buy HERE- apparently that’s why the German car companies are banding together- they are afraid of someone buying HERE and then abandoning the car companies access to the date in the future)

As far as upgrade system problems- I think someone posted above that the Australian version got a map update- so the hardware is updatable. Something else is going on.

As far as memory size- I honestly do not believe there is a difference in the memory or the CPU of the 2014 vs 2015. My reasoning is the folks that have hacked the units have said it’s ‘the exact same hardware’. Others have posted that there is no way it’s the same since it’s a totally different model number and not just a change from AA to AB or something. My guess is the hackers are able to run some linux commands on the thing and can get a report of the hardware that the QNX os can see. Probably something else is different like the modem chipset or the GPS or something like that- but I’d guess the memory and CPU for the touchscreen bits are the same. All a guess but see no reason for the hacker folks to lie to us. I wish I had the cash to buy a new one and an old one to disassemble on a bench and look at the chips myself- but just don’t… Also the original hardware had 16GB for storage. Poking around Garmins website looks like the map updates are in the 1-4GB range.. Probably something else is going on.

Even if the memory is somehow too small- the thing is essentially a tablet- it can handle USB and SD cards and there’s even access to a USB harness inside the dash if need be to hide things from the end user. So they could “expand” the memory easily enough if that were the real hold up. Probably something else going on.

If it’s a distribution issue- then they just need to hire a real bandwidth provider. The current system to get uconnect updates might as well be a string and 2 cans. Download an app to download software? What is this, AOL? Force people to click through security warnings? Are you nutz? Just post it on a stinking FTP site and let people download. Most people with a 40+K vehicle with Nav are going to have broadband. For the few that don’t - offer a USB drive in the mail for another $10. Figuring this out- certainly could be the issue- it since they are so incompetent at delivering Uconnect updates in general and those aren’t even half a GB.

As to why they (HERE) only offers updates every 12-18 months in general- I think it’s purely marketing. It seems from the file naming and other devices supported by HERE that at a minimum they cook the data quarterly. It might even be “live”- hec you can edit Google’s data yourself, wait a few days for someone to verify it, and then see it live on your smartphone/desktop/whatever all within a matter of a week. I don’t see why HERE wouldn’t have similar ability to have live data themselves. So they probably have data all the time that is newer. BUT think about it- they love charging us 100-200 bucks for updates. How are they going to see you an update for $149.99 today when in three months it will be out of date? You’ll be pissed. So they make it 12-18 months so just enough streets change that you get annoyed and can’t take it anymore and buy it at that rip off price. Then they wait around so as not to piss you off looking for another $150 in 3 months more. It’s an artificial thing they invented to tweak supply and demand in their favor and maximize their profits.

Just my guesses- i know nothing.

Anyway- I can’t wait for Android Auto so I can just use my almost real time updated, free, google nav with traffic on my built in screen…
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  #333  
Old 05-08-2015, 03:46 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee Map Update

So, I always check this thread hoping to see some news on an update, but it just keeps getting more depressing. Aspects of the nav system are really my only complaint with this truck, everything else is amazing. When I first saw the Jeep nav I loved its user interface and was really hopeful that without a disc based system and the ability to update via SD card or flash drive that we would see updates even more often. Man has it been disappointing to see it be the total opposite! I live in Los Angeles where the roads don’t change much, so this hasn’t affected any routing for me yet, but still.

I actually work on testing and updating nav systems for another automaker so I am especially critical of these things. The nav on the Jeep is actually one of the things I was originally excited about. The nav from the automaker I'm with hasn't changed their user interface in 10 years and feels so old and dated. We only come out with updates once a year and we are well aware that that is too long in today's world of instant updates to free cell phone navigation maps. We consider cell phone navigation our competition, not other car navs, and are doing constant research and comparisons to see how we can improve. But part of the problem is that there are literally hundreds of decision makers up the chain.

As someone who is in the industry I know that FCA has all the latest data. Hell I have all the latest data from Nokia and TomTom on my office computer. They release it every quarter and it is not hard to get. It is up to FCA to take that data and merge it with other 3rd party data (POI’s, Freeway diagrams, traffic info, apps, etc...) into their own software and user interface. Then it must be field tested for accuracy, before being released. It is a long and expensive process which is why updates usually only happen once a year. The updates may all be sold through navigation.com or Here, but the updates are created by each auto manufacturer since clearly there is more to the software updates than just new road data.

