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Old 06-26-2011, 04:13 PM
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Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

Ok, so i was browsing the europe version of the jeep website... http://www.jeep.co.uk/ ... to get some exact specs on the CRD and all I can say is wow. I can't wait until the diesel hits the US late next year (hopefully).

City MPG = 27
Highway MPG = 39!!!!!
Combined MPG = 34
HP = 237
Torque = 406

That's damn near 40mpg!

Most cars in the US can't even hit that kind of mileage.

Here's my thinking -- the sterotypical man in the US is stuck on the "macho" attitude. Must have most horsepower, biggest engine, etc. But really, who actually uses it? Now I am being somewhat of a hypocrit since I drive a 4.7 99' WJ, but bought it when I was younger The older I get, the more I notice I just really don't need the power. I don't drive like an angry driver, 99% of the time I'm on pace with the old man next to me. Now it is nice to have the power when I get some road rage or need to pass, but really how often is that? Once a week maybe?

Honestly, how can any intelligent person think the HEMI or 3.6 is a better overall option than the CRD?

You are literally doubling your combined MPG from 17 to 34. If you drive 10,000 miles a year, that's nearly $100/month in savings. Yes I know diesel costs more, but its close enough to not be a factor. Plus you have at least the same towing ability, if not more.

So, I personally will be waiting til 2013 to get the WK2 CRD... can someone really come up with a good reason for the HEMI?

And those of you with unlimited cash flow, no need to chime in

UPDATE:
Upon further review, some of those figures would have to be slightly adjusted for different units of measurement, but still I can't see good reason for a HEMI over the CRD.

And I apologize again, after reading some threads, it seems this issue has come up before and there are opinions on either side.

But I'm still sticking to the CRD side
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Old 06-26-2011, 04:25 PM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

Those are imperial gallons so MPG in US gallons will be less. Despite that, the CRD will be the engine of choice for me too.
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Old 06-26-2011, 04:30 PM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

Yes upon further review, some of those figures would have to be slightly adjusted, but still I can't see good reason for a HEMI over the CRD.

And I apologize again, after reading some threads, it seems this issue has come up before and there are opinions on either side.

But I'm still sticking to the CRD side
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Old 06-26-2011, 04:32 PM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

Some things you need to convert before you go off the deep end.

The engine numbers are in European spec. The US numbers are 237 HP 405 lb/ft.

The fuel mileage is based on Imperial Gallons, not US gallons. It also IS NOT the approved EPA testing cycle so that all must be taken into account.

For comparison on an equivalent vehicle, the VW Touareg 3.0TDI.

UK mileage: 33/43
US mileage: 19/28

Jeep numbers

UK mileage: 27/39
US Mileage (est): 16/25

Still a lot better than either the V6 or the Hemi and certainly great numbers for a 5000 lb SUV.
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Old 06-26-2011, 04:52 PM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

For a SUV a diesel can be the perfect match. It has the torque but fuel economy. The only drawback is the cost usually in the winter. As on average it has been more expensive vs. premium by .25 per gallon.

Prior to committing to JGC Overland w/ Hemi, I almost signed a deal for a BMW X5 diesel. However production doesn't begin until late September maybe October. With an average fuel economy of 24 mpg highway (70-75 mph) plus respectable performance it was an easy choice vs. the other engines.

I would be surprised to see the Hemi engine in the JGC in future models. CAFE requirements will dictate it.




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Old 06-26-2011, 06:12 PM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

while i understand i might be the minority on this but i don't think it's worth it.
mostly because like you pointed out mpg, people quickly look at that w/out taking into consideration a lot of other things.

like for example:
a). cost of diesel is higher
b). will it have urea (mostlikely) then you'll need AdBlue, it's not free
c). will it have regen particulate filter? hope and pray that doesn't go out when you're out of warranty, costly!
d). specific oil mostlikely which on average like other diesels that are available now, it's more expensive than a good synthetic.
e). pumps, pumps, pumps, see the pumps issues in TDI and BMW diesel, as well as recalls on Mercedes Bluetecs, high pressure pumps don't like USA diesel, which has no lubricity.
f). did i mention our diesel quality is horrible? you'll need to add a diesel additive, again not free.
g). fuel filter changed every 20k again not free

so is that gap in mpg still that big as just firstly glanced at the paper?????
i think not

now with just those out of the way, think about it, it's a new engine, from VM Motori not from Mercedes, will you be the test driver for them on your dime to "save" a few mpg?

i know i won't lol
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Old 06-26-2011, 06:23 PM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

A few pros for clean diesel engines:

-higher torque
-better mileage
-cleaner emissions than gas engines
-and for us Canadians: diesel fuel cheaper than regular gas and readily available.

One con:

-costs more than the V6 (usually)
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Old 06-26-2011, 06:42 PM
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Stop talking bad about my hemi, thanks.
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Old 06-26-2011, 06:47 PM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

Some valid points. I guess we'll have to wait and see what the actual MPG numbers are when/if it is released in the US... and that difference between the V6 and HEMI will determine if it is worth it.

Otherwise I'll probably still go with the V6.

The MPG on the V8 just is not up to 2011 standards to me... Full size vehicles w/ V8 are getting better mpg. Jeep needs to step it up.
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Old 06-26-2011, 07:14 PM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

I ordered the hemi, primarily because 259kW > 177kW

AWWWW YEAH!
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Old 06-26-2011, 07:28 PM
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Re: Just browsing Jeep.com Europe, and WOW, why would you buy a HEMI?!

You know you can spend a lot of money trying to save 1, 2, or 3 mpg.

I've been driving a cummins diesel for over 6 years. I love the torque and pulling power of the diesel, and the fact that is is near impossible to stall but it is not nearly as fun to drive as the Hemi. Something like the turtle and the hare.

Diesels have a narrow optimum rpm range, however, run outside the range and take at least a 10% hit, easily a 20% hit in fuel economy. They take forever to warm up and offer no engine braking. You will kill them making short trips unless you keep them idling.. which will kill the injectors. Up until very recently diesel fuel was 10 to 25 cents more than premium gas in the US, over 50 cents a gallon more than regular. You would need over 15% real mpg to break even on fuel cost, and thats before factoring in the additional initial investment.

Diesels are not clean by any means, an old wives tale. The combustion byproducts are more noxious than gas, but can be cleaned up with a lot of heavy, power robbing filters, and expensive technology.

Some Diesels, like the cummins, can run on about any fuel, kerosene, vegetable oil, diesel fuel and easily reach 500,000 miles with little wear. When they break, however, they are very expensive to repair. They can be considered clean perhaps when run on vegetable oil, but the neighborhood smells like fries.

Some just love the oil burners, however.

So buy the diesel if thats what you need for towing or running the out back or city life... or because you just like them... but for cents per mile and cost of ownership, you need a pretty special case for the diesel to come anywhere close to the gas V8, let alone the gas V6.
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Old 06-26-2011, 07:43 PM
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Hey jamesla30, what he said.^^^^^.
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