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  #25  
Old 04-29-2014, 02:42 PM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

My Scanguage II caused faults (ODB2 freakout) when I set it to a different protocol other than CANSF. Our Jeeps are CANSF based. Reset any faults and you should be fine.

The Torque app shows both CAT Temp and EGT. The CAT Temp is downstream and the EGT is upstream. EGT is fairly instantaneous which leads me to believe the sensor is somewhere between the exhaust manifold and the turbo. The CAT Temp is slow and lags several seconds behind EGT. It is after the DPF and is a good indicator of regen. When it shows 1100+ F, its in regen.

For those lurking and trying to make a decision, I am an engineer so I enjoy monitoring and understanding my equipment. As a hobbyist, its fun to discuss it. If the GC Diesel is operated in a normal cycle that includes 50+ mph speeds of reasonable duration, monitoring and/or being concerned with DPF issues isn't necessary. Fuel it up and drive it!
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  #26  
Old 04-29-2014, 04:37 PM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

I'm an engineer as well, so the opportunity to collect data definitely piques my interest.

I will have to start logging so I can examine the data further.
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Old 04-29-2014, 05:09 PM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

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Originally Posted by ExcursionDiesel View Post
For those lurking and trying to make a decision, I am an engineer so I enjoy monitoring and understanding my equipment. As a hobbyist, its fun to discuss it. If the GC Diesel is operated in a normal cycle that includes 50+ mph speeds of reasonable duration, monitoring and/or being concerned with DPF issues isn't necessary. Fuel it up and drive it!
I've not been concerned, but I do want to give you a big thumbs up. Good info, and solid advice.

Kudos.
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  #28  
Old 04-29-2014, 06:17 PM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

I'm a recovered engineer, and have been slide-rule free for 30 years....
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  #29  
Old 04-29-2014, 08:28 PM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

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Originally Posted by ExcursionDiesel View Post
For those lurking and trying to make a decision, I am an engineer so I enjoy monitoring and understanding my equipment. As a hobbyist, its fun to discuss it. If the GC Diesel is operated in a normal cycle that includes 50+ mph speeds of reasonable duration, monitoring and/or being concerned with DPF issues isn't necessary. Fuel it up and drive it!
I highly appreciate your input about DPF as well. I was highly enthusiastic about getting the EcoDiesel and not the HEMI - but after all those issues popping up recently, I'm not so sure anymore.

I'm driving about 11K miles/year and don't do any towing. Crunching some numbers, fuel on the HEMI is about $70/month more. However, considering the higher maintenance cost and higher price on the engine itself, the cost-advantage of the EcoDiesel is only about $40/month.

I'm really starting to wonder if DEF, DPF and potentially having to perform more oil-changes on the Diesel (which aren't cheap, either) are actually worth it (the $40/month in savings was calculated with an annual oil-service on both engines. If I would have to bring in the Diesel 2 or even 3 times, the cost-advantage will almost be wiped out due to the high cost of these services).

So maybe I should go with the HEMI after all and accept the low MPGs in return for better performance?

Decisions, decisions...
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  #30  
Old 04-29-2014, 09:01 PM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

If your 11k is a frequent blend of city/hwy, I wouldn't expect any issues. The oil drain interval is 10k miles. It was discovered recently that the oil life system was not correct and called for earlier changes. That has been resolved with an update. I have one of the first delivered early builds and have had no issues. My first oil change was at 8800 with 8% remaining. I have 14k now.

As far as performance goes, if you drive the Hemi with performance in mind, your mpg will be much worse. Diesels don't lose as much efficiency when driven hard and the 3.0 will surprise you with its performance. Its very stout in the low and middle rpm range where most daily driving occurs. I have a tuner on mine and 6.7s 0-60 is on par with the Hemi...but I still get 26 mpg overall week after week.

Drive one if you get a chance.
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  #31  
Old 04-29-2014, 10:12 PM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ExcursionDiesel View Post
If your 11k is a frequent blend of city/hwy, I wouldn't expect any issues. The oil drain interval is 10k miles. It was discovered recently that the oil life system was not correct and called for earlier changes. That has been resolved with an update. I have one of the first delivered early builds and have had no issues. My first oil change was at 8800 with 8% remaining. I have 14k now.

