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  #181  
Old 02-07-2013, 09:45 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

In about 2008 I went to England and rented a manual Ford Mondial diesel. This car was sweet. It got about 55mpg on the hwy. We went forever on a tank and it had plenty of power and rode like no other ford I'd ever seen. It was a BMW killer.. It got voted by more than one mag as car of the year that year. I'm sure it's still great. I'd seriously consider buying that car...

But, for example, the BMW diesel was not available in AWD and was so expensive when we bought our 328xi... And, more importantly, the diesel in the US got about 35 mpg to our 28-30 in a gas vehicle. As gas is cheaper it negated any benefit and was way more expensive (and not available with AWD)... USA is way behind europe and the world, I know.. If they put the small diesel in that 3 series in the US I'd have gotten one. Instead, they homologated one engine for the US and it was their SUV (X5) engine...

I think the small diesels really benefit from manual trans, as do small gas engines. Slushboxes steal all the power and fun. That's yet another reason USA doesn't have them... we don't like to drive. ; )
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  #182  
Old 02-08-2013, 01:07 AM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

The following is what I was able to find in my GC manual. The manual covers all engines including the 3L CRD. I didn't expect much because the manual is designed for Aussie export vehicles:

Generic to all engines:
"Extreme Cold Weather (Below -20F or -29C)
...use of an externally powered electric engine block heater... ...is recommended"

Specific to the diesel:
"Cold Weather Precautions
Operation in ambient temperatures below 32F (0C) may require special considerations...
Greater than -7C(20F) use No.2 Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel Fuel
Between -7C(20F) and -29C(-20F) use No.2 Ultra Low Sulfur Climatized Diesel Fuel
Below -23C(-10F) use No.1 Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel Fuel
"No.1 Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel Fuel (ULSD) should only be used where extended arctic conditions (-10F/-23C) exist.

"NOTE:
  • Use of Climatized ULSD or No.1 ULSD results in noticeable decrease in fuel economy.
  • Climatized ULSD is a blend of No.2 ULSD and No.1 ULSD which reduces the temperature at which wax crystals form in fuel."
"Engine Idling - In Cold Weather
Avoid prolonged idling in ambient temperatures below 0F(-18C). Long periods of idling may be harmful to your engine because combustion chamber temperatures can drop so low that the fuel may not burn completely. Incomplete combustion allows carbon and varnish to form on piston rings and injector nozzles. Also, the unburned fuel can enter the crankcase, diluting the oil and causing rapid wear to the engine."

Has this scared you off?

BTW, I took the Jeep (3L CRD) for its first long run over the last couple of days. With a full tank, I drove till the fuel light come on and then some. I got 1,003km(623miles) out of it. Fuel consumption showed up as 8.0L/100km (~29.4mpg(US)) but I hadn't zeroed it when I filled up so it's probably not accurate. I think I put in about 85L into a near empty tank. The nominal capacity of the tank is 93L (24.6gallons(US)). I've done 12,000km now and the tailpipes are still pristine, no ash, no soot, no oil.
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  #183  
Old 02-08-2013, 02:09 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

In the US the diesel at the pumps is automatically switched over to winter blend in colder climates. I can attest that gas mileage drops noticeably when the fuel switches over, which usually occurs in November here in Wisconsin anyway.
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Old 02-08-2013, 02:34 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

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Originally Posted by weck View Post
In the US the diesel at the pumps is automatically switched over to winter blend in colder climates. I can attest that gas mileage drops noticeably when the fuel switches over, which usually occurs in November here in Wisconsin anyway.
How much is "noticeably"?
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  #185  
Old 02-08-2013, 04:41 PM
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  #186  
Old 02-08-2013, 08:20 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Between 5 and 10 percent, closer to 5 from the fuel alone, when it gets really cold drops further but then again, same with my gas car there.
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Old 02-09-2013, 05:56 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

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Originally Posted by BobT View Post
Diesel, get used to it! See, GM Brings European Diesel Engine to U.S. for Cruze - Bloomberg . They don't say who will be making the engine, only that it is designed in Italy and will be built in Germany. VM Motori don't make a 2L CRD but both Fiat (owner of Chrysler) and GM own VM Motory 50/50. GM has other diesel links in Europe so whoever builds it, there is likely to be quite a bit of shared technology.
As a result of the GM-Fiat divorce, GM got rights on 1.3L and 2.0L Fiat diesel engines, and Fiat got $2 billion. Fiat will buy GM's stake in VM Motori in the next 12 months. GM will continue diesel R&D in GM Powertrain Torino, Italy and GM Diesel Korea.

