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The Towing thread

314K views 2K replies 156 participants last post by  SouthernComfort 
#1 ·
Please place your queries and comments regarding towing, towbars, wiring, Brake Controllers, and any other Aussie towing matters here.

This way the information will be contained, and others will not need to plough though other irrevelent threads to find info.
 
#322 · (Edited)
Here are the instructions from my P2.
4 wires are exiting the unit.
I can scan this tomorrow if it needs to be clearer.



 
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#323 ·
Here are the instructions from my P2.
4 wires are exiting the unit.
I can scan this tomorrow if it needs to be clearer.
posting from app so may screw or double up images.



Thanks Snuke!,

Looks like they are the same units, the Aussie dealers must wire it some special way to get it to trigger the stop lights. Also from last night, we came to the realization of course the entire electrical system in the Jeep for 2014 is different, so whatever method they used to do may not work with LED tail lights.
 
#325 ·
Okay, now I remember. The trigger wire that comes from the COLD side of the brake switch (red wire) will be energised by the brake controller when the override lever is used. This is effectively the same as closing the brake pedal switch when you put your foot on the pedal. Depending on the design of the brake switch (single or double pole, + or - switched) this will determine whether using the override will disconnect the cruise control or not. Will check my Prado today, as Pricks Cars still has my GC. (Takes a lot to comply these Aussie-bound cars) :D

As a side thought, I was just wondering whether Jeeps are (-) switched at the brake pedal? This would explain why some auto elecs are tapping elsewhere in the loom and causing problems.
 
#326 ·
The problem has nothing to do with the way they have wired the brake controller.
It is the fact that they have not used the correct Jeep loom for the MY14 and the CAN BUS system for the rear lights.
I think that on the MY14 all the rear light are controlled by the can bus individually and are not linked together like the MY12/13 and that is the reason I only have the LHS brake light coming on when I use the brake controller.
I have heard the MY14 loom has a control box built in to it to work with the CAn BUS.
 
#332 ·
I think if you don't have a brake controller you will never know you have a modified loom and I don't think it will cause any problems.
 
#334 ·
With respect Brad, it has everything to do with how they've wired your controller. It all depends where they've put the red wire. As I think I mentioned in a previous post - it has probably been tapped in downstream of the brake light ECU (if it has one). I suspect there are three isolated lamp outputs (for bulb failure motoring purposes) and your electrician has tapped into the left hand brake lamp circuit.

It would make sense that the MY14 towing loom would have some system to integrate all 3 lamps coming on simultaneously by adding the input for the brake lights (red wire from the controller) UPSTREAM of the brake light ECU.

Hope this makes sense. :)
 
#335 ·
This only make sense if such a signal actually exists upstream. As I understand it, upstream from the ECU is a CAN bus. Somewhere else on the CAN bus, some ECU is putting the brake signal onto the CAN bus. That ECU would presumably be connected to a sensor on the brake pedal, that would be the only upsream location. The question is, is this sensor compatible with the P3? i.e. is it a simple switch with the hot side connected to 12v+ that closes when the brake is pressed. Can it be interrupted when the P3 back-feeds the brake signal?
 
#336 ·
That's feasible, Coreys. And that is the question, which is probably why the MY14 has a different tow wiring harness to the MY13.

In the absence of any other info, I reckon the MY14 harness has its own "turn brake lights on" signal through the CAN.

All this is speculation until someone gets a look at the wiring diagram.......
 
#337 ·
After xdra10's comments yesterday, I emailed my dealer(Alex at Suttons) and he confirmed that his records show me having the MY14 harness fitted. I decided to have a look under the back of the car yesterday to see if I could see any stickers on the visible part of the loom. I was in luck:
Side 1
------
Desc: GRAND CHEROKEE MY14
Batch #: 700A.22.07.13
Lot # F7596
MADE IN TAIWAN

Side 2
------
Part #: AUS2014WKTBWL

Below is a link to some photos (if JG allows it).

https://plus.google.com/photos/1044...s/5927329548726195249?authkey=COKWsIDUyrWEuAE
 
#338 ·
After xdra10's comments yesterday, I emailed my dealer(Alex at Suttons) and he confirmed that his records show me having the MY14 harness fitted. I decided to have a look under the back of the car yesterday to see if I could see any stickers on the visible part of the loom. I was in luck:
Side 1
------
Desc: GRAND CHEROKEE MY14
Batch #: 700A.22.07.13
Lot # F7596
MADE IN TAIWAN

Side 2
------
Part #: AUS2014WKTBWL

Below is a link to some photos (if JG allows it).

https://plus.google.com/photos/104474029844683617024/albums/5927329548726195249?authkey=COKWsIDUyrWEuAE
Any signs of splicing?
 
