From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System - Page 9 - Jeep Garage - Jeep Forum

Go Back   Jeep Garage - Jeep Forum > Jeep Platform Discussion > Grand Cherokee - WK2 - > Audio/Visual/Navigation

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
  #97  
Old 09-10-2014, 08:47 PM
1stJeepGC's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2011 3.6L WK2
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NYC Area
Posts: 1,632
Thanks: 245
Thanked 204 Times in 181 Posts
Rep Power: 27455
1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute
Re: From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System

Quote:
Originally Posted by Radknight View Post
How much data does streaming Spotify or Pandora through your phone use? We don't get any apps for the Jeep in Australia, except SRT, so I wouldn't mind trying this.
Greetings,

I average between Pandora, Aupeo and Spotifiy around 6-8 GB per month. Then again, I have Sprint here in the states as my carrier with the unlimited plan.

Best for now.

__________________
Laredo X, Trail Rated, QTii, Sele-Terrian, Quadra Lift, Off-Road Adventure Package ii, GY 265/60/R18 Duratrac, (Retired Nokian Rotiva AT after 57.6K will miss them), Tow, AFE CAI, DiabloSport inTune 1000-DCX, Custom Sound System ( HAT speakers, JLAudio , Pioneer , JBL MS-8 & RF 3.sixty.3 -- see the writeup link below for more details)

http://www.jeepgarage.org/f155/2011-...ver-79121.html
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #98  
Old 09-10-2014, 08:59 PM
silvermax04's Avatar
Senior Member
My Jeep: 2014 5.7L WK2
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,544
Thanks: 286
Thanked 624 Times in 485 Posts
Rep Power: 30676
silvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radknight View Post
How much data does streaming Spotify or Pandora through your phone use? We don't get any apps for the Jeep in Australia, except SRT, so I wouldn't mind trying this.
I use my work phone so have never looked at how much data.it use but will check next time
Reply With Quote
  #99  
Old 09-10-2014, 09:15 PM
1stJeepGC's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2011 3.6L WK2
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NYC Area
Posts: 1,632
Thanks: 245
Thanked 204 Times in 181 Posts
Rep Power: 27455
1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute
Re: From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaetone View Post
Itll be crazy if xm is that off..


Positive Energy Activates Constant Elevation- PEACE
Greetings,

The OEM SirusXM tuner is not the same caliber of the aftermarket 200 series they sell. In fact, if you try the online service it sounds whole lot better. For tuning purposes with the HK system, if you do not have the CD Player, use the SD card for your reference music. If you still have any Original Masters labels around and/or Telec, then that is the way to go.

Till this day, I do not understand why they put a coaxial midrange/tweeter combo right next to your ear for the front and rear. Personally, I am not a fan of JBL speakers. In your case, since you are so used to top of line Near Field Speakers in the studio, the HK system most likely will drive you crazy if you do not find the eq spot you looking for. The way I see it now from everybody's reports, the xover in the HK is balance incorrectly to handle off-axis response and the eq can not really compensate for those settings.

The LOGIC 7 is designed to be a 7.1 channel system. I believe they did not extend it to 11.1. Which now means, are the time delays in the OEM DSP really designed for us or just to make the average listener feel it sound great.

BTW, I do not have the HK system, I used to have the Alpine and then everything went into storage.


Best for now.
__________________
Laredo X, Trail Rated, QTii, Sele-Terrian, Quadra Lift, Off-Road Adventure Package ii, GY 265/60/R18 Duratrac, (Retired Nokian Rotiva AT after 57.6K will miss them), Tow, AFE CAI, DiabloSport inTune 1000-DCX, Custom Sound System ( HAT speakers, JLAudio , Pioneer , JBL MS-8 & RF 3.sixty.3 -- see the writeup link below for more details)

http://www.jeepgarage.org/f155/2011-...ver-79121.html
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #100  
Old 09-10-2014, 10:29 PM
Premium Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 270
Thanks: 85
Thanked 18 Times in 15 Posts
Rep Power: 1362
Kaetone is on a distinguished road
From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System

Im gonna map it out when i get home to see how far out it is from me.. I was planning on using the manhattan dealership to be honest just out of convenience.. I wanted to show the car salesmen there that price i got in from tysons corner wasnt bogus lol..


Positive Energy Activates Constant Elevation- PEACE
Reply With Quote
  #101  
Old 09-11-2014, 10:45 AM
Premium Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 270
Thanks: 85
Thanked 18 Times in 15 Posts
Rep Power: 1362
Kaetone is on a distinguished road
From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1stJeepGC View Post
Greetings,

The OEM SirusXM tuner is not the same caliber of the aftermarket 200 series they sell. In fact, if you try the online service it sounds whole lot better. For tuning purposes with the HK system, if you do not have the CD Player, use the SD card for your reference music. If you still have any Original Masters labels around and/or Telec, then that is the way to go.

