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  #193  
Old 01-02-2014, 04:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swampy View Post
Not sure that the modifiers would be different for ELSD's. Having said that we use the Redline 75W-85 in ours and have not had any chirps, squeals, shudders or bangs, however we don't do any serious off roading either. I would still be confident that all would be Ok.

What did dealer say about it when u BYO the redline?
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  #194  
Old 01-02-2014, 05:46 AM
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Re: Jeep service costs

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmcrh View Post
What did dealer say about it when u BYO the redline?
I self perform all vehicle servicing, just use them for warranty work.

On a side note, below is an extract from the Penrite site re ELSD's.

"Limited slip differentials with electronic control
Similar to Limited Slip differentials with clutch packs to prevent slipping of one wheel. The friction of the clutches is controlled externally using sensors at the wheels to detect slipping. The hydraulic pressure needed for the clutches is electronically controlled."
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  #195  
Old 01-02-2014, 05:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Swampy View Post
I self perform all vehicle servicing, just use them for warranty work. On a side note, below is an extract from the Penrite site re ELSD's. "Limited slip differentials with electronic control Similar to Limited Slip differentials with clutch packs to prevent slipping of one wheel. The friction of the clutches is controlled externally using sensors at the wheels to detect slipping. The hydraulic pressure needed for the clutches is electronically controlled."
Thanks for the info.
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  #196  
Old 01-03-2014, 02:40 AM
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Re: Jeep service costs

Quote:
Originally Posted by John47 View Post
Swampy, I'm with you…..
Although off topic in this thread, can we take the issue of diff oils a bit further?
You are correct in your comment of the manual specification regarding the 75W140, and also Redline on their website claim their 75W140 GL-5 meets Jeep spec for front and rear diffs.
But - WK2Jeeps.com states 75W85 for the front and 75W85 with friction modifier for the rear (without ELSD) exactly as you note. Both these oils have different Mopar part numbers.
I would like to ask which is actually correct - the manual and Redline - or WK2Jeeps?
I've had excellent information from WK2Jeeps.com before and no reason to think they would not be right.
John
John,
I think you meant, "...75W85 with friction modifier for the rear (with ELSD)...".

Friction modifiers are compounds that bind to metal surfaces reducing surface to surface contact friction. In LSDs the friction modifier is not needed to reduce friction but to act as a cushioning agent to smooth the operation of the wet clutch. Without it the LSD may shudder stressing the diff and increasing tyre wear.

I don't know how the WK2 ELSD works but I imagine it is basically a wet clutch LSD that can be switched to either LSD on or LSD off as the traction control sees fit. What worries me is that it may need a precise amount of a specific friction modifier different to normal LSDs. Why I suspect think this is that in http://www.wk2jeeps.com/wk2_maintenance.htm#FAXLE it states, "Caution: ONLY use Mopar ELSD differential lubricant in the ELSD differential." It is unusual for Milous to be so specific about a Mopar product. He could have mentioned any number of friction modified diff oils.
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  #197  
Old 01-03-2014, 03:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobT View Post
it states, "Caution: ONLY use Mopar ELSD differential lubricant in the ELSD differential." .

I think what it means is that ELSD lubricant is specifically designed for ELSD. Don't use it for Non-ELSD.
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  #198  
Old 01-03-2014, 08:35 AM
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Re: Jeep service costs

The front diff is non LSD (ELSD or otherwise) therefore does not need the friction modifiers.

However diff oil with friction modifiers can be used in both LSD or non LSD diffs, but is usually more expensive, so that is why the two different oils are spec'd.

I would be interested from others that have had the dealer change their diff oils as to exactly what was put in. I well suspect that it will not be the Mopar products.
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  #199  
Old 01-03-2014, 06:27 PM
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Re: Jeep service costs

O dear, you are right Bob - put it down to fat fingers…….and thank you for pointing out my error….i had it right in my head…...

i am having trouble though locating the Redline locally, but did find Mobil 1 LS 75W90 available from GL Lubricants via Ebay.
Mobil 1 Synthetic Gear OIL LS 75W90 1 Quart Bottle | eBay
The price is very reasonable I reckon and as the oil is GL5 it will meet the specification.