Anyway none of this explains why FCA is going on 3 years with no updates. Whatever the problem is, this process should have been thoroughly vetted before they ever installed the first one. I really wish FCA would just explain what their technical difficulty is with getting the new updates out instead of acting like there is no problem.


I posted a complaint on the Facebook page, and I guess I will write one of those letters also.
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  #334  
Old 05-08-2015, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by cfwarren3 View Post
So, I always check this thread hoping to see some news on an update, but it just keeps getting more depressing. Aspects of the nav system are really my only complaint with this truck, everything else is amazing. When I first saw the Jeep nav I loved its user interface and was really hopeful that without a disc based system and the ability to update via SD card or flash drive that we would see updates even more often. Man has it been disappointing to see it be the total opposite! I live in Los Angeles where the roads don’t change much, so this hasn’t affected any routing for me yet, but still.

I actually work on testing and updating nav systems for another automaker so I am especially critical of these things. The nav on the Jeep is actually one of the things I was originally excited about. The nav from the automaker I'm with hasn't changed their user interface in 10 years and feels so old and dated. We only come out with updates once a year and we are well aware that that is too long in today's world of instant updates to free cell phone navigation maps. We consider cell phone navigation our competition, not other car navs, and are doing constant research and comparisons to see how we can improve. But part of the problem is that there are literally hundreds of decision makers up the chain.

As someone who is in the industry I know that FCA has all the latest data. Hell I have all the latest data from Nokia and TomTom on my office computer. They release it every quarter and it is not hard to get. It is up to FCA to take that data and merge it with other 3rd party data (POI’s, Freeway diagrams, traffic info, apps, etc...) into their own software and user interface. Then it must be field tested for accuracy, before being released. It is a long and expensive process which is why updates usually only happen once a year. The updates may all be sold through navigation.com or Here, but the updates are created by each auto manufacturer since clearly there is more to the software updates than just new road data.

Anyway none of this explains why FCA is going on 3 years with no updates. Whatever the problem is, this process should have been thoroughly vetted before they ever installed the first one. I really wish FCA would just explain what their technical difficulty is with getting the new updates out instead of acting like there is no problem.

I posted a complaint on the Facebook page, and I guess I will write one of those letters also.
I agree and that is one of the most frustrating parts of this, i doubt any higher mamagement at FCA even knows its an issue, customer service just shuts it down and it goes no where. I asked to have this refered to management and i was left a voicemail by FCA customer service mamagement, you would have thought i was asking them to install vynal siding on my house. Just this disbelief that i would even suggest that they need to look into the issue. They just maintained they absolutly have nothing to do with this and of course left no call back information. The only way i think we can hope for upper management to here about this is if it shows up on Consumer Reports or auto week or something like that or if one of our letters manages to bypass the road block customer service department and make it to a higher level manager.
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  #335  
Old 05-08-2015, 04:52 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee Map Update

There is no way that upper management has no idea about this. If we went 3 years without an update at my Automaker there would be a shitstorm. The Navigation departments involve hundreds of workers across several different departments at locations all around the country. Upper management not only knows what is currently going on, but is also constantly worrying about what to do with the navs 3-5 years in the future.

The real problem, other than the crazy delay, is how they have directed customer service to deal with the issue and the lack of a press release explaining the problem. Completely unacceptable, and at some point they will begin to lose customers if this continues.
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  #336  
Old 05-08-2015, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by cfwarren3 View Post
There is no way that upper management has no idea about this. If we went 3 years without an update at my Automaker there would be a shitstorm. The Navigation departments involve hundreds of workers across several different departments at locations all around the country. Upper management not only knows what is currently going on, but is also constantly worrying about what to do with the navs 3-5 years in the future.

The real problem, other than the crazy delay, is how they have directed customer service to deal with the issue and the lack of a press release explaining the problem. Completely unacceptable, and at some point they will begin to lose customers if this continues.
Well that is good to hear but it means that FCA customer service is utterly clueless and disconnected or intentionly lying, both unacceptable
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