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  #12985  
Old 02-12-2015, 07:29 AM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee information - Australia

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmcrh View Post
To start with, paddle shifter moves up/down as instructed. I rarely used paddle shifter before the dreaded TCM flash. Now I use paddle shifter on uphill ONLY to find out how car behaves compared to auto mode. Small hills in urban driving, e.g. 80kph zone uphill on great western highway, car speed is 80kph, gear 8th, rpm around 1300 before hill. To maintain car speed of 80kph, I press gas pedal as soon as car start climbing: 1) in auto mode, gear downshifts from 8th to 7th (if im not careful with foot, gear would drop to 6th) , speed 80kph, rpm up; 2) in paddle shift mode, gear maintains at 8th, speed 80kph, rpm up but not as much compared to auto mode.
Yes that all sounds good.
1) In Auto 80kph to uphill will kick down to 7th or 6th gear to go up the hill and the revs will go up because you are in a lower gear.

2) In Manual mode 80kph to uphill intitally it will stay in 8th (you set to 8th) BUT I think the engine the engine too low revs at only 1300rpm to go uphill.

It will either override your selection and change to 7th or 6th... or it will allow some slip in the torque converter to bring the revs up.




Quote:
Originally Posted by mmcrh View Post
If the hill is steep, in paddle shift mode, my experience in Bulli tells all. In auto mode, car does not maintain speed despite pressing gas pedal.
Bulli pass is steep yes so it is more load on the engine. If using manual mode you have to select the right gear for the job and the speed you are doing. Normally Bulli pass is 60 speed limit (I think) so you will be in 2nd on the slow parts or that sharp hairpin bend, and 3rd or 4th all the way up.

In Auto going up it would be Automatically in 2nd int he slow parts and , 3rd or 4th the rest of the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmcrh View Post
Very hard to video record as steering wheel is on the way. But i managed to record 80kph zone uphill on great western highway mentioned in my example above. It took me around 45min driving, many repetitions to record it properly. And yes, the dealer has the footage for a few weeks.
Good job, I hope it might have helped.
If they can see the revs and what gear its in and the speed. Hopefully they'll be able to see the problem but it might need them to test drive it up a hill.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmcrh View Post
You mentioned that it should be at 3rd gear at speed 30kph on flat rd. Guess what, this was exactly how my car behaved either on flat rd or uphill before the TCM flash. E.G., in auto mode, gear upshift to 2nd at 20kph, to 3rd at 30kph.....to 8th at 80kph. But after the falsh, on flat rd, gear upshift to 3rd at 20kph, to 4th at 30kph.....to 7th at 80kph. On uphill, you know the problem.
If you can get up a hill smoothly in auto mode with normal driving, something is wrong. It could be mechanical (torque convreter?) or electrical (a sensor failed?) or the program (TCM flash?).

No one else on the forum here had mentioned anything the TCM flash doing the same thing as what you describe. That's got us puzzled. (Well it's ONE thing that has us puzzled). It might be a coincidence that the drivetrain trouble is after you did the TCM flash.

The gearbox is supposed to be able sense the load on it (I don't know exactly how it does) and it selects the gear to suit. The load will be higher if you are going uphill or towing a heavy trailer.
- Maybe there is something wrong with the load measuring system/sensor/ or program.
- Before you said that the revs went up really high and the car was still slowing when going uphill. This is the like torque converter slipping which i think we said this early on. Did the mechanic check this out?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmcrh View Post
If i can borrow my mrs saying, i quote, "i dont care and i dont understand the inner working of the car. If i want to maintain or increase speed, i press gas pedal and the car should responds as intended. You spend so much money on this bloody jeep, yet it cant do what you want. My 8 yo camry can climb the same hill at ease. Sell the bloody jeep". What can i say?
Well my wife doesn't understand how to change a printer ink cartridge .

A car is a bit more complicated though.

In essence she's right. In auto it should just be able to drive up the hill.
An 8 y.o. Camry is a bit simpler and has half the gears and a fraction of the engine torque and it can do it. Should be easy for the Jeep.

What do they say? " Wife Happy, life Happy"
.
.
.
Now you'll have to excuse me.
My wife's just come home from a night out at the movies with some friends. They went to see the "Fifty Shades of Grey" movie (is that what it's called?).

