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Old 09-15-2013, 12:15 AM
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What does the diesel actually sound like?

I haven't been able to find much video or audio of the GC's diesel sound. I've found a few with a small section of the diesel at idle, but what does it sound like WOT from a stop, or WOT at freeway speeds? Can you hear the turbo? Is the stock exhaust loud at all?
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Old 09-15-2013, 02:39 AM
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Re: What does the diesel actually sound like?

Australian MY14 CRD Overland owner here.

What does the diesel sound like? It sounds like a diesel. It's hard to explain really. When it's cold ie: on a cold morning it has loud burble - after it warms up, it has a soft burble.

We have a WK Limited 5.7 Hemi as well and it does not sound anything like the Hemi.

I'm not being very helpful am I.

I tell you what - if I get a chance tomorrow (because it's 5.30pm on a Sunday evening here) and if no one else posts a sound bite for you in that time, I shall record the sound of it on my normal morning drive on the school run.

That is - semi-rural roads, a few hills and twisty bits, no highway driving but averaging 80km-100km most of the way with a couple of 60km zones tossed in for good measure.

It is relatively quiet in the cabin though, I'm not sure what you want to hear but you be the judge.
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Old 09-15-2013, 03:51 AM
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Re: What does the diesel actually sound like?

Sure it sounds like a diesel but not the diesel of years gone by that you'd find in semi's puffing smoke slowly going up a hill. This one is Common Rail so it has a nice purr to it and tons of torque.

If you're on the fence between diesel and gas and NOT getting the SRT, The beauty of a the diesel is that you can chip or program the hell out of it and get so much more out of it than you would from the 5.7 Hemi at the same price. If I wasn't getting the SRT I'd be getting the Overland Diesel for sure.

Check out YouTube for some vids of diesels smokin' petrol/gas cars on the drag strip.

BTW I'm a bit biased towards diesels having worked for Cummins and now working for Cat.
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Old 09-15-2013, 06:12 AM
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Re: What does the diesel actually sound like?

Probably a lot like this



Or this one at 1:50 and 3:20. Actually a decent video

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Old 09-15-2013, 04:12 PM
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Re: What does the diesel actually sound like?

At 3:25 in the last video it sounds just like my Kubota.
Kubota doesn't bother me any more since I wear ear protection and a spray paint mask. I'm not joking, I do. I used to get sick after several hours on it.

If you factor in the price difference and higher cost of fuel it will take approx 1 million miles to break even. I just don't get it.

I wonder why Jeep won't allow lifetime warranty on diesels.
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Old 09-15-2013, 06:42 PM
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Re: What does the diesel actually sound like?

I'm not sure about Kubota but I know diesels tend to be way more robust and reliable than petrol/gas engines. You get similar, if not better torque output from a smaller engine. I know guys that are converting diesel engines to natural gas because they can really take it.

You may not get the acceleration or throttle response but it's not always about how fast you are off the line. I had a diesel car and could easily pass petrol/gas cars going up hill with no drop in power.

The turbocharged Common Rail was the real game changer and you'll start seeing more diesels, trust me. It's stupid that the cost of diesel fuel is so high but their are political and tax reasons behind that so it may never change.

Also, you have to read the fine print of what 'lifetime' really is. Is it 5 years or 20 years or limited first owner.
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Old 09-15-2013, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mswlogo View Post
If you factor in the price difference and higher cost of fuel it will take approx 1 million miles to break even. I just don't get it.
Because of poor math skills perhaps?

bd
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Old 09-15-2013, 07:50 PM
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Re: What does the diesel actually sound like?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mswlogo View Post
If you factor in the price difference and higher cost of fuel it will take approx 1 million miles to break even. I just don't get it.
True, it takes about 650,000 miles to make up the $5k markup, given the average $.50 higher cost per gallon of diesel. Most vehicles fall apart before they hit 300k. But, if you figure on towing anything, say a 4,000 lb boat or trailer, the fuel economy of the V6 will be cut in about half, and the diesel may lose about 15%-20%, reducing the miles to about 200-250,000. The cost of maintenance will about offset. Still a lot of miles, but VW hit the nail on the head with the TDI series. And you can't hardly find someone willing to part with a low mile (under 150k) Jetta or Golf.
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Old 09-15-2013, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Conejo148 View Post
True, it takes about 650,000 miles to make up the $5k markup, given the average $.50 higher cost per gallon of diesel. Most vehicles fall apart before they hit 300k. But, if you figure on towing anything, say a 4,000 lb boat or trailer, the fuel economy of the V6 will be cut in about half, and the diesel may lose about 15%-20%, reducing the miles to about 200-250,000. The cost of maintenance will about offset. Still a lot of miles, but VW hit the nail on the head with the TDI series. And you can't hardly find someone willing to part with a low mile (under 150k) Jetta or Golf.
Please include the facts you base this on. This calculation has been performed by many on this forum and nobody has come close to your estimate.

My own estimates are around 80k to 100k vs the Hemi, which is less than 3 years at the rate I drive. As far as capabilities are concerned, the Hemi is the fair comparison. Also, you are getting the Hemi transmission with the CRD which is rated at twice the torque. If the v6 meets the desired performance, its the best choice.

I base mine on the following:

27 mpg avg CRD
21 mpg avg V6
18 mpg avg v8
$4000 CRD v6 difference
$1600 CRD v8 difference
Gas 89 Oct 3.40
Diesel 3.70
DPF 6.00/gal
$25 CRD oil change premium

I use synthetic oil regardless.