#340 ·
Dropped my jeep off at the dealers this morning so they could look at the brake light issue with the brake controller and the service guy told my that he could not promise me that he would be replacing the jeep modified loom.
I told him I wanted it replaced with the correct MY14 and I got no response.
Not Happy.
Will see what they have done when I go pick up the Jeep.
 
#341 ·
Just picked up jeep from the dealer and they have fixed nothing...
They have no idea why only 1 brake light comes on when you use the brake controller.

They told me the MY14 loom (AUS2014WKTBL) is still solder in and has no ECU in it.

The dealer has logged the issue and will advise me what Jeep say.

Not sure what to do now, It is not a big problem but I just feel if one brake light comes on they should all come on.

Will be waiting to see if anyone else can get all 3 jeep lights to work when the use the manual override on their brake controller.

Cheers Brad.
 
#342 · (Edited)
For those in the Brisbane Area Have there been any UConnect upgrades completed in the Brisbane area by Jeep dealerships? I haven't heard anything from my dealer and I am wondering if SEQLD have received their update yet? For the JG community, does anyone know if and when there will be a map update for the navigation system?

Sorry guys, wrong thread .....
 
#343 ·
Just had my P3 and Anderson plug fitted by Gibbos at Belmont. The P3 has been fitted into the cubby, but it is a little forward and the cubby door wont close completely. The Gibbos team tell me that hey couldn't get it back any further and still operate the manual over ride. Do any of you have a similar problem, or am I being fed a line.

Cheers:confused:
 
#345 ·
Just had my P3 and Anderson plug fitted by Gibbos at Belmont. The P3 has been fitted into the cubby, but it is a little forward and the cubby door wont close completely. The Gibbos team tell me that hey couldn't get it back any further and still operate the manual over ride. Do any of you have a similar problem, or am I being fed a line. Cheers:confused:
No issues with my P3 fitting and the door closes with heaps of room. As you can see, I have full access to the manual override.
 

Attachments

#348 ·
My P3 also fits in the cubby with the door closed. Mind you, mine is a MY12.
It could be that you need to remove the cubby, slot the holes so that you can move it back a mm or 2, and put it back together. Not a big job to do, but daunting if you have never pulled the console apart before. You will probably not get any satisfaction by going back to the sparky, as they are really only concerned in the electric side, rather than the cosmetic.
If you are down NW Sydney way, I can assist you to fix.
 
#349 ·
Cheers.

I am quite disappointed with Gibbos. I removed the P3 this morning, and there is plenty of room in the cubby. The problem seems to be that there is a pronounced lip on the bottom of the cubby at the front. Using the standard mounting plate, unless the P3 is quite forward, the lip stops easy access to the manual lever. Raising the P3 a couple of CM fixes this and it can be mounted much further back. I am disappointed with Gibbos, they have taken the easy way out here, and I was horrified to find that they used self tappers to attach the P3 to the bracket, rather than the machine screws which should be used. I will make up a taller bracket and reinstall myself.

thanks all for your help and advice.
 
#361 ·
With only 2/3rds the brake lights working and the cruise control not switching off, could this problem be a non compliant ADR issue? Even if the manual override is not used under normal conditions, it still is available to use on the road.

Warren
 
#362 ·
So is the hand break on most cars and that usually does not light the brake lights. Usually you connect to the switch on the brake pedal but that could have other issues. For example no trailer brakes for adaptive cruise control.
 
#363 ·
As I briefly mentioned, yesterday I installed my extra electrics for the camper trailer. I'll go through what I did in case it helps someone else. Basically, I needed to wire my P3 brake controller and put an Anderson(or 3) at the rear of the vehicle.

Warning... this is long. Prepare to get bored.

The first step, was finding a neat way to run all of the cables

I started my approach in a probing fashion to figure out the most efficient way to do the install. I started in the boot, took out the floor, including the gap hider and scuff plate. Next was the "load floor bin" I undid the two rear nuts but when I came to the front "screws" I found out that the trim removal guide was wrong, they were not screws but bolts with tiny nuts underneath that were really fiddly to touch, just above the QL tank. I decided that if I tried to remove these, it would be easy to loose the nuts and especially hard to get back together again.I figured out at this point that the load floor bin had quite a bit of flex and I could tilt it up quite steeply.

I started the steps to remove the D pillar trim but it also looked to be quite hard and also depended on having the load floor bin out. Instead I decided to try finding a nice place to feed the cables through. First I removed some of the trim around near the rear drivers side door. I always keep on hand some plastic "tongues " that were left over from some MDF panels when we renovated the house. Basically, they are a few metres long by about 4mm x 12mm. I managed to poke them through behind the quarter panel to come out behind said door. I then fed the strip down through a nice crevice below the carpet till I got to the B pillar(the one between front and rear seats). At this point, I taped my cables to the plastic strip and pulled them through. At this point, I was pulling through 2 x 8G (Power and Ground for the Anderson's) and a twin core 6mm for the Brake controller(1 for the brake line and another for the stop signal, sure 6mm is overkill for the stop signal).