Anyway she just went in to get changed and is calling out for me. Must need some help with something

I better go see what she wants. BYE

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  #12986  
Old 02-12-2015, 04:28 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee information - Australia

Are we finished yet?
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  #12987  
Old 02-12-2015, 04:35 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee information - Australia

Sometimes I understand why car designers/manufacturers opt to show their customers _less_ information about what the car is doing.
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  #12988  
Old 02-12-2015, 05:17 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee information - Australia

It's Friday the 13th people.

I suggest all Jeep Grand Cherokee MY14 owners keep out of the trucks today and keep it locked up in the garage.

Do not enter the cabin at all and do not think about your Jeep!!

It may be the worst thing that you can do in your life today if you muck around or even talk about the Jeep MY14 GC.

You may be cursed for life if you post on line today another word about what the Jeep GC does going up or down hills using the paddles!!

Be warned people!!!

It's Friday the 13th!!!!

Otherwise know as.......................

JEEPLESS DAY AUSTRALIA!!!!!!
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File Type: jpg friday 13th.jpg (44.4 KB, 8 views)
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  #12989  
Old 02-12-2015, 06:09 PM
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  #12990  
Old 02-12-2015, 06:50 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee information - Australia

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmcrh View Post
To maintain car speed of 80kph, I press gas pedal as soon as car start climbing: 1) in auto mode, gear downshifts from 8th to 7th (if im not careful with foot, gear would drop to 6th) , speed 80kph, rpm up; 2) in paddle shift mode, gear maintains at 8th, speed 80kph, rpm up but not as much compared to auto mode.
Yes, because in 8th gear revs will be lower than in 7th or 6th at the same speed. This is how a gearbox works.

I don't understand why you need to be careful not to go into 6th. You want to go into 6th if you want the car to maintain speed or accelerate. This sounds like your problem, that you are backing off the accelerator because you don't want to change down gears, then of course you lose speed.

Quote:
Very hard to video record as steering wheel is on the way. But i managed to record 80kph zone uphill on great western highway mentioned in my example above. It took me around 45min driving, many repetitions to record it properly. And yes, the dealer has the footage for a few weeks.
Can you upload it to youtube and give us the link so we can see what is happening?
Quote:
You mentioned that it should be at 3rd gear at speed 30kph on flat rd. Guess what, this was exactly how my car behaved either on flat rd or uphill before the TCM flash. E.G., in auto mode, gear upshift to 2nd at 20kph, to 3rd at 30kph.....to 8th at 80kph. But after the falsh, on flat rd, gear upshift to 3rd at 20kph, to 4th at 30kph.....to 7th at 80kph. On uphill, you know the problem.
3rd at 20kph/4th at 30kph on flat road doesn't sound too bad to me, if you are coasting it will choose the highest gear it can, when you put your foot down it should change down. I rarely get into 8th gear at 80kph, normally up around 100kph, but I tend to use a bit of accelerator.

I wonder if the different behaviour could be due to the transmission having learnt your driving behaviour, then it got reset after the TCM update. In which case you just have to drive it for a while to relearn.

In any case, you should be able to give the car more accelerator and it should be changing down and accelerating, and you've previously said that it does change down and revs to increase, but you don't see any speed increase. That makes no sense. You also say you want to be careful not to let the car change down gears, well it should be changing down gears, that is how revs come up and the car accelerates. It shouldn't be accelerating in 8th gear at 80kph, which is what you insist it used to do, it shouldn't have.

The video would help us understand what is going on.

edit: the more I think about this, it sounds like you are just backing off the accelerator at the wrong time. It changes down a gear to accelerate up a hill, and when the revs go up you are backing off in response instead of keeping your foot down.

And perhaps a reset of the transmission learning has thrown you a bit, so you are reacting to the new gear changes....? Because it doesn't actually sound like the car is doing anything wrong, as far as I can tell from your description.....
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  #12991  
Old 02-12-2015, 09:43 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee information - Australia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benn0 View Post

Can you upload it to youtube and give us the link so we can see what is happening?
3rd at 20kph/4th at 30kph on flat road doesn't sound too bad to me, if you are coasting it will choose the highest gear it can, when you put your foot down it should change down. I rarely get into 8th gear at 80kph, normally up around 100kph, but I tend to use a bit of accelerator.

I wonder if the different behaviour could be due to the transmission having learnt your driving behaviour, then it got reset after the TCM update. In which case you just have to drive it for a while to relearn.

And perhaps a reset of the transmission learning has thrown you a bit, so you are reacting to the new gear changes....? Because it doesn't actually sound like the car is doing anything wrong, as far as I can tell from your description.....

