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  #1  
Old 12-01-2014, 11:53 PM
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Drive Line Vibration Mystery

New to the forum and at wits end trying to find this problem.

Getting a strange vibration in my 2005 GC Hemi when the vehicle is mechanically cold, by that I mean after the car has sit for a while after driving. The problem still presents itself if I let the engine come up to temp, then try to drive it.

I'm getting a strong vibration when I start to drive and turn the wheels, like when leaving a parking space, turning a corner, etc. When I turn the steering wheel, it feels like a bad wheel bearing, but the shaking stops when I straighten the wheels and continue in a straight line. I can turn sightly and the vibrations not too bad, the farther I turn the wheel, the harder it grinds, but everythings OK once I complete the turn. I first noticed the front wheels were shaking, but now I clearly see that both back wheels are shuttering. After driving for a few minutes the vibration slowly goes away. But after everything sits for a while it comes back and is getting worse over time.

I have checked all the universals and confirmed fluid levels in the differentials and transfer case, no noticeable damage or loss of fluid. I have also pulled both rear axle shafts and inspected for spline damage, clean as a whistle. The PS pump isnt whining, fluid is good and I dont resistance in the steering wheel

So far, I have replaced the following:

drivers/passengers wheel bearing assemblies
drivers/passengers CV axles
drivers/passengers control arm bushings

I trying to avoid taking it to a stealership or local shop for diagnosis, so I coming here for advice. Im a Jeep guy with this GC and also have an old YJ that I almost totally rebuild with the help of the Jeep community (btw I love that old YJ).

I greatly appreciate any advice anyone out there can give me to help solve the mystery before this thing rips itself apart or I pull the last few hairs out of my head.

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  #2  
Old 12-02-2014, 07:30 AM
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Re: Drive Line Vibration Mystery

Im not sure if your jeep requires friction modifier in the differentials. Which four wheel drive system does it have?
Because your problem description seems to be a locking differential.
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  #3  
Old 12-02-2014, 10:07 AM
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Re: Drive Line Vibration Mystery

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frango100 View Post
Im not sure if your jeep requires friction modifier in the differentials. Which four wheel drive system does it have?
Because your problem description seems to be a locking differential.
Agree with above about correct mix of friction modifier.

Also are you getting any codes? Is the "service 4WD" or "service ABS system" icon lamps illuminating in the instrument cluster?
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  #4  
Old 12-02-2014, 01:12 PM
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Re: Drive Line Vibration Mystery

The transfer case called for the modifier, so I carefully added the right proportions, and the diff lube said it was specifically for slip differentials.

Oddly enough, I havent had any error codes of any kind since this started.

Everyone I've talked to is suggesting an issue with the differential,, but Im leery of trying to pull the rear cover and completely swap fluids, never know if the stuff in there now is holding everything together.

Im schedule to have a shop look at it this Saturday, but I think Im gonna get burned on the cost of the repair. Theyre gonna diagnose the problem for $50 rack time, I think it might be better to go to a bone yard and try to find another axle from a wreck, rather than pay to have the diff rebuilt, if that what it turns out to be.

I'll post the results when I find out.

THX for your inputs
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Old 12-02-2014, 01:39 PM
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Re: Drive Line Vibration Mystery

Which transfercase do you have and/or which 4x4 system you have? The NV140 only needs ATF+4 fluid and the NV 245 needs the special mopar fluid (which is Mobil 424). Never saw anything about friction modifier in the T-case.
If your diffs have vari-loks, then they will need the friction modifier, or your wheels will hop in tight turns.
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Old 12-02-2014, 09:34 PM
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Re: Drive Line Vibration Mystery

I have the NV245 T case and the 4x4 is a Quadra Drive II.

I'm sure it was a mistake, but I had to try something, I was 700 miles from home went this thing went crazy. I found several references online that said I could use AFT+4 if I couldnt get the Mopar stuff, so I drained the TC and replaced it with AFT+4. It didnt make any difference in the vibration and i didnt notice anything unusual on the trip back home. I did top off the rear diff with Valvoline SYNpower 75W-140 that says it was for limited slip differentals. I looked online and went to all 3 auto parts stores in the area, they all found the Valvoline in their computers, but I only used about 1/4 of a bottle to top off the rear diff.

Like I said, this only shows up after the car has been sitting for a couple hours. I can start driving in my neighborhood, making very slow turns on the corners and once its driven for about 5-10 minutes, the vibration goes away completely. I can go into a parking lot and turn the steering wheel to both extremes with no vibration, no noise, no wheel hop, nothing. After it cools off, the rear wheels are shuttering and it sounds and feel like its going to rip itself apart, a few minutes later, nothing.

I work with a guy thats a super gearhead, he suggested that I "not" pull the cover on the rear diff and inspect it, said that fully replacing the fluid might flush out whatever is holding it together, but I could see for myself if there's teeth in the bottom.

