Go Back   Jeep Garage - Jeep Forum > Jeep Platform Discussion > Grand Cherokee - WK2 - > Diesel Powered 2012+ Export Grand Cherokee

Join Jeep Garage Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
  #73  
Old 01-27-2013, 11:07 PM
1973Commando's Avatar
Premium Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Land O' Lakes, FL
Posts: 604
Thanks: 33
Thanked 32 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 1548
1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roki303 View Post
Actually I debate between V6 and diesel. Well ... for the same or better fuel economy you get more power than V6. Unfortunately, what's turning me away is:
- hefty price tag for diesel
- all the emission stuff - maintenance and reliability

Just cannot justify myself to jump into something untested here in the US and pay $4500 premium over V6 for just an engine. Adding 10% to the price of the car is just not worth the risk for me.

Personally I do think that Chrysler really is not planing (or cares) to sell a lot of those trucks. I think they just need diesel to offset CAFE and for marketing of 30 mpg SUV.
How many GC CRD's were sold in 2012? Does anyone know?
__________________

__________________
______________________________________
My Jeep:
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4X4 | Black, Inside and Out
5.7 liter HEMI | ORAII | Advanced Technology Package(w/ stop)

Reply With Quote
  #74  
Old 01-27-2013, 11:10 PM
1973Commando's Avatar
Premium Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Land O' Lakes, FL
Posts: 604
Thanks: 33
Thanked 32 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 1548
1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1973Commando View Post
How many GC CRD's were sold in 2012? Does anyone know?
I think since they have been so popular overseas they decided it was time to sell some here. I mean, they are building them anyway; add a few parts to make them legal here.
__________________

__________________
______________________________________
My Jeep:
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4X4 | Black, Inside and Out
5.7 liter HEMI | ORAII | Advanced Technology Package(w/ stop)

Reply With Quote
  #75  
Old 01-27-2013, 11:19 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 49
Thanks: 19
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 665
KR_Denver is on a distinguished road
Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roki303 View Post
Actually I debate between V6 and diesel.
I stand corrected.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roki303 View Post
Personally I do think that Chrysler really is not planing (or cares) to sell a lot of those trucks. I think they just need diesel to offset CAFE and for marketing of 30 mpg SUV.
I think you're probably right.


Here's some numbers for those of us at altitude:

Altitude HP/TQ

V8 360/390
6k ft 296/320
10k ft 252/273

V6 290/260
6k ft 238/214
10k ft 203/182

(from what I can gather on turbo diesels, full power up to around 10k ft, 3% loss per 1000 feet afer that, so this may be completely wrong, and please correct me)
Diesel 240/420
6k ft 240/420
10k ft 233/408

So if that's accurate, I don't know, it's pretty close between the diesel and Hemi. I'm not sure there's a clear winner for real world driveability.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #76  
Old 01-27-2013, 11:22 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 160
Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 1505
Husker4theSpurs has a reputation beyond reputeHusker4theSpurs has a reputation beyond reputeHusker4theSpurs has a reputation beyond reputeHusker4theSpurs has a reputation beyond reputeHusker4theSpurs has a reputation beyond reputeHusker4theSpurs has a reputation beyond reputeHusker4theSpurs has a reputation beyond reputeHusker4theSpurs has a reputation beyond reputeHusker4theSpurs has a reputation beyond reputeHusker4theSpurs has a reputation beyond reputeHusker4theSpurs has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Debating between V-6 and CRD myself
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #77  
Old 01-27-2013, 11:22 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 216
Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 1210
comnjeep is on a distinguished road
Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

From what i hear diesels are really good at city driving mpg. Will probably get close to 20 mpg city when in warm weather... Thats about 180% of what i get in my hemi. But i dont put many city miles on my cars.

As for diesels winning lemans? Well thats one series. The three diesels at daytona today all didnt finish, one didnt start. Doesnt mean much. Audi and peugot put huge $$$ into the series and it slants to diesels by rules. Some porsche p2 gas cars actually come close to them at some tracks. And lets try to find a sports car series with a diesel winner... How bout a sports car? audi still cant get one to work in their r8. I think they tried and it burst into flames... Lets stick to jeeps...

The modern diesels cant take bio diesel from what i hear, as was posted here.