On a flat road it will change up to to 4th at about 30kph only with almost no accelerator pedal.
Just driving in a suburban street with a normal amount of accelerator the car will get up to even 50kph before changing into 4th.
It's the engine speed, car speed and the load on the driveline that selects what gear to be in.
It doesn't just change gear at a set speed.


oh no ....... Capt. Picard has just now realised that the gearbox TCM has been "learning" from all of Mmrch's driving.

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  #12992  
Old 02-12-2015, 09:47 PM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee information - Australia

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Disconnect the battery for a little while?
I quote my own post from over two weeks ago. I gather not actioned.
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  #12993  
Old 02-13-2015, 02:05 AM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee information - Australia

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Originally Posted by Barboots View Post
I quote my own post from over two weeks ago. I gather not actioned.

Sorry, no as am afraid I might get more than i wish for just like what i got from the TCM flash.


Like Gforce pointed out, electronic throttle control might have been upset by the TCM flash. Reason i said this is because the problem has been alleviated to a certain extent since PCM updat.

Deep dowm, what i really care about is when i press gas pedal to either maintain and increase speed, the car shall deliver what i want. As long as the car can deliver, i really dont mind what rpm or gear. But it struggles to or can not deliver on moderate to steep hill, which it could deliver at ease regardless of terrain before the TCM.
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  #12994  
Old 02-13-2015, 02:21 AM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee information - Australia

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Originally Posted by mmcrh View Post
Deep dowm, what i really care about is when i press gas pedal to either maintain and increase speed, the car shall deliver what i want. As long as the car can deliver, i really dont mind what rpm or gear. But it struggles to or can not deliver on moderate to steep hill, which it could deliver at ease regardless of terrain before the TCM.
Yes, and this is what we have been trying to help with, but the info you have given has been confusing. It sounds like from your description it is working as it should. The gear drops down and revs come up, that is all correct. But then youve said some confusing things like you are being careful not to press the accelerator too much so it doesn't go down to 6th. Well that would likely be why the car isnt accelerating I would guess.

So we have been asking for gear/rev/speed info to work out what is happening, but you haven't given any specific info. A video of the problem would be great if it shows all 3 indicators. Otherwise there is little help we can give without specific info.
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  #12995  
Old 02-13-2015, 02:51 AM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee information - Australia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benn0 View Post
Yes, and this is what we have been trying to help with, but the info you have given has been confusing. It sounds like from your description it is working as it should. The gear drops down and revs come up, that is all correct. But then youve said some confusing things like you are being careful not to press the accelerator too much so it doesn't go down to 6th. Well that would likely be why the car isnt accelerating I would guess.

So we have been asking for gear/rev/speed info to work out what is happening, but you haven't given any specific info. A video of the problem would be great if it shows all 3 indicators. Otherwise there is little help we can give without specific info.

Put in this way, the harder i press, the further drop the gear, i have no problem with it, but the harder for car to get speed i desire is the problem. Thats why i am careful about foot on pedal (to get balance right) so to adapt to behavior of car.

The only footage i have is the one i took in 80kph zone on light hill, and i have described grade, speed, rpm in previous post ( some members comment that its normal, and i can live with it), Its recorded after the PCM update at 20k service. Actually i called the service guy back and thank him on the same date of service as i felt immediate improvement. The service guy told me that he assigned the car to a different tech who did PCM update and adaptive learn.

Sorry, i dont have footage about big hill climbing on Mt Ousley Rd which has cameras along the Rd (recording is out of question), and in bulli. I may try to record it when i travel to bulli next time.
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  #12996  
Old 02-13-2015, 04:07 AM
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Re: 2014 Grand Cherokee information - Australia

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Originally Posted by mmcrh View Post
Put in this way, the harder i press, the further drop the gear, i have no problem with it, but the harder for car to get speed i desire is the problem. Thats why i am careful about foot on pedal (to get balance right) so to adapt to behavior of car.
Balance? Stop trying to second guess the transmission. Stop lifting off when it drops a gear or two or three. It is doing what its supposed to.

Dropping from 8th to 6th doesn't make it harder to get speed, it makes it easier to get speed. You seem to have it stuck in your head that a higher gear means more acceleration, it doesn't. Dropping down gears brings your revs up allowing you to accelerate more than staying in 8th does. You just have to keep putting the foot down and stop backing off because you think its doing the wrong thing.
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