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  #97  
Old 02-21-2015, 04:19 PM
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Re: New Upgraded Headlights

Hey guys! Chandler here at TLF (owner). The OP has been fully refunded and was aloud to keep the product. The bottom line with us- we do stand behind our product. Trenton was made aware that he was the first customer for WK2 halogen headlights and that he'd receive special pricing for working with us. Once he got the lights and took it to the shop for install it was made clear that we were being bashed on here before him even reaching out to us. Most of you know there are a million things that can go wrong when instating a relay harness on a mopar canbus system. There are plenty of connections to ground, polarity can get swapped, etc... I've seen guys (even dealerships) ground connections to plastic. Not at all saying that's what happened here but before bashing a company it's always best to reach out.


We have been more than responsive to Brandon and Trenton and are always standing behind our product. I feel as if some of you guys are acting as we screwed someone over... Do you know of any company that issues full refunds no questions asked? I'm sure there are other but bottom line is we are humans and do make mistakes, and if that should happen we will more than deal with it. Don't see why you guys are so quick to throw us (or anyone) under the bus!

Definitely not here to argue with anyone- just here to simply say we do stand behind our product. Keep in mind we are a business and are open monday-friday 9-5 eastern TZ. I did see Brandon's attempt of install through here and that relay harness is from projectoretrofits. It is a fully functional harness and I have had it on my WK2 for just over a year now as well as Luxman and two others. Brandon will be contacted asap and reinforce the installation of the harness. Everything is clearly labeled on the harness but it is a complicated harness none the less especially finding proper grounds on all the connections.



Thank you!

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  #98  
Old 02-21-2015, 04:59 PM
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Re: New Upgraded Headlights

Gotta respect this company they are trying there best to make things right, and bring our wk2 the first aftermarket lights on the market. they may not be perfect but atleast there not some cheap mass produced Chinese eBay lights. Respect there efforts to try and keep there company name clean. It takes time to perfect things trial, error and patients.
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  #99  
Old 02-21-2015, 05:50 PM
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Re: New Upgraded Headlights

Thank you for the reply! ^^

And that's exactly it... We are trying to bring a product to the market that will be a great upgrade for us WK2 guys. we deal with a lot of groups of car guys and I've never seen this harsh. A bit of a turn off to the community when we are literally willing to work with any one of our customers to get a great end product in your(their) hands. Honestly, both issues here could 100 percent be instaation problems but weve been crucified for something that hasn't been diagnosed, and lost money on as well.


If someone is willing to help us bring a good product to the market for WK2, we are more than willing to get it there. Trenton unfortunately didn't even allow us to build a new set or bring the set back for diagnoses. I saw this thread and figured it would be best to settle it with a full refund since he showed no interest in working with us to get that great end product on what was agreed to be a promotional pricing on a brand new trial product . And again... Full refund, and kept product.



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  #100  
Old 02-21-2015, 08:25 PM
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New Upgraded Headlights

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLightingFirm View Post
A bit of a turn off to the community when we are literally willing to work with any one of our customers to get a great end product in your(their) hands. Honestly, both issues here could 100 percent be instaation problems but weve been crucified for something that hasn't been diagnosed, and lost money on as well.

Thanks for the reach out to our community. One thing to consider is your R&D process. You definitely had a person willing to fork over cash to "try" something that you yourself were not sure to be fully functional, or even functional at best after full installation. Although a discount was applied, all expenses on your side with a guinea pig to try on their own vehicle for free should have been the correct way.

Then there is the communication. From the sounds of it there is a pretty big gap in communication. Of course you will be bombarded with questions for a product like this. These folks are the first ones to try it. Again, they are taking most risk (besides cash flow) to integrate your solution into their everyday driving vehicles. But that's why they are testers for a product you will eventually profit from. Regardless the communication should be top priority to ensure the "whole" customer experience stays strong.

Best for now,


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  #101  
Old 02-21-2015, 08:26 PM
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Re: New Upgraded Headlights

still wont give your company business but nice to hear your repsonse
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  #102  
Old 02-21-2015, 09:06 PM
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Re: New Upgraded Headlights

Thanks for your response guys.



Phil, very valid points. The unfortunate thing is we get around 150-160 emails daily and we have two dedicated full time staff members strictly for customer service. Between that and the calls it does take up to two business days for s reply but calling our new number (844-LED-HIDs) will get you in contact with one of us pretty darn quick!


The thing is... This isn't our first retrofit. These lights are 100 percent tested functional before shipping. We sell the same stuff everyday and mopar' do use a more intense set up as far as a relay harness goes. The lights are pictured working in numerous scenarios and stages throughout the process. At worst, the only thing that could possibly be wrong given the facts from the buyer is the ground internall on the headlamp for the DRL. Could explain why it wasn't working and is a fix that takes less than 5 minutes to correct. If the buyer would have reached out they could have been corrected and on his car.


