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  #37  
Old 06-28-2011, 08:43 PM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marlin View Post
Or getting to an outback servo that only has the massive bowser neck, and it won't fit in the farking tank!
HAHA you been caught too.

In 2003 none of the servos here fitted my tank.
Thankfully now most have the smaller nozzle's.
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  #38  
Old 06-29-2011, 02:07 AM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

I dont understand the point...

I see from that chat the diesel is better since fuel consumption is less that HEMI.
But fuel consumption is evident if we make lot of road, right?

But more road, more maintenance, and diesel engine is more expansive than gasoline for that.
More road, more risks to beak turbocharger, injectors, EGR, DPF, fuel pump...
The HEMI is "simple" engine comparing turbodiesel, right?

So why diesel engine?
Furthermore the torque diagram of (new) diesels is like a "^" means the stress for all mechanical and specially the for gearbox is huge.

Pollution.... yes the brand new turbodiesel (since all is new inside) may give less pollution than HEMI, but what about after one or 2 years?

To have V6 CRD into GC is just marketing issue, but no real need.

Am wrong?
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  #39  
Old 06-29-2011, 04:55 AM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

Franco, I suggest you read more about the CRD as all of your points are wrong.
The fuel consumption is nearly HALF of the Hemi, this does not make any difference how much driving you do, it will always be half. The cost of the CRD motor option is the SAME as a Hemi (in Australia atleast) and the maintenance will be very similar. The service intervals will be 10,000km for the CRD and 12,000 for the V6/V8.
The CRD is a much tougher engine as are all diesels and are designed for a very long life if services correctly. I would not expect it to cost any more or less than a Hemi in maintenance. The torque band peak is between 2000-4000rpm, this spread of power is not much different to the hemi, but the CRD has MORE TORQUE than the Hemi. I am sure that Jeep have engineered the gearbox and driveline to handle this amount of torque.
A CRD will always be better as far as emissions is conserned, as time does not affect polution, unless you are referring to the DFP system. This just needs a good run to clean out.
The CRD will be the most popular model of motor sold in Europe, it is the ONLY motor sold in the UK, so I think it is more than just marketing, you really need to read more about this and get off your old way of thinking. The CRD is also only 3/10ths slower than a Hemi to 62mph/100km/h.....
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  #40  
Old 06-29-2011, 06:15 AM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

I am sure most here have not driven a modern diesel.
I am only getting the HEMI now mostly for the fun factor.
I will be keeping my 2003 GC CRD mostly for going out to the mine sites. Don't want to dirty the new one.
It ha done me well gone across OZ a couple of times towing trailers.
Been out to Giles a couple of times. Not too much fuel out that way, but mines always have diesel.
The 2.7lt crd 5cyl is very perky, very smooth, great power for overtaking (55m road trains).
This is an engine running on 12 year old technology from Mercedes.
The new engine CRD to old CRD, I think it would be like chalk and cheese.
There is a big market out there for these engines and I think the US just needs to catchup in that respect and accept the CRD's. They do have their place.
Once you use one to two a caravan you will know why!
You don't need a monster truck to tow, a SUV CRD is perfect, and they are a great arround town car.
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  #41  
Old 06-29-2011, 07:02 AM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

My experience:

I am in Italy, I had 2 GC CRDs
a)
From mid 2003 till mid 2006 the 2.7 and made 90.000km
b)
From mid 2006 till mid 2011 the 3.0 and made 170.000km
Normally I made 35.000km year.

I ordered HEMI Overland now.

for a)
I spent just for maintenance, but at 80.000km I changed the injectors (around 1500 Euros cost)
for b)
I changed 2 times the turbocharger, 1 x EGR, the preheating candles, the electric starter motor + rotor, now I have problem with injectors.
I spent over 10.000 Euros! + the time to wait the reparation (around one week/10 days every time)

Please note, all the maintenance was made by official dealer.

The new CRD 3.0 average is 8km/liter (dont trust catalogs!)
Assuming the Hemi is average 6km/liter

I do 35.000 km means here in Italy the fuel cost is
Euros 6200 for diesel
Euros 8700 for gasoline

Talking by dealer, maintenance cost for HEMI is bit cheaper than CRD, ok we can assume is same.
So the cost for me for Hemi is just 2000/3000 Euros more every year more than CRD at pump.

Here the cost for Overland CRD and HEMI is same around 60.000 Euros. Assurance cost is same.
I will keep the HEMI for at least 5/6 years means till 170/200.000km, I just want change oil, filters not engine components anymore.

The torque of new CRD is bit bigger than HEMI torque, but the way to supply power is "scorbutic", not progressive as HEMI. (please check the diagrams, just see the max torque number is not significant).
This give problem to gearbox, many times go in protection mode.
The gearbox is the same MERCESES gerabox of old CRD.
May be the next ZF will be better.

Please note VM CRD is new engine and very complicate engine.
The dealers are very worry here since the reliability is big "question mark"...
VM engine may be is GOOD, but what bout all components? TURBO, PUMP, EGR, DPF, INJECTORS, etc etc?