And someone here says diesels are simpler than gas engines? Look at road and track this last edition, they explain why there are no diesel hybrids. Among other things, engine complexity and wt adds to cost. Modern diesels are a complex beast. They are tempting for mpg and torque, but not for me until gas is 5$.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #78  
Old 01-27-2013, 11:27 PM
Member
My Jeep: 2011 3.0L WK2
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Melbourne Australia
Posts: 25
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 1217
retired is on a distinguished road
Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Here in Australia the WK2 CRD has really taken off .. The WK2 CRD has been on the market since about June/July 2011 and still there is a 5/6 month wait .. granted that most CRD's sold in Australia are being used for towing ... also fuel prices here are more expensive than in the USA ... if I want a sports car I wouldn't buy a Jeep ... if I want to tow then the WK2 CRD Jeep is the bees knees ... Just go and take one for a test drive ..you wil be pleasantly suprised
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #79  
Old 01-27-2013, 11:29 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 216
Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 1210
comnjeep is on a distinguished road
Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Kr denver, i posted before i took my hemi jeep over vail pass probably at max cargo wt and with roof pod... It was so impressive, i had no power issues. Sure it was less than at sea level, but just fine.

I think turbos still have altitude issues. My wrx was a gas turbo and was equally effected by altitude as my other gas cars. Im not convinced turbos are fully immune to altitude. I had a boost gauge on it and it was down about 25% max boost at 10k iirc.

Still in denver, long commutes and mountains, id consider a diesel, but not this new one, id wait a year. So glad i did on my jeep until 2012. Good luck.
__________________
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to comnjeep For This Useful Post:
  #80  
Old 01-27-2013, 11:34 PM
Member
My Jeep: 2011 3.0L WK2
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Melbourne Australia
Posts: 25
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 1217
retired is on a distinguished road
Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

We don't have to worry about altitude Down Under ... Mount Kosciuszko is a mountain located in the Snowy Mountains in Kosciuszko National Park. With a height of 2,228 metres (7,310 ft) above sea level
can ride a pushbike to the summit ...
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #81  
Old 01-27-2013, 11:47 PM
1973Commando's Avatar
Premium Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Land O' Lakes, FL
Posts: 604
Thanks: 33
Thanked 32 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 1548
1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Quote:
Originally Posted by comnjeep View Post
From what i hear diesels are really good at city driving mpg. Will probably get close to 20 mpg city when in warm weather... Thats about 180% of what i get in my hemi. But i dont put many city miles on my cars.

As for diesels winning lemans? Well thats one series. The three diesels at daytona today all didnt finish, one didnt start. Doesnt mean much. Audi and peugot put huge $$$ into the series and it slants to diesels by rules. Some porsche p2 gas cars actually come close to them at some tracks. And lets try to find a sports car series with a diesel winner... How bout a sports car? audi still cant get one to work in their r8. I think they tried and it burst into flames... Lets stick to jeeps...

The modern diesels cant take bio diesel from what i hear, as was posted here.


And someone here says diesels are simpler than gas engines? Look at road and track this last edition, they explain why there are no diesel hybrids. Among other things, engine complexity and wt adds to cost. Modern diesels are a complex beast. They are tempting for mpg and torque, but not for me until gas is 5$.
At the 24 Hours of Le Mans, every year since 2006, a diesel has won.

At the 12 hours of Sebring Every year since 2006 except one, a diesel has won.

The first year(2012) of the "FIA World Endurance Championship" an Audi Diesel won. They raced three versions of their R18 diesels, finishing the season with the R18 e-tron quattro.

In 2013 the U.S. race is moving from Sebring to the new "Circuit of the Americas" in Austin, TX.
The "6 Hours of Austin" is Sept 22, 2013.

__________________
______________________________________
My Jeep:
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4X4 | Black, Inside and Out
5.7 liter HEMI | ORAII | Advanced Technology Package(w/ stop)

Reply With Quote
  #82  
Old 01-28-2013, 04:42 AM
1973Commando's Avatar
Premium Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Land O' Lakes, FL
Posts: 604
Thanks: 33
Thanked 32 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 1548
1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute1973Commando has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Peugeot doesn't race anymore at Le Mans. Today was the first time those Mazda diesels entered the Rolex 24. The French don't like Germans, I doubt they would slant things their way. Audi's had a long history of winning at Le Mans even before they introduced the Diesels. Switching to diesels didn't slow them down.

The Mazda's were never track tested until today; they are totally brand new.

The only way to make something work is to do it. If we never buy diesels then there never will be any. If we never try to increase MPG then we won't. If we never try to reduce engine emissions then we won't. If no one buys new and untested technologies then we won't have any new technologies. The WK2 Grand Cherokee CRD has been available since 2011. Why are they so popular in the rest of the world?
__________________
______________________________________
My Jeep:
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4X4 | Black, Inside and Out
5.7 liter HEMI | ORAII | Advanced Technology Package(w/ stop)

Reply With Quote
  #83  
Old 01-28-2013, 04:51 AM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 656
Thanks: 18
Thanked 12 Times in 12 Posts
Rep Power: 3602
Jamesla30 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesla30 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesla30 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesla30 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesla30 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesla30 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesla30 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesla30 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesla30 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesla30 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesla30 has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAUEE View Post
The Hemi has a range of over 500 miles on the highway. You're going to have to stop for yourself before you'd have to stop for fuel.

