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  #49  
Old 01-26-2013, 01:58 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

I'm with the "drive them all and buy what you like" crowd.

Do the math on the fuel economy. I did the math and with the 70 cent per gallon premium for diesel around me, it'd take like 200-300k miles to make up the difference in purchase price. This was on a Touareg diesel, so your numbers may factor out differently, but the reality is due to the extreme price increase for diesel vs gas it takes a long time to pay off another large price increase for the diesel engine.

The diesel will not be as fast as the Hemi. I know Australia and Germany have incorrect times listed on their sites, but that may be done to push people towards diesels (a trial run for the US - aka Jeep's major market). That said, because of the torque, diesels never feel like they're struggling like the v6 does. FWIW, neither does the Hemi.

The Hemi sounds good, is quiet when driving, and can actually get decent fuel economy depending on the situation. I average 21 highway around here with lots of hills and some elevation (1000-6000 feet). In Florida I consistently got 24mpg. Mine's an '11 V8 4x4 Overland, so not a light vehicle by any means.

Diesels are wonderful and all, but I would not pay more for one than for a great V8. The Hemi has been around a long time and is proven to be reliable and powerful. The diesel is going to enter major production for the first time now (sorry foreigners, but the reality is your markets combined aren't the size of the US market for Jeep).

I would buy a Touareg diesel, or a Mercedes diesel. In fact both were high up on my list of competitors for the Jeep before I bought it.
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  #50  
Old 01-26-2013, 04:33 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

The CRD from the WK are a good engine with some Little issues, the CRD from the WK2 and also from the 2014 are a very good engine and complet diffrent.

the wk1 crd are the "old" Mercedes benz 320cdi engine om642 from 2005

the newer CRD are a complet new built engine from VM motori from italy.

i know many guys with the new wk2 and the crd engine and all are very very happy with the engine.
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  #51  
Old 01-26-2013, 04:48 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

I AM aware of the cheap fuel (gas especially) in the US... That's why I asked you... In UK it's closer to 9$/gal last time I went there. That's why $/mile is all that really matters for comparisons.. That and cost of the car.

The "ancillary" heater of which I wrote is to heat the cockpit when cold. I'm not even sure there is one in the US 2014, but someone said here that there is... Diesels generally can't heat up at idle, so you either have one or you start your drive cold. I have 2 small kids, and it was -22F air temp here last week. I like cars that heat up quickly. Not a deal breaker... but it gets old hearing "daddy I'm cold" every morning.

The point I was making is Diesels are great and getting even better, but I don't think they are more reliable any more than gas engines, especially a Jeep V8. They probably have the same overall issues with maintenance and longevity - basically both should last the life of the vehicle at least and both need their TLC.
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Old 01-26-2013, 05:59 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Just drove a Taureg TDI for reference... I'm still grinning from the useable power. I need to go drive a Hemi again and compare, but I was very very impressed with the engine. Only thing I didn't care for was the lag, but I've driven a turbo before.

Still not sure I don't want a Hemi though.
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  #53  
Old 01-26-2013, 08:34 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

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Originally Posted by KR_Denver View Post
Just drove a Taureg TDI for reference... I'm still grinning from the useable power. I need to go drive a Hemi again and compare, but I was very very impressed with the engine. Only thing I didn't care for was the lag, but I've driven a turbo before.

Still not sure I don't want a Hemi though.
The Touareg TDI is a gem. Actually, that whole truck is great. I'd have bought one if they had offered the cooled seats in the US (sadly they wanted that for Audis and Porsches I guess).

If you liked the power of the TDI, you'll LOVE the power in the Hemi. It's got the same low end grunt, plus more power up high. The VM Motori engine makes a lot of torque, but its still only 230hp(240PS).
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  #54  
Old 01-26-2013, 09:42 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

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Originally Posted by FAUEE View Post
If you liked the power of the TDI, you'll LOVE the power in the Hemi. It's got the same low end grunt, plus more power up high. The VM Motori engine makes a lot of torque, but its still only 230hp(240PS).
Playing in both the Hemi (I test drove a 2013 Overland Hemi this weekend) and a BMW X5 35d (Same, tried out one today), the diesel had a alot more umph at the higher speeds. The Hemi kept haivng to shift down, rev up to go up the steep hills, the diesel, just.. well.. flew.