Till this day, I do not understand why they put a coaxial midrange/tweeter combo right next to your ear for the front and rear. Personally, I am not a fan of JBL speakers. In your case, since you are so used to top of line Near Field Speakers in the studio, the HK system most likely will drive you crazy if you do not find the eq spot you looking for. The way I see it now from everybody's reports, the xover in the HK is balance correctly to handle off-axis response and the eq can not really compensate for those settings.

The LOGIC 7 is designed to be a 7.1 channel system. I believe they did not extend it to 11.1. Which now means, are the time delays in the OEM DSP really designed for us or just to make the average listener feel it sound great.

BTW, I do not have the HK system, I used to have the Alpine and then everything went into storage.


Best for now.


And the problems begin.. They need to do an update so that they can have a proper eq with a few baselined presets.. I mean why have such a "great speaker array" and put a 3 band EQ.. I mean i understand keeping it simple but come on


People enter your life for 1 of 2 reasons.. Either to be a Blessing or a lesson.
Reply With Quote
  #102  
Old 09-16-2014, 11:08 PM
1stJeepGC's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2011 3.6L WK2
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NYC Area
Posts: 1,632
Thanks: 245
Thanked 204 Times in 181 Posts
Rep Power: 27455
1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute
Re: From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System

Greetings,

This came from anther thread, "2011 Alpine simple make over" and it would be a good idea to post it here in this thread for my reply.


On 09/16/2014 this was posted by member FRYDRYCE:

"do you have a wiring diagram of how things come out of the head unit? I'm wondering how wires are sent to all 19 speakers of the HK system. 19 channels, or 7.1 channels then split by cross overs at each location. Wondering if doing a wireline to 5VA to amp to better speakers would be good. I could through in a parametric EQ to flatten things out and control the sub better. As much as I would love to do a full system overhaul like you did, I'd like to keep my head unit from the Summit and just change the speakers out while gaining fine control over the EQ. Right now I'm at 0/9/9 and am happy with it with SD/USB/Pandora App. SXM still sounds like ass and HD Radio somehow has added sibilance to make it sound more "HD" so I need to turn down the treble to 5 when I'm on HDRadio."


MY REPLY:

For the wiring diagram, check out the following link:

http://www.wk2jeeps.com/audio/2014_w...io_diagram.pdf

This should be the HK system and as always verify the speakers with a tone generator at the amp side.

As for the HK system, I have never really heard it for me to give a full evaluation. Since we are dealing with the LOGIC 7, I strongly believe this is a 7.1 system design that is split across the range using the active (electronic) crossover and time delays for each speaker. I do not think they extended to an 11.1 design because traditional above 7.1 is based on overhead designs for the movie sound effects.

Granted that I might be a nut when it comes to audio, their are always ways to do systems on the simple side to get excellent results. As I have posted for years on the Alpine system, if you want to keep the surround sound, then it does get to become a headache.


Based on conversations here on the forum with other HK owners, IMHO, I believe the 2 biggest problems come from the midrange speaker on the front door which is a coaxial next to the shoulder and by your ear as well. The tweeter for the rear door which is right in back of your ear is the 2nd problem. Since this system is tuned for the general masses, the time delays are not balanced correctly in this area. This would definitely interfere with any tuning attempts. As I recommended to another member here with the HK system, disconnect these speakers first and try the OEM eq again to find a proper sound setting. For some, this would be enough and for others like you and I, it would not be good enough.

To change all the speakers and to improve the sound is going to be a full aftermarket change which is what you are trying to avoid. Based on your plan, I would attack this 2 or 3 ways which you could do in phases. This depend if you what to replace the sub now or later after your determination. You must keep in mind that playing with OEM eq will cause problems with the aftermarket setup.

To get started the front stage needs to complete changed out with new speakers and electronics in order for you to get the flat response you are looking for. This is accomplished by summing the front signals (and the sub if you are doing it now) into a DSP that meets your needs (that includes amps with built-in real time DSP units ). The question now becomes do I want to bring back the LOGIC 7? And to do that, would be the JBL MS-8 like I did. Now you have complete control over the front stage and tune the wall of sound correctly.

If you feel that this single step solves your problems, then you are good to go as they say. Otherwise, change the remaining speakers to match which will be an significant improvement over the OEM. These speakers will be powered by the OEM system. Most likely, the aftermarket speakers you choose, their is a good chance that you would not have any equalization for the rear door and rear pillar. IMHO, the OEM DSP is good enough to handle this from it's predetermined settings. If you want, you could and amps, but that drives up the cost.