Mobil 1 Synthetic Gear Lubricant LS 75W-90
3 quart bottles will do the trick, and no more running around or phone conversations with people that don't have a clue.
As an aside, I'm using the Mobil 1 Formula ESP engine oil.
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  #200  
Old 01-03-2014, 07:21 PM
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Re: Jeep service costs

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  #201  
Old 01-03-2014, 09:03 PM
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Re: Jeep service costs

Also, if you are considering using 75W-90 (as I am contemplating for next change due to towing that we do from time to time) you may want to consider the following:

Penrite Oil - A Better Class Of Oil
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  #202  
Old 01-04-2014, 01:33 AM
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Re: Jeep service costs

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmcrh View Post
I think what it means is that ELSD lubricant is specifically designed for ELSD. Don't use it for Non-ELSD.
Could be!
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  #203  
Old 01-04-2014, 01:41 AM
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Re: Jeep service costs

Quote:
Originally Posted by John47 View Post
O dear, you are right Bob - put it down to fat fingers…….and thank you for pointing out my error….i had it right in my head…...

i am having trouble though locating the Redline locally, but did find Mobil 1 LS 75W90 available from GL Lubricants via Ebay.
Mobil 1 Synthetic Gear OIL LS 75W90 1 Quart Bottle | eBay
The price is very reasonable I reckon and as the oil is GL5 it will meet the specification.

Mobil 1 Synthetic Gear Lubricant LS 75W-90
3 quart bottles will do the trick, and no more running around or phone conversations with people that don't have a clue.
As an aside, I'm using the Mobil 1 Formula ESP engine oil.
Sounds like a plan. Let us know how the Mobil 1 LS goes. Some have reported sduddering when used in standard LSDs of other makes. More friction modifier additive was required. However, perhaps it is just right for our ELSDs. Rumour has it Mopar oils are by Mobil anyway.

On second thoughts, since you do a lot of towing and often in heat, you should seriously consider 75W-140. This is what the manual specifies anyway. I think the reason they do this is that all Aussie GCs come with the tow package and we often tow in relatively high temperatures. Also I note that Redline previously called their 75W-85 "Lightweight Gear Oil" and your rig certainly isn't a lightweight.

Also, I can't see anything wrong with using the same friction modified oil (eg, Mobil 1 LS) in the front diff. Apart from not having an LSD, it is basically the same thing. There are really only two issues with using friction modifiers. Firstly, in gear boxes, it can disrupt synchromesh because synchromesh relies on a certain amount of friction. Secondly, when extreme pressure (EP) type friction modifiers are used in lightly loaded situations, they can build up layers eventually resulting in damage.
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  #204  
Old 01-04-2014, 09:34 AM
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Re: Jeep service costs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swampy View Post
Hi John

I always take Oil vendor websites with a pinch of salt as often they will recommend oils that may not strictly comply with specifications. Often they will use terms like "can be used" or "may be used where XXXX.xx is specified" and other loose terms. In reality they mean very little.

I've based my choice of using 75W-85 on info from:

WK2 Jeeps
2012_WK_fluid_specs.pdf
2012-WK U.S Owners Manual-6th.pdf
2014_wk_owners_manual_5th

All who specify 75W-85.

Penrite also specify the following "Manufacturer recommends Mopar Gear and Axle Lubricant 75W-85. For rear axle with ELSD Manufacturer recommends Mopar Gear and Axle Lubricant with Modifier 75W-85." but once again, I take Oil vendor recommendations with a pinch of salt, plus they don't do a GL5 75W-85.

So, I'm reasonably comfortable in that 75W-85 is right. For the record I used RedLine 75W-85 GL5 last time.
I hear what you're saying but it concerns me that the manual supplied in Australia specifies 75W-140 GL5. I would think one would be on safer ground relying on the manual that was supplied with the vehicle in Australia than the US owners manual or even WK2 Jeeps in the event of some problem. The warranty specifically refers to the owners manual in this regard:

9. SERVICE RECOMMENDATIONS
In addition to the routine maintenance service you should check (and correct if necessary) the following on a regular basis, as recommended in the vehicle’s owners manual/operating information:
• Tyre pressure/condition;
• Level of: Engine Oil, Coolant, Brake Fluid,
Windscreen Washer, Power Steering, Automatic
Transaxle and Clutch
(Hydraulic Clutch System only); and
• Lights/Indicators/Horn.

The owners manual specifies 75W-140 GL-5 on page 630 (2012 owners manual V.5):

Axle Differential (Front-Rear): MOPAR Synthetic Gear & Axle Lubricant SAE 75W-140 (API-GL5) or equivalent with friction modifier additive.

After reading the latest posts, I am unsure of which gear oil is the right one to use. I have purchased redline 75W140 for my service on Thursday, but if this is incorrect, I can still change it before then. What exactly is the difference between 75W85 and 75W140 in terms of application? I understand that they are different viscosities but is one more suited to towing and off road work than the other? If I put in the 75W140 and it turns out that 75W85 is the correct grade (or vice versa) is it likely to damage anything?

I will be contacting Jeep on Monday, and the dealer I am taking it to for service to try and get some clarification but I'm interested in what others here think.
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