I do my best to fix my own stuff, just dont trust the local shops especially the dealerships. I have tools and skills enough to do this myself, but I dont want to replace another $1000 in parts, like I did on the front end and I cant go without the vehicle. What do you think of the idea of finding a salvaged rear axle, diff and all. Or do you think I should just bite the bullet and take it to a shop, I already have an appointment on Saturday.

I want to make sure I dont forget, I cant thank you enough for your input, you have no idea how much I appreciate your opinion, thank you, I really mean it. I welcome any suggestion you might have, that I can try before going in this weekend. Im gonna keep searching the internet, if I find anything that works, I'll let you know, if not, I'll post after the shop takes the last of my money. Thanks again for sticking with me, it really means a lot, you have no idea.
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Old 12-02-2014, 10:08 PM
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Re: Drive Line Vibration Mystery

Just a couple of unrelated side notes.

I just noticed Frango100, frango is chicken. My sons ex-wife was from Barra Da Tijuca, we spent a month there several years ago. Youre a luck man if youre in that area, absolutely beautiful. We didnt speak Portuguese and were there for 2 days, buying food from a gas station/restaurant, but everyone was very friendly, love to go back.

My daily driver is a '92 Jeep YJ, inline 6 cyl. 4.0, 3" susp lift w/ 33 x 12.5s. 205000 miles on the odometer, and ran like a new car in -14 F weather last winter.

Thanks again
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Old 12-03-2014, 10:21 AM
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Re: Drive Line Vibration Mystery

I would still try to put fresh fluid in the rear diff. I heard from other WJ guys that the amount of limited slip additive in premixed fluids is normally not enough. And if you only topped it of, then there is even less of it. Still strange that it only hops when cold, but if there was a mechanical problem, i would expect it to continue even when warm.
I`m Dutch, but living for 14 years in the state of So Paulo, approx. 100 km from the city of So Paulo. I like it a lot overhere as well.
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Old 12-08-2014, 10:12 PM
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Re: Drive Line Vibration Mystery - FINALLY SOLVED

The mystery vibration has been solved.

The emergency/parking brake shoes were the cause.

I removed the rear wheels, calipers and rotors and found that one of the shoes on the drivers side was partially separated from the metal bracket, leaving uneven wear marks (gouges) on the drum as if it was flapping on specific places on the surface. The passenger side had a damaged pad that was chipped and a piece of the pad had lodged into the shoe itself, causing a groove in the drum.

I replaced the pads and adjusted them so that they were as far from the rotor/drum as possible and no more vibration. I drove around slowly with the e-brake partially engaged, both forward and reverse, disassembled and checked the drums again, both were slightly polished, so im leaving them for now.

Credit for the find goes to my good friend kevin sharp of richmond, mi. He had a similar issue and pointed me in a direction i would have never considered. He has been my go-to buddy for all the weird stuff thats gone wrong with both my jeeps, therefore i have proclaimed him the master of all things jeep. Thank you my friend, couldnt have done it without you.

Special thanks to frango100 too, for his suggestions and sticking with me for support.

To all the other jeepers out there, dont get burned by the shops and the stealership, when in doubt, come to your fellow jeep family, they will never let you down.

Thanks to all.
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Old 12-08-2014, 10:21 PM
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Re: Drive Line Vibration Mystery - FINALLY SOLVED

Almost forgot, I went to 2 different dealerships and talked to 2 different counter guys, both were dealership mechanics too. They said that the OTC differential fluid w/ slip differential additives were just as good if not better than mixing your own additive. They said that the OTC stuff has to meet specific ratios of lube to additive specs that are to OEM standards and there was less chance of getting the proportions wrong if you use premixed. THEY ALSO INSISTED ON USING THE MOPAR NV245 FLUID FOR THE TRANSFER CASE, YOU CAN USE AFT+4 IN AN EMERGENCY, BUT LONG TERM USE OF THE +4 WILL SERIOUSLY DAMAGE THE GEARS, SO USE THE DEALERSHIP STUFF.

THX AGAIN
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Old 12-30-2014, 12:28 AM
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Re: Drive Line Vibration Mystery

This sounds a lot like what I'm dealing with. I've replaced almost the entire front end of my '05 GC and I'm left with this same issue when starting cold.

Only mine seems more of a resistance when moving from park. It seems worse when reversing (such as backing out of parking spot) them forward. It'll even pop and feel like the wheel slips. After that it's fine.

Does this found like why you had?


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Old 01-17-2015, 08:33 PM
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Re: Drive Line Vibration Mystery

Not that I am really adding anything to help figure out this problem but on my 2006 I had the same problem -- weird 4x4 grinding sensations when it was cold. Totally goes away after you drive 5 or so miles and everything warms up.

So I took the back wheels off and brake rotors and both rear parking brake pads were dislodged from the bracket and just loose inside the brake rotors! Bought new pads and replaced them but I still have the 4x4 grinding noises/feel in the morning when everything is cold. Wish I could figure out whats up.
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