People keep bringing up the diesel as a power alternative. It's not going to be anywhere near as powerful as the Hemi. It's nearly 150hp less powerful than the Hemi, and only offers 10 torque more. And that torque is all down really, really low - it falls flat on its face when really pushed.

The diesel has its place, it's a great mix of towing torque and fuel economy. It's not going to be a speedster, those expecting it to perform like a Hemi are out of their minds, it's far more likely it will perform just above the normal V6 (which still has a nearly 70hp advantage over the CRD).

There's other factors that should come into play too. With the piss tank, you're most likely going to lose your spare tire and will have to use fix-a-flat and/or runflat tires. Said piss tank has to be refueled. Diesel production is far lower in the US than gasoline, so price increases for it are guaranteed to exceed that of gasoline as more demand for it is created (but not enough to warrant a new refinery). Heck, a lot of gas station don't even HAVE diesel.
I would have to strongly disagree... if you resrarch you will find out that from 0-60 the CRD performs just as well as the HEMI. Now race to 100 and the hemi will win but when will I ever do that in normal driving? HP is a marketing ploy... torque is not. People in the know want torque not HP.

I can almost guarantee they will position the piss tank to keep the full size spare. And yes it has to be refilled....about once a year and takes no more skill than filling windshield wiper fluid....whoopy-do.

And you are wrong about gas prices... once diesels start becoming more popular prices will decrease.

In my opinion the HEMI is old news and CRD is the future.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #84  
Old 01-28-2013, 04:57 AM
BobT's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2012 3.0L WK2
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posts: 1,674
Thanks: 524
Thanked 67 Times in 59 Posts
Rep Power: 73507
BobT has a reputation beyond reputeBobT has a reputation beyond reputeBobT has a reputation beyond reputeBobT has a reputation beyond reputeBobT has a reputation beyond reputeBobT has a reputation beyond reputeBobT has a reputation beyond reputeBobT has a reputation beyond reputeBobT has a reputation beyond reputeBobT has a reputation beyond reputeBobT has a reputation beyond repute
Garage
Re: Diesel People - Enlighten Me? (2014)

Quote:
Originally Posted by FAUEE View Post
City driving is where the diesel advantage is nullified. Diesels are great for keeping moving at highway speeds. In stop and go situations, gasoline works better, and hybrids work best. If you do mainly city driving and are expecting to see a mileage boost from a diesel, you're just wasting money buying the diesel.
I'm not sure that that is right. I'm basing this purely on theory not data nor experience. There are many things that affect the efficiency of internal combustion engines. The most fundamental factor is compression ratio, the higher, the more efficient. You are all familiar with how much more power can be got with a high compression head. The VM Motori 3L CRD and the 5.7L Hemi have maximum compression ratios of 16.5:1 and 9.6:1 respectively. So from the outset the CRD should be more efficient. In fact diesels are inherently more efficient. That is why they are so favoured by the transport and mining industries. However there is an even bigger difference. Diesels do not have a throttle so effectively they run at wide open throttle all the time. This means they run at maximum compression all the time. The gasoline engine runs at wide open throttle rarely and therefore achieves maximum compression only rarely. So in city driving, the diesels runs at max compression all the time whereas the gasoline engine which has a lower max compression ratio to begin with, runs mostly on a much lower compression ratio. With larger throttle openings at highway speeds, the gasoline engine runs close to its maximum compression ratio so the gap in efficiency between the diesel and gasoline engine should not be as great.
__________________

__________________
Ordered 9 Nov 2011 - Delivered 3:30pm Friday 13 April 2012
Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo 3L CRD, Black Forest Green Pearl, Quadra-lift, Off-road Adventure II, Front Recovery Hook, Mopar Tow Bar, Mopar Rock Rails, 150A Projecta Battery Isolator, Tekonsha P3 Brake Controller, Bridgestone D697 265/60R18 LT, Kimberley Kamper Special Edition
MudMap M7 off/on road sat nav, Chief front recovery hooks "chrome", Chief 3mm bash plate
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
poll: 20" Wheels on 2014 Overland vs. 2014 Summit jgc4ever Grand Cherokee - WK2 - 14 08-18-2013 12:17 AM
2014 Diesel Question JABEACHFANZ Diesel Powered 2012+ Export Grand Cherokee 34 04-10-2013 11:23 AM
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee and 2014 MB E-class Comparison Dan JGC Grand Cherokee - WK2 - 7 01-15-2013 10:39 AM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:25 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2012 - JeepGarage.Org
The Jeep Grand Cherokee Owners Community