CRD payback
v6 is 250k
V8 is 80k

If you burn premium gas the payback is immediate based on prices in my area.

bd
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Old 09-15-2013, 10:08 PM
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Re: What does the diesel actually sound like?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Conejo148 View Post
True, it takes about 650,000 miles to make up the $5k markup, given the average $.50 higher cost per gallon of diesel. Most vehicles fall apart before they hit 300k. But, if you figure on towing anything, say a 4,000 lb boat or trailer, the fuel economy of the V6 will be cut in about half, and the diesel may lose about 15%-20%, reducing the miles to about 200-250,000. The cost of maintenance will about offset. Still a lot of miles, but VW hit the nail on the head with the TDI series. And you can't hardly find someone willing to part with a low mile (under 150k) Jetta or Golf.
Correct, but how often do you tow a boat? 200K miles?

I have a 4500 Lb boat and will tow it with the V6 and I'm not that concerned. I tend to keep my boat on the water as much as possible

By the way for the math challenged here is the math.

You get 4 MPG (current estimated EPA for the diesel). Based on first reviews the estimate looks close.

Say $3.50 Reg, $4.00 Diesel

Say 24 MPG Reg, 28 MPG Diesel (Highway)

First we need to normalize the cost of fuel.

Easy 3.50/4.00 * 28 MPG = 24.5

This is the amount miles you get out of the amount of diesel that you could buy for the same price as gas per gallon.

Now you are down to 0.5 MPG savings over gas.

How many Gallons can you buy with $4500.00?

$4500.00/$3.50 = 1285 Gallons.

How many gallons do you have to use to save 1 gallon?

24 MPG / 0.5 MPG = 50 Gallons

How many gallons do you need to save for the added cost of the Diesel option, oh yeah, 1285 gallons. So that's 1285 gallons * 50.

You need to use 64250 Gallons to save 1285 Gallons at 0.5 MPG savings per gallon.

How many miles is that?

64250 Gallons * 24 MPG = 1,542,000 Miles.

When I said a million miles, I used $0.40 a gallon difference. It was you that suggested $0.50 difference. I've seen it as far as $1.00 spread.

The supply and demand drives the price to miles per dollar and they are currently very close to each other.

Granted the Diesel will likely do better. But the V6 does way better for some folks than EPA too. I've been getting 28 MPG on the highway. But that would be unfair to compare that to the EPA Est Diesel unless I owned one. But it would have to do 32 MPG Diesel Highway (for me) and it would still take ~1.2 million (I'm guessing don't feel like doing the math again) miles to break even !!!

That does not factor in urine. How much Urine do you need over 1.2 million miles? Noise, there is more noise, some like that noise. At least to the neighbors on a cold morning. Starting in extreme cold. Waiting for glow plugs in extreme cold. Finding Diesel stations.

If it got 34 MPG EPA, then it might start making sense. At 28 MPG it's almost non existent gain, I'm just saying economy wise.

Technical reasons, I guess so, but occasional boat towing, no, no way.

If your boat weighs more than 6200 Lbs do really want to use this little guy to tow it. I wouldn't on any regular basis.

I just did another quick calculation.

Urea. Sounds cheap. Let's get that down to per gallon.

I checked Amazon. $14.00 for 2.5 Gallons (that's dirt cheap). You'll probably pay a heck of lot more locally.

Takes 10 Gallons per 10,000 miles.

$56 every 10,000 miles.

5600 (cents) / 10000 miles = 0.56 Cents / mile

How much per gallon

0.56 (cents) * 28 MPG = 15.68 Cents Per Gallon for Urea.

Now add that to the Price of Diesel, now you're at $0.65 per gallon more.

Let's do just the first calc again

3.50 (Gas) / 4.15 (Diesel with Urea) * 28 MPG = 23.4 MPG equivalent. No need to go further you'll never catch up.

Let's guess at actual MPG

3.50 (Gas) / 4.15 (Diesel with Urea) * 32 MPG (Diesel Guess Highway Actual) = 27 MPG Equivalent

I'm getting 28 Actual.

Folks that get low 20's on Gas probably won't hit low 30's on Diesel, need to compare apples to apples.

And give me a break on the reliability thing with Diesel. I doubt many folks here will keep their SUV longer than 200K miles when the difference might kick in.

I've done NOTHING to my last two gas engines. Both well over 200K. Might have changed plugs ONCE on each. I changed oil at 7500 miles with synthetic. One was a Jeep another one a VW.

Here is a math question for you brilliant math guys.

How many MPG does diesel have to get Highway, to break even within 200K miles? If I'm getting 28 MPG on the Highway now with Gas? Don't forget Urea cost (use my dirt cheap price from amazon). And let's base it on $0.40 difference of Gas vs Diesel.
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Old 09-15-2013, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mswlogo View Post
24 MPG / 0.5 MPG = 50 Gallons
That should actually be 48 gallons, not 50. But still...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mswlogo View Post
That does not factor in urine. How much Urine do you need over 1.2 million miles?
.,.
I check Amazon. $14.00 for 2.5 Gallons (that's dirt cheap).
I hope you mean urea and not urine. Because if not and for $14.00/gallon I'll gladly pee in your truck
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Old 09-15-2013, 10:33 PM
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The most economical GC is the v6. The most sporty is the SRT. The best compromise is the CRD or Hemi with the CRD as the more economical of the two.

The v6 will not offer the driving experience and capsbilities of the v8....and therefore not that of the CRD either. Its not remotely as strong. The CRD market is for v8 buyers wanting an alternative.

We will revisit this analysis after the CRD ships...until then, its still fuzzy logic.

bd
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