The front stage and the subwoofer has to be tamed. This is why your approach and philosophy is correct. I am not and never was a big fan of JBL speakers in car, home and even the pro lines. Here in the JGC, Harman put to much hi frequency's in the coaxial's and to many tweeters for such a small enclosure. The extra money that I spent for my one pair of tweeters is all I needed for my sound quality.

Best for now.
__________________
Laredo X, Trail Rated, QTii, Sele-Terrian, Quadra Lift, Off-Road Adventure Package ii, GY 265/60/R18 Duratrac, (Retired Nokian Rotiva AT after 57.6K will miss them), Tow, AFE CAI, DiabloSport inTune 1000-DCX, Custom Sound System ( HAT speakers, JLAudio , Pioneer , JBL MS-8 & RF 3.sixty.3 -- see the writeup link below for more details)

http://www.jeepgarage.org/f155/2011-...ver-79121.html
Reply With Quote
  #103  
Old 09-17-2014, 07:44 AM
1stJeepGC's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2011 3.6L WK2
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NYC Area
Posts: 1,632
Thanks: 245
Thanked 204 Times in 181 Posts
Rep Power: 27455
1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute
Re: From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System

Greetings,

Just as followup to my previous post, I had a conversation from another member that zero in that many of the sources of the OEM headunit is the start of the problem. The CD player and the USB sources are the best for sound performance from a source. I should have mentioned also this in the previous post, that this could be a problem for some. In general many OEM head units do not match or come close to the average aftermarket HU. Over the years here in the forum, I have mentioned this regarding other Uconnect head units.

In member's FRYDRYCE post to me regarding using parametric eq, this is also a technique that helps clean the signal. The proper way to do it as of now while still maintain the 8.4, IMHO, would be the JL Audio Cleansweep system and to sum a full range signal. The down side to this is the cost of all the aftermarket equipment needed for the perfection or close to perfection of a sound quality system.

Because, you are taking the output from the JL Audio into another DSP for your xover points, time delay and eq. Then into the amps and speakers. Thus the extra cost.

Best for now.
__________________
Laredo X, Trail Rated, QTii, Sele-Terrian, Quadra Lift, Off-Road Adventure Package ii, GY 265/60/R18 Duratrac, (Retired Nokian Rotiva AT after 57.6K will miss them), Tow, AFE CAI, DiabloSport inTune 1000-DCX, Custom Sound System ( HAT speakers, JLAudio , Pioneer , JBL MS-8 & RF 3.sixty.3 -- see the writeup link below for more details)

http://www.jeepgarage.org/f155/2011-...ver-79121.html
Reply With Quote
  #104  
Old 09-17-2014, 04:58 PM
Overlandone's Avatar
Member
My Jeep: 2014 3.6L WK2
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Queenz NyC
Posts: 135
Thanks: 23
Thanked 17 Times in 15 Posts
Rep Power: 1181
Overlandone is on a distinguished road
Garage
Re: From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1stJeepGC View Post
Greetings,

Just as followup to my previous post, I had a conversation from another member that zero in that many of the sources of the OEM headunit is the start of the problem. The CD player and the USB sources are the best for sound performance from a source. I should have mentioned also this in the previous post, that this could be a problem for some. In general many OEM head units do not match or come close to the average aftermarket HU. Over the years here in the forum, I have mentioned this regarding other Uconnect head units.

In member's FRYDRYCE post to me regarding using parametric eq, this is also a technique that helps clean the signal. The proper way to do it as of now while still maintain the 8.4, IMHO, would be the JL Audio Cleansweep system and to sum a full range signal. The down side to this is the cost of all the aftermarket equipment needed for the perfection or close to perfection of a sound quality system.

Because, you are taking the output from the JL Audio into another DSP for your xover points, time delay and eq. Then into the amps and speakers. Thus the extra cost.

Best for now.
I've been following all your posts from different threads and see that you have lots of knowledge with stereo systems. I see you live in nyc and I also live in queens nyc , do you have a stereo shop?
__________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] 2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland V-6 Max Steel, Indigo blue/brown interior:thumbsup:
Reply With Quote
  #105  
Old 09-17-2014, 06:28 PM
1stJeepGC's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2011 3.6L WK2
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NYC Area
Posts: 1,632
Thanks: 245
Thanked 204 Times in 181 Posts
Rep Power: 27455
1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute1stJeepGC has a reputation beyond repute
Re: From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System

Quote:
Originally Posted by Overlandone View Post
I've been following all your posts from different threads and see that you have lots of knowledge with stereo systems. I see you live in nyc and I also live in queens nyc , do you have a stereo shop?
Greetings,

I know this shop for over 27 years now. Ask for either Jr. or Benny.
They are the one's who did my install.