Off the line, the Hemi was faster, but in 0-60, honestly, without a stop watch, I don't think I could tell which was faster. They both fell into that 7-8 second range (just counting off 1 Mississippi, 2 Mississippi, etc...).

Payback on the CRD for me (in Seattle) versus the V8 is about 4 years/60k miles (I do about 15k miles a year) given todays diesel prices.

If they reduce the price of the CRD, or come out with rebates/incentives for the CRD (which, I suspect they will) it will cut that down even further.

At anyrate, drive em all, and then decide which works best for you, how you drive and how you live (and your budget).
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  #55  
Old 01-26-2013, 11:40 PM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

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Originally Posted by Temerarius View Post
Playing in both the Hemi (I test drove a 2013 Overland Hemi this weekend) and a BMW X5 35d (Same, tried out one today), the diesel had a alot more umph at the higher speeds. The Hemi kept haivng to shift down, rev up to go up the steep hills, the diesel, just.. well.. flew.

Off the line, the Hemi was faster, but in 0-60, honestly, without a stop watch, I don't think I could tell which was faster. They both fell into that 7-8 second range (just counting off 1 Mississippi, 2 Mississippi, etc...).
Interesting. My Hemi doesn't drop gears to go up steep hills. In fact it half the time doesn't even want to drop out of 4 cylinder mode.

The X5 35d is a great vehicle. I'm a big fan of its styling (especially in white). It's definitely more car than truck though, but truthfully that's what most people want. Same goes for the Touareg. I picked the Jeep because it felt more rugged and truck like, and they closed the BMW/MB dealership in town and I didn't want to have to drive an hour for service.
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:29 AM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

All the hemi needs is a tranny like BMW's, where you can tell it what gear to be in and it holds it. Then the hemi would actually use the torque down low that is does have.

If they did that with the 8 speed, heck, I'd buy an SRT...
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Old 01-27-2013, 01:27 AM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

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Interesting. My Hemi doesn't drop gears to go up steep hills. In fact it half the time doesn't even want to drop out of 4 cylinder mode.
I took them both up a street here in Seattle... E Roy. It's about a 26 degree slope.

If anything will make a rig down shift, that road will...
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  #58  
Old 01-27-2013, 03:11 AM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

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Originally Posted by KR_Denver View Post
Just drove a Taureg TDI for reference... I'm still grinning from the useable power. I need to go drive a Hemi again and compare, but I was very very impressed with the engine. Only thing I didn't care for was the lag, but I've driven a turbo before.

Still not sure I don't want a Hemi though.
I don't know what turbo arrangement the Taureg has but the VM Motori in the WK2s has a variable geometry turbo. The vanes change angle with the revs. A bit like a variable pitch prop. That way maximum efficiency is attained at all revs. I've never driven a turbo before I got the Jeep but really, I feel no turbo lag at all. The high low down torque also helps mask any lag. But then I got the Jeep for towing on and off-road and long highway trips, not for hooning around the burbs.
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  #59  
Old 01-27-2013, 06:39 AM
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The Touareg got the same Diesel engine like Audi (it's the 3.0 lt. V6 from Audi).

This engine got the Turbo (with Intercooler) with a variable geometry as well.

All modern Diesel got a Common-Rail System (btw. patented by FIAT!) for high pressure injection and most of them a variable Turbo from Garrett.
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:46 AM
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Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Thanks again and sorry for all the diesel noob questions, but here is one more.

While I do a lot of highway driving every week, I do live in the city. As in downtown-ish Denver. So I do a lot of city driving too. Any thoughts on how the DPF system (assuming it has one) is going to like that? Am I going to be dealin with the regeneration thing constantly? I guess a better question would be how much city driving does it take to clog the thing? Is once a month highway good enough? Once a week? Twice a day?

If you can't tell, I'm really clueless about diesels. Scares me, as I've always understood the vehicles I drive. Now I know how most of the people I've dated feel and why I have to take care of the vehicles.
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