As always, here to help and appreciate you guys responding!






Chandler
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  #103  
Old 02-21-2015, 10:48 PM
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Re: New Upgraded Headlights

IMO... The install of these headlights is the #1 problem, and not the product. The wiring can be quite overwhelming for a beginner. Just because you've installed HIDs, doesn't make you a professional.

I'm not saying the quality was 100%, but wiring these up is simple. Installing is a little different. It would help if the guys installing would post pictures so WE all can help.


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  #104  
Old 02-21-2015, 11:38 PM
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Re: New Upgraded Headlights

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLightingFirm View Post
Trenton was made aware that he was the first customer for WK2 halogen headlights and that he'd receive special pricing for working with us. Once he got the lights and took it to the shop for install it was made clear that we were being bashed on here before him even reaching out to us. Most of you know there are a million things that can go wrong when instating a relay harness on a mopar canbus system. There are plenty of connections to ground, polarity can get swapped, etc... I've seen guys (even dealerships) ground connections to plastic. Not at all saying that's what happened here but before bashing a company it's always best to reach out.
Chandler, glad you can finally join in the discussion here since it was never picked up in our emails when I explained there.

Again, I fully appreciate you guys refunding me and letting me keep the lights, but lets be fair about a few things here.

As said many times here and in our emails, I did know these were the first of these lights you would be modifying, so I expected some issues. But those issues don't inherently give you the right to act like I should expect them to show up on my doorstep in a way that was completely unprofessional in the delivery process without tracking info being supplied (to which my complaint was ignored) and by not doing as we agreed upon (written on my bill statement too), by showing me process photos of the lights being built, so I was happy with the end result. I originally brought you someone elses retorfit project and said I wanted it done exactly that way, but you said "we can do that, but better!" which wasn't the end result. So I assume when a place says they can do it better and it will look different, they would let the person know who was paying for it what the end result looked like before sending to them. I expected details of how they were assembled and all I got was a photo on Instagram of the housings with working halos, but upon closer inspection, they are completely empty of the other lights and don't even have the housing backing on them. So that's hardly a finished photo showing everything functioning as intended.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLightingFirm View Post
Honestly, both issues here could 100 percent be instaation problems but weve been crucified for something that hasn't been diagnosed, and lost money on as well.

If someone is willing to help us bring a good product to the market for WK2, we are more than willing to get it there. Trenton unfortunately didn't even allow us to build a new set or bring the set back for diagnoses. I saw this thread and figured it would be best to settle it with a full refund since he showed no interest in working with us to get that great end product on what was agreed to be a promotional pricing on a brand new trial product . And again... Full refund, and kept product.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLightingFirm View Post

The thing is... This isn't our first retrofit. These lights are 100 percent tested functional before shipping. We sell the same stuff everyday and mopar' do use a more intense set up as far as a relay harness goes. The lights are pictured working in numerous scenarios and stages throughout the process. At worst, the only thing that could possibly be wrong given the facts from the buyer is the ground internall on the headlamp for the DRL. Could explain why it wasn't working and is a fix that takes less than 5 minutes to correct. If the buyer would have reached out they could have been corrected and on his car.

If the issues I was having could have been resolved, then I really wish you guys would've told me how to go about that prior to just now saying it here and basically saying the shop I took them to was incompetent. I'm fairly sure they knew how to wire up a simple harness and didn't waste 4 hours of their Friday, when they were short on staff, to dick around with headlights from another company and not even charge me for it.

And to that point, the breadth of the information provided for how to install them was that they were "plug and play" and "any reputable shop should know how to do it no problem", which was a little lacking based on them not being able to function correctly at all. I even asked via another email a few days before install if there was anything important I should know to tell the guys installing them, but I heard nothing back from you.

You guys did offer to take them back and work on them until I was satisfied, which was courteous, but that was offered when I complained about the cosmetic issues, prior to install and didn't solve those later problems, which could've happened after they came back again for the second time... I was rightfully apprehensive to send a product back to be worked on again, when they arrived already defunct from the start with exposed metal wires all across the LED halo, which I'm sure everyone on here wouldn't have been pleased to see on their new headlights.

I never would have come to you guys with the build if I didn't think you were capable and I was willing to risk the money on a new project, so I don't appreciate the condescending remarks from your end either. I took a huge risk with these on my Jeep and you guys had all the leverage, to which you did the right thing in the end, but I could've been completely screwed had that refund not happened.