From the B piller, it was easy to shoot the 2 8G cables through to the battery box as well as another twin 6mm for brake controller power. This left me with 2 twin 6mm cables to get to the front. Here it must have taken me about 30-40 minutes to get my plastic strip fed through under the plastic sub-floor from the B pillar to the A pillar, it might be easier just to put it under the carpet. It wasn't easy to lift up any of the subfloor, especially near the front of the drivers seat. I assume you need to remove the seat first. Anyhow, I finally got it through and was able to pull my cables through, from there it was fairly easy feeding them up behind the dash. I found that at the top of the media bay, there is a kind of duct between it and the instruments above. By half closing the media bay door, I was able to stick my plastic strip in above the door, down the crevice until it came out above the park brake. I drew my cables back through, routing them behind the door and was able to bring them out into the media bay without a single hole. From here it was easy to solder the 4 cores to the P3 cable, remembering their crappy colour code... Black for 12+, really.

For connection to the battery, I had two circuit breakers, I mounted them both to a timber board to wedge against the battery as I saw mentioned earlier. 1 Breaker for the Andersons and another for the brake controller.

For the Anderson connectors, things got a little more complex, well, more complex than my Subie. In my Subie, the Anderson at the rear is permanent power, just protected by a breaker. I've got a CTek D250S Solar+alternator DC-DC charger in the camper. It's alternator input has a 13.somthing threshold to activate only when the engine is running. Of course, in the GC, the variable alternator means that the voltage may be lower even when the engine is running. The solution here is to use the "solar" input of the D250S which does not have the voltage check. Problem is, I don't want to flatten the GC battery running the fridge and charging the camper while the engine is not running. Simple solution is to put a relay in the boot. I decided to also put 2 anderson connectors in the boot itself, one permanent and one switched.

Only issue with this, is getting to a switched 12v signal wire. I've heard the cig lighter being used but that's not ideal because it comes on with accessories, I want to to come on only when the engine is running, or at least while the ignition is on. Also, I didn't know how to get to the cig lighter without pulling all of the trim off. Oh, and there would be a problem if I ever wanted to move the fuse to have the cig powered permanently, though there is always my permanent anderson. The solution came to me as the spotlight dock! I checked and it is (as is optimal for charging the spotlight) switched with ignition! Here came the feed for my relay!

Anyhow, I tested it all today and everything is working fine. Except someone forgot to tell the GC that it's towing a thousand kg of camper trailer and it's supposed to go more slowly, silly car:).
 
#364 ·
Life would have been a lot easier for you if you took that trim, which you hesitated to do, out. It really is easy to remove.
You can change the power connection to that rear accessory power outlet, by changing the fuse position. That way it would be live all the time. But an easier way would be to add an additional outlet, and feed it from the Anderson plug power cable.
 
#366 ·
Just a thought! Those guys with brake light issues on their MY14s, have you had the CPU reflashed for towing? This properly activates the tow wiring. I understand that all Aussie Grands come with the tow group as standard but the tow bar itself as a dealer fitted option. Those that have fitted their own tow bars on ealier WK2's have had to get them reflashed.
 
#369 ·
I hate to be lazy but there are 31 pages here to try and wade through and I figured it would just be easier to ask the question. Is anyone doing an aftermarket tow bar for the MY14 yet?

Its been over three months trying to settle a price with my dealer for genuine accessories, including them claiming that the MY13 accessories I had a signed contract for before changing vehicles "didnt include fitting" (what, were they just going to hand me my mudflaps, rock rails, tow bar, wiring loom, skid plates etc....) Frankly I am sick of their BS and if there is an alternative that would be nice.
 
#371 · (Edited)
There is a Hayman Reese bar for the earlier WK2s. I'd be surprised if it didn't fit the MY14. You would need to check with HR. I bought the Aussie Mopar bar from the local stealer and fitted it myself. It was a piece of cake. However, I understand that the wiring harness is different in the MY14s so watch that. Regarding the other items, if you want them fitted properly, fit them yourself. This is particularly true for you in Darwin. We understand from other posts that your one and only dealer for 1,400km is an incompetent sh**.
 
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#380 ·
Ha, unfortunately not!

Those skids plates came in handy on my trip, Steve. There were a number of large rocks that I was saved from.
I'll give you a buzz soon for when you need a hand doing yours. Might be able to this weekend.

I'm sure it'll be a heap quicker than mine were!
 
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