Euro Chevy Cruze - VM Motori 2.0 (1991 cc) diesel built in Korea.
US Chevy Cruze - Fiat 2.0 (1956 cc) diesel MultiJet1 built in Keiserslautern, Germany.

Fiat engines come with MultiJet II. Fiat 2.0L MultiJet II will probably find its place in 2014 Jeep Cherokee and 2015 Chrysler 200.

MultiJet
MultiJet - 5 injections per cycle
MultiJet II - 8 injections per cycle
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  #188  
Old 02-10-2013, 11:29 AM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

2 liter in 5k # vehicle? Or just the mjII?

So we dont know if the 2014 has 5 or 8 ips? I thought this engine was already in use elsewhere.

Ps new hybrid vw looks to kick their diesels butt per r and t... At least in mixed driving mpg and performance.
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  #189  
Old 02-10-2013, 12:09 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

2014 Grand Cherokee 3.0 VM Motori with MultiJet II
2014 Cherokee (Liberty successor) 2.0 Fiat with MultiJet II (still officialy export only)
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  #190  
Old 02-10-2013, 01:28 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

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Originally Posted by 1973Commando View Post
I read somewhere the maximum was B5, just like my 2009 Jetta Diesel. Since I see B20 so rarely I don't worry about it. Although, it is getting more common and I have put 60 gallons of it in my motorhome with out noticing until I was done. I actually didn't know until now my Cummins ISL was compatible with B20. Though, I probably wouldn't run with it all the time, in my TDI or GC EcoDiesel, because of the requirements of the manufacturer. There are additives that might help the situation. They are constantly testing and working on a day when Biodiesel won't be a problem. In older, pre 2007 vehicles biodiesel makes for less pollution. The new diesels expel hardly any particulates into the air. It will be nice someday to have the choice to be carbon neutral.

This is quoted from the owner's manual for the 2014:

"This vehicle is compatible with biodiesel blends greater than 5% but no greater than 20% biodiesel meeting ASTM specification D-6751 provided the shortened maintenance intervals are followed as directed."

I really want to know more about the diesel's cold weather performance. I can handle the extra cost, cost of service, regeneration, making sure I have the right oil, etc. but we live in Nebraska where at times it drops to near and below zero and are considering moving the Wisconsin where it is below zero quite often In the winter. I will have the engine block heater and it will be garaged but if it's sitting out all day while at work the last thing I want to worry about is the car not starting. Any more real world experience people from the North would care to share?
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  #191  
Old 02-10-2013, 03:42 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Have a TDI, live in Wisconsin, car is not garaged. No issues starting whatsoever down to about -7 F so far.

The gentleman from northern Ontario a page or two back seemed to indicate around -20 F being where he has had issues w/out a block heater going.

-20 actual temp (not the exaggerated windchill numbers) is damn cold, I think I remember only a handful of times in the 37 years I've lived here that it got that cold.

Non issue, I'll stay home in that kind of weather....
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Old 02-10-2013, 04:28 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

I am from Lincoln and live in Denver... temps don't get below zero too often in either location -- although they do get there. I am getting a CRD and I won't worry one bit about it....

Think about it this way -- when you get to -10, -15, -20 below zero you're probably going to want to use a block heater no matter what engine you have. If it gets colder than these temps both engines are going to have trouble starting.

These are modern diesels -- they aren't going to design an engine that doesn't start when it gets a little cold.

If it were me I would block out the temperature/starting debate when choosing between the CRD and HEMI.
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