So this "crucifying" of your company as you've called it, has all been based on my experience and the only people you have to blame are yourselves. I was obviously optimistic and excited about the headlights in the beginning and that excitement slowly deteriorated into where we are now, all based on actual occurrences and not me just being some troll on the internet that's out to bash your company.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLightingFirm View Post
The lights are pictured working in numerous scenarios and stages throughout the process.
Again, never saw any photos of the headlights turned on. Just the DRL LED halos, sans anything else in the housing, as we see in the first pic I posted here of them. So that statement is just not true.



Quote:
Originally Posted by BlckWK2 View Post
Thanks for the reach out to our community. One thing to consider is your R&D process. You definitely had a person willing to fork over cash to "try" something that you yourself were not sure to be fully functional, or even functional at best after full installation. Although a discount was applied, all expenses on your side with a guinea pig to try on their own vehicle for free should have been the correct way.

Then there is the communication. From the sounds of it there is a pretty big gap in communication. Of course you will be bombarded with questions for a product like this. These folks are the first ones to try it. Again, they are taking most risk (besides cash flow) to integrate your solution into their everyday driving vehicles. But that's why they are testers for a product you will eventually profit from. Regardless the communication should be top priority to ensure the "whole" customer experience stays strong.

Best for now,


--------
Phil

Phil, I couldn't have said it better myself. Thank you!

Had the communication between us been more cohesive, I definitely wouldn't have been as quick to react to the failed install and post it here. And for that I already apologized multiple times anyway.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Pittz View Post
IMO... The install of these headlights is the #1 problem, and not the product. The wiring can be quite overwhelming for a beginner. Just because you've installed HIDs, doesn't make you a professional.

I'm not saying the quality was 100%, but wiring these up is simple. Installing is a little different. It would help if the guys installing would post pictures so WE all can help.
Again, the place I took them to was not a novice establishment when it comes to lighting systems. They worked between two guys for those 4 hours and no resolutions were found to get the lights fully functioning. If one thing fixed a problem, it caused another.

And how do you expect everyone who gets things installed to be able to take photos of the entire process? If I did the install myself, then sure, why not. But I'm not going to be in the worker's faces, taking photos and asking whats what and "why isn't this working so the JeepGarage guys believe me when I say it didn't work?!"
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  #105  
Old 02-21-2015, 11:44 PM
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Re: New Upgraded Headlights

I wasn't just referring to you. The installers clearly did not know what they were doing. Hooking one thing up, then something that just worked stopped is clearly a install problem. The first problem is not trying to do the install yourself. Letting someone who is not 100% certain on how to do the install shouldn't be doing it in the first place.

Take pictures of the lights to see what we are working with. There is a specific MOPAR relay. Not sure if that was mentioned or not. I've dealt with far worse companies that took weeks to respond. When I finally received the product it was crap and was never given a refund. This company at least came on here with a response and a refund. Can't be mad at that.


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  #106  
Old 02-21-2015, 11:46 PM
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New Upgraded Headlights

There is only one plug for the Bi-xenons. That is for your Hi beam actuator. The HID goes into the projector. From there you have a relay. It should be a MOPAR relay. The LED lights are as easy as hooking them up directly to a car battery and testing them. Power and ground.

If you were close I would help.


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  #107  
Old 02-22-2015, 12:08 AM
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Re: New Upgraded Headlights

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pittz View Post
I wasn't just referring to you. The installers clearly did not know what they were doing. Hooking one thing up, then something that just worked stopped is clearly a install problem. The first problem is not trying to do the install yourself. Letting someone who is not 100% certain on how to do the install shouldn't be doing it in the first place.

Take pictures of the lights to see what we are working with. There is a specific MOPAR relay. Not sure if that was mentioned or not. I've dealt with far worse companies that took weeks to respond. When I finally received the product it was crap and was never given a refund. This company at least came on here with a response and a refund. Can't be mad at that.
I was trying to do myself a favor by not doing the install myself. I guarantee I would've had fewer results than the shop did, so that's not a viable solution. As TLF said, "any shop should know how" so that's what I did.

This place that is finishing the lights for me obviously has some knowledge of how to get them working because...that's why they are keeping them and making a working harness. So their incompetence with this harness may be true, but it's not because they don't know how to do custom headlight installs. It's because of problems with the provided harness itself.

And I do agree that TLF have done the right thing by following those steps, but I'm not giving them a pat on the back for it, especially after reading a few of these replies that were never even mentioned in emails between us.

I was completely forthright with them about the discussion going on here and why it was done.
So I'm seeing this as it could've gone two ways:

1. Quite a few people getting similar headlights done for their Jeeps because they saw how good they looked and actually worked. (That was the ideal situation and was free promo for TLF.)

2. What we're dealing with now.
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  #108  
Old 02-22-2015, 07:06 PM
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Re: New Upgraded Headlights

ok so we all learned a lesson, 1- dont be a guinee pig for a company unless its totally 100% free and 2- dont go to TLF for headlights
thats all!
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