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  #889  
Old 03-01-2014, 04:12 PM
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I've ordered I single hook for now. Can always add to it later. I must agree that the website is nice. Clean and functional.

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  #890  
Old 03-01-2014, 05:36 PM
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Re: No tow hooks? Front Recovery Soluition help

Apparently Cricks MtGravatt have a MY14 with tow hooks in the yard, might try to get down there this week and see how it fits. If the OEM hooks work on the latest MY14s I may end up going with those.
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  #891  
Old 03-01-2014, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barboots View Post
A tow point is generally suitable for applying adequate force to move a freely mobile vehicle. Breakdown towing. Additional loads could be up a tilt tray, perhaps with a minor rolling issue or perhaps out of a mild ditch. Not belly down in sticky ooze or wet sand. For the latter, recovery points are appropriate. They are coined due to their inherent strength which can tolerate winching loads and the force multiplication of "snatch" straps. Using a tow point beyond its capacity is where things get untidy. If they are all that's available, usually digging and then a gentle tow is the way forward. Cheers, Steve
Maybe I need to ask my question a different way, what are the benefits of the two options available from Chief for recovery. I almost needed this option on the weekend and realise that having a front recovery option is necessary. I'm going to order, but would like to know which option is best. The more confident you get with this vehicle, the further you are prepared to head into trouble.
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  #892  
Old 03-01-2014, 06:51 PM
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Hooks - Quick, easy attachment of straps directly.

Eyes - Stronger, better for winching rigs, straps can't jump off but require a shackle to be used.

Is that what you meant?

Cheers,
Steve
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  #893  
Old 03-01-2014, 07:04 PM
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Re: No tow hooks? Front Recovery Soluition help

Quote:
Originally Posted by bmackin View Post

@chocco - We're still a few months away on the seat covers.

Cheers,
Bill
Thanks Bill I will wait, not to long though
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  #894  
Old 03-01-2014, 07:07 PM
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Re: No tow hooks? Front Recovery Soluition help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Butts_Oz View Post
Maybe I need to ask my question a different way, what are the benefits of the two options available from Chief for recovery. I almost needed this option on the weekend and realise that having a front recovery option is necessary. I'm going to order, but would like to know which option is best. The more confident you get with this vehicle, the further you are prepared to head into trouble.
Hey Butts_Oz,

Here are some things to consider when choosing between our WK2 Recovery Hooks & WK2 Recovery Points, as well as whether it's best to choose 1 or 2 for your WK2.

The WK2 Recovery Hook provides a way to use a tow strap without the use of a Bow Shackle. This makes it easier and faster to connect to the vehicle. The trade off is - the open hook design is less strong, and a strap can fall off the open hook in some circumstances. Our hooks are VERY strong and we have a slight lip on the inside edge to help retain a strap, but there is no way to completely remove these trade offs.

The WK2 Recovery Point is a much stronger design, but requires the use of a bow shackle. This means connecting to the vehicle can take a bit more time, but it also guarantees the strap will not fall off during recovery. Some prefer not to use bow shackles during recovery for safety reasons, but since both are very strong closed loop designs there isn't much of a safety issue if they are connected properly. The mounting point on the frame of your WK2 would break long before either of these items gave way. In fact, this is probably the safest option available because it guarantees your strap remains attached, which can be a far greater safety issue.

When it comes to deciding between 1 or 2 recovery points on your vehicle. I would consider the following.
1. When using an equaliser strap attached to 2 recovery points, the force is spread over both recovery points. This doesn't half the force on each recovery point as many say, but it does significantly reduce the force on each recovery point. This has many benefits, especially on a unit body vehicle like the WK2.
2. Convenience. There are many times off-road where one recovery point is inaccessible (undermud, etc.) and having a 2nd recovery point becomes immensely valuable. I've also found that having a 2nd recovery point often provide much better recovery angles, especially when winching, on tight trails or during difficult off camber recoveries.

I hope that helps!

Cheers,
Bill
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  #895  
Old 03-02-2014, 01:25 AM
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Re: No tow hooks? Front Recovery Soluition help

Yep, I'd be looking at a second hook/loop for convenience. The other advantage of 2 recovery points and an equaliser strap is that the vehicle being towed has more freedom of direction. This is more important for winching than snatching where you have a constant tow along a track, and where you want to be able to steer around ruts or boulders, etc. A bit like a picture hook does with a wire strung between 2 ends of the frame.
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Old 03-02-2014, 02:00 AM
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It's as important for snatching.

Ciao,
Steve
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  #897  
Old 03-02-2014, 02:15 AM
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Re: No tow hooks? Front Recovery Soluition help

I don't see how, it's a one off tug. The only issue I can see for snatching is reducing the load on any one mount point. Like Bill said it isn't half, but it does reduce it.

Angles of force on the frame doesn't make much sense, it is braced between the rails and monocoque frame, the load is spread by it's design probably more so than a ladder frame would be. Weather you hold it by one corner or 2 corners, the forces are distributed internally in the same way.

There use to be quite a bit of talk about this when Pajeros came out, that you had to distribute the weight between recovery hooks because the monocoque design was weaker than a ladder chassis. But I don't think that argument has held up. And even if we did think the monocoque design is weaker, does it make sense to increase the loads we can put though it with doubling up the amount of pressure we can send through it with 2 points?

I found the MMA engineers doing testing, pretty low weight recoveries though:



Just my thoughts of course, I can understand others have differing opinions.
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  #898  
Old 03-02-2014, 03:33 AM
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I'm not referring to breaking issues BennO... "lines of force" refers to the whole recovery assemblage including both cars and their planned direction. The issue I'm trying to convey is sideways shift when the recovery points don't align with the forward projection of the vehicles as the recovery takes place. The slew sideways can be quite significant.



This is one scenario. Add greasy slime at the recovering vehicle's position and it can happen. Too much gusto or rapid regaining of grip can see the bogged vehicle inadvertently "going bush".

It's much harder to draw the example of the effect on a sloping beach recovery, however this is where I've seen more of the problem in practice.

All I really want is for others to end up with recovery provisions which should never let them down one day. I've witnessed this issue numerous times, and know you can't always re-rig to avoid it when you only have a corner to pull on... or from. However I'll time out on this one now to avoid sounding like I'm stamping my foot over it.

Over'n'out,
Steve
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Old 03-02-2014, 03:46 AM
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Re: No tow hooks? Front Recovery Soluition help

http://www.amhslions.com/Tauser%20We...r%20Packet.pdf

Maybe a little lesson in vectors?

The trouble with this however is that I'm not smart enough to work out the effect of side slip on a muddy track.
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Old 03-02-2014, 05:05 AM
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Re: No tow hooks? Front Recovery Soluition help

Love the drawing Steve.
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