As far as performance goes, if you drive the Hemi with performance in mind, your mpg will be much worse. Diesels don't lose as much efficiency when driven hard and the 3.0 will surprise you with its performance. Its very stout in the low and middle rpm range where most daily driving occurs. I have a tuner on mine and 6.7s 0-60 is on par with the Hemi...but I still get 26 mpg overall week after week.

Drive one if you get a chance.
Thanks for your input, ExcursionDiesel!

The last time I went to my local dealer, I had the opportunity to drive the EcoDiesel and I simply loved the immediate response due to its torque. I never owned or drove a Diesel before so I wanted to make sure that I knew what to expect. On paper, the 0-60 times don't look that impressive but that doesn't really matter on a daily basis - certainly not on an SUV. Boy, the Diesel really felt powerful - at least as good as the MY06 HEMI I previously owned.

I'm not driving too much on the highway but I'm not stuck in stop-and-go traffic, either. I'm not living in a city so most of my driving is on local State Roads, doing about 50 mph+. I'm planning on handing over the Jeep to my mother after one year. She's driving more than I do - and especially more highway-miles at 70 mph - so DPF certainly won't be an issue from there on.

BTW, in regards to DPF, does it actually matter how often you drive it or does it only matter how the vehicle is driven when you drive it? I assume since DPF is only about build-up, it shouldn't matter that much if you don't move the Jeep for 3 days as long as it gets to speed once its driven. I could be wrong though - as I said, I'm everything but an expert on Diesels.

The main reason why I'm leaning towards the diesel is its great MPG which isn't only a cost-saving factor but IMO, also a great convenience. In addition to that, I want something "new".

So I'd probably opt for the Diesel even if cost would be +/-0 compared to the HEMI.

After all, I still have 4 months to decide before ordering and by then (especially with the launch of MY15), the majority of discussed issues might be taken care of. I'll certainly keep an eye on it.

In that regards, this forum really is priceless and I'll gladly contribute to it by becoming an active supporter once my Jeep is ordered.
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Old 04-29-2014, 10:16 PM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

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Fuel it up and drive it!
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Old 04-29-2014, 10:25 PM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

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BTW, in regards to DPF, does it actually matter how often you drive it or does it only matter how the vehicle is driven when you drive it? I assume since DPF is only about build-up, it shouldn't matter that much if you don't move the Jeep for 3 days as long as it gets to speed once its driven.
You are correct, the DPF collects diesel soot, you get more soot build up during idle, particularly when the EGR is operating. If the engine isn't running, then no soot is being deposited in the DPF. Put your foot down and the EGR valve will close off giving you more power, then less soot is being generated and more heat is being generated, providing a bit of passive regeneration (burn off).

You can also get diesel additives that result in smaller soot particles being created, so more likely to burn off in passive regen.
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  #34  
Old 04-29-2014, 10:33 PM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

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Originally Posted by Benn0 View Post
You are correct, the DPF collects diesel soot, you get more soot build up during idle, particularly when the EGR is operating. If the engine isn't running, then no soot is being deposited in the DPF. Put your foot down and the EGR valve will close off giving you more power, then less soot is being generated and more heat is being generated, providing a bit of passive regeneration (burn off).

You can also get diesel additives that result in smaller soot particles being created, so more likely to burn off in passive regen.
Cool - thanks for letting me know.
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Old 04-30-2014, 11:24 AM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

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You can also get diesel additives that result in smaller soot particles being created, so more likely to burn off in passive regen.
This piqued my interest. Are there any negative side effects of using this stuff? Do you know any brand/product names that are recommended?
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  #36  
Old 04-30-2014, 01:52 PM
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Re: Does the DPF regen system make Diesel unusable as a full time work vehicle?

I googled a bit around and stumbled over this stuff. Based on the reviews, this shouldn't be too bad:

Amazon.com: Star brite Star Tron Enzyme Fuel Treatment Diesel Additive, 16 oz: Sports & Outdoors

Maybe somebody on this forum has some experience with this or a different product...
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