Exotic Audio Boutique
Address: 156 3rd Ave, Brooklyn, NY 11217
Phone: (718) 625-4742

https://www.facebook.com/EAB156

Best for now.
__________________
Laredo X, Trail Rated, QTii, Sele-Terrian, Quadra Lift, Off-Road Adventure Package ii, GY 265/60/R18 Duratrac, (Retired Nokian Rotiva AT after 57.6K will miss them), Tow, AFE CAI, DiabloSport inTune 1000-DCX, Custom Sound System ( HAT speakers, JLAudio , Pioneer , JBL MS-8 & RF 3.sixty.3 -- see the writeup link below for more details)

http://www.jeepgarage.org/f155/2011-...ver-79121.html
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to 1stJeepGC For This Useful Post:
  #106  
Old 09-19-2014, 02:01 PM
Premium Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 270
Thanks: 85
Thanked 18 Times in 15 Posts
Rep Power: 1362
Kaetone is on a distinguished road
From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System

Quote:
Originally Posted by silvermax04 View Post
There is part of your issue XM sound is awful. Use a well recorded SD card and report back. You will likely hear a big difference. good luck

Silvermax you were right! The sound quality in some of those xm channels are off.. I put various types of music on a sd just so i can cross reference them and the quality was amazing!.. Dramatically different.. Definitely got to appreciate the system.. My rear left door speaker is definitely blown.. Some songs you cant hear it others are very obvious.. Thanks for the input.. Now i need to purchase a lock pick lol


Positive Energy Activates Constant Elevation- PEACE
Reply With Quote
  #107  
Old 09-19-2014, 07:19 PM
silvermax04's Avatar
Senior Member
My Jeep: 2014 5.7L WK2
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,544
Thanks: 286
Thanked 624 Times in 485 Posts
Rep Power: 30676
silvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond reputesilvermax04 has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaetone View Post

Silvermax you were right! The sound quality in some of those xm channels are off.. I put various types of music on a sd just so i can cross reference them and the quality was amazing!.. Dramatically different.. Definitely got to appreciate the system.. My rear left door speaker is definitely blown.. Some songs you cant hear it others are very obvious.. Thanks for the input.. Now i need to purchase a lock pick lol

Positive Energy Activates Constant Elevation- PEACE
Great! It is sad how bad XM can make that stereo sound. Try streaming pandora through bluetooth on your phone that sounds good also, i use that alot. Just make sure to set it to enhanced sound quality in the settings.

Dealer should take care of that speaker just dont hesitate to walk away from a dealer and go to another one if you have issues, a lot of rotten jeep dealers out their you just got to find a good one. They built mine with one speaker wrong color and they changed it out no problem.
Reply With Quote
  #108  
Old 09-21-2014, 02:01 AM
Radknight's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2014 6.4L WK2
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 500
Thanks: 11
Thanked 46 Times in 41 Posts
Rep Power: 8883
Radknight has a reputation beyond reputeRadknight has a reputation beyond reputeRadknight has a reputation beyond reputeRadknight has a reputation beyond reputeRadknight has a reputation beyond reputeRadknight has a reputation beyond reputeRadknight has a reputation beyond reputeRadknight has a reputation beyond reputeRadknight has a reputation beyond reputeRadknight has a reputation beyond reputeRadknight has a reputation beyond repute
Re: From the horses mouth on the Harman Kardon System

First off, I don't want to turn this into a negative post. I'm just trying to separate marketing spin from real specs.

I've been searching around for how much actual wattage the HK amp has and how much power is supplied to each channel, with no success. To make things even more confusing check this out from the HK website:

"Jeep‘s 1st high voltage GreenEdge Class-D amplifier with tracking power supply and 900 watts equivalent* total output"

See the asterisk there? They don't follow up. Anybody got any suggestions?

Harman Kardon + JEEP
__________________
2014 SRT -Bright White/Sepia/Pano/HK/Spidermonkeys/Tow/Tint/Injen CAI/CLS Mod/Lower Grill Badge/Rear Muffler Delete
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
30 more horses BIGAL Grand Cherokee - WK2 - 2 11-24-2011 09:08 AM
SRT Harman Kardon premium audio system Milous Audio/Video/Navigation/Alarms 11 07-11-2011 06:52 PM
unlock a few horses 95_V8_ZJ Grand Cherokee - ZJ 14 01-04-2011 06:09 PM
How to increase horses? Danco Engine Performance/Intakes/Exhausts 4 11-16-2010 09:00 PM

» Premium Vendor Showcase
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:22 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2012 - JeepGarage.Org
The Jeep Grand Cherokee Owners Community

JeepGarage.org is in no way associated with or endorsed by FCA US LLC. Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep, Ram, Mopar and SRT are registered trademarks of FCA US LLC.