All diesels and are designed for a very long life if services correctly, sorry am not agree for the new diesel for cars.
All new diesels have huge problems, BMW, AUDI, VW, Land Rover, Nissan, Toyota etc etc.
All my friends here run diesels, all are very happy for first 6 months.
Than for the rest they prefer dont talk.

So on the catalogs new CRD is better, into real world HEMI is better.

I drove both, the new CRD and the HEMI Overland,CRD has like a truck sound, the HEMI has better/quiet sound, no turbolag, more progressive.
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  #42  
Old 06-29-2011, 07:18 AM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

280,000km on my 2003 crd only engine problem was a water pump at 260,000km and fuel pump O rings $2 a set.
I do all my own maintenance run 10w40 Fuchs full synthetic.
Ryco oil and fuel filters 10k services 60k on fuel filters and cotton washable air filters.
Don't understand why you have done injectors and turbo would suspect bad fuel (water in fuel, ethanol) or dirt in the intake.
I come from a mining background workshops and driving trucks, now in IT.
Never seen any diesels have injectors done that early or turbos.
Unless and engine was dusted, run without air-filter or holes in the filter.
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  #43  
Old 06-29-2011, 07:33 AM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

May be not lucky!
Or since here we drive high speed on higway (around 150Km/h) the engine will overheat.
By the way, many many here has problem with CRDs not just me many cars, suv, sedan etc etc...
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  #44  
Old 06-29-2011, 08:21 AM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

You may find the problem with the CRD's in Italy are more due to not looking after the car right. You cannot just shut them down, you need to ensure the turbo is spooled down before shutoff. As for problems with the other makers with CRD, I do not agree. Audi/Merc/BMW are going all in for Diesel as the fuel of the future. These companies would not be investing as much effort in CRD if it was a bad technology as they have warranties and customers who will not tollerate it. I think you are just being biased as you did not have a good experience. I highly doubt it will overheat at 150km/h as the motor will be ticking over in its powerband at about 1600rpm.
By your number the Hemi is going to cost you over $12,500 Euros more than the CRD over 5 years. In conjunction with the better resale of the CRD, you are going to be massivley out of pocket by your decision. While I think the Hemi is a great motor, it is 30yo tech and a fuel guzzler. Just wait until the EU starts really taxing petrol guzzlers, you will be paying over $3EU per litre and then you will wish you had gotten another CRD.
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  #45  
Old 06-29-2011, 09:14 AM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

Time ago, here the price ratio between gasoline and diesel was 1.5:1
So many went for diesel.
Now ratio is 1.07:1
I think for future the ratio will be 1:1

About selling price after 5 years and 200.000km is unpredictable.
I spent for 2006 CRD 52.000 Euros, now the value is 12.500 Euros.
So this time I went for HEMI, dealer give me 10% discount on price list.

I can deduct from taxes the 80% of the fuel cost, so now the true cost for me is 0.3 Euros liter.
As the gasoline will be 3 Euros liter for me will be 0.6, means still cheap.

I think noone will buy a new Grand Cherokee since really NEED it, but because LIKE it... So HEMI or CRD is just a part of what we like or not.
We really need leather inside?
Or quadralift? Or most of the stuff the Overland has?

The 95% of the things I do with my GC now, I can also do with a new 10.000 Euros PANDA, or with a 1000 Euros 10 year old used Mercedes... Just less faster and less confortable may be.

As You will get the CRD, please post Your feeling.
Have You tested the CRD and HEMI too?
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  #46  
Old 06-29-2011, 09:40 AM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

Forgot I have a turbo timer fitted.

Enforcer the fact he has done injectors at 80,000 would suggest to me bad fuel, if they get ethanol or methanol in their diesel will brake down the water into the diesel and stuff the injectors.
Maybe Italy has bad diesel. That's why they are all having trouble with CRD's over there.
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  #47  
Old 06-29-2011, 10:19 AM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

A lot of people will not admit using bad fuel or do service irregular. When problems appear then engine is not good. On my previous 2.7 CRD one injector was changed at 250 000 km. Turbo is original and the jeep is with my son now and run without problem. Yes, of course there is possibility of a lemon or stealer just found somebody to "milk" telling him that this and that have to be changed because there is a problem.
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Old 06-29-2011, 10:22 AM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

First, I'd want the Hemi cause I'm Macho, like bigger is better HP, etc, and use it.

Second, I'd want the Hemi in Europe just to avoid getting squashed on the Autobahn. American Muscle and all.

Third, I'm neither Euro or a Sissy. + rep for that comment from above.

Fourth, the Hemi performs under speed/towing/subzero conditions, is well matched to the transmission, is easy and inexpensive to service, and is a wash at least in the US for maintenance and overall gas prices.

All that said, I'd be less flippant once the new diesel powerplant gets run through the traps and shows performance and serviceability. If the promise of speed, torque, serviceability, and better MPG/emissions is there then the OP's rhetorical question would already be answered.
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