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Great price on EcoDiesel ACEA C3 approved oil...

7K views 24 replies 10 participants last post by  fun2drive 
#1 ·
Found this on Amazon. I've used Castrol and Mobil-1 ESP on my other BMW and VW diesels before, but never tried Total. At $28.xx for a 5qt jug, and based off some great VW TDI and earlier Jeep GC Mercedes diesel UOA's, I'm going to try it on my new EcoDiesel.

Total is one of the top five oil companies in the world, and this stuff is made in France.

Total Quartz Ineo Long Life 5w30

Amazon.com: TOTAL 188058-3PK Quartz INEO Long Life 5W-30 Engine Oil - 5 Quart (Pack of 3): Automotive

QUARTZ INEO LONG LIFE 5W-30 | Total Lubrifiants

Total QUARTZ INEO LL 5W-30 made by ELF - TDIClub Forums

 
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#3 ·
Note that it does NOT meet Chrysler's MS-11106 spec althought it does meet ACEA C3 and MB 229.51.

While under warranty, it is wisest to continue to use genuine Mopar parts and Chrysler recommended oils and fluids. And if you do it yourself, keep all documentation:thumbsup:.
 
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#4 · (Edited)
Chrysler's MS-11106 spec basically defers to Mercedes MB 229.51. Current Audi and VW TDI's use VW 504.00 / 507.00, and Porsche calls it C30. BMW refers to it as LL-04.

One thing to note is, this coming from a longtime VW TDI owner/fan, VW 502.00 / 505.01 is an older VW spec for the previous PD diesels in the 2000's, and is NOT approved for their newer TDI's with the HPFP running 2 bar (29,000 psi) piezo injectors; that's VW 504.00 / 507.00. I'm not using any oil unless it's also VW 507 approved, NOT VW 502.00/505.00

Total Quartz Ineo Long Life is ACEA C3 and MB 229.51 approved. If it ACEA C3 and MB 229.51, it (should) meet Chrysler's MS-11106 rating.

Attached is a formal reply from Chrysler about MS-11106 (basically saying it defers to MB 229.51,) posted by another user on another forum.
 

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#5 · (Edited)
From reading that document, it appears that Chrysler has its own testing procedures. HOWEVER, and more importantly, any oil manufacturer would be happy to add MS-11106 to their list of approvals IF and I say IF their oil(s) were approved by Chrysler.

In other words, if it doesn't MEET Chryslers MS-11106, it is NOT a Chrysler approved engine lubricant. I checked on the Total MSDS/Spec sheets section on their corporate website and FCA or Chrysler MS-11106 is not mentioned anywhere. You will see MB, BMW, Porsche and VW approvals mentioned....but not FCA.

And just because that document mentions and refers (not defers) to ACEA and MB it doesn't mean that MS-11106 is the same spec as MB, as the WK2 JGC uses a VM-Motori engine NOT an MB sourced motor.

Section 8. of the document (Dated 11/27/2013) actually refers to ENGINEERING APPROVED source list for lubricants.
Exxonmobil
Valvoline
Shell
Petronas
As being the only approved sources as of that date.

Here is a linky to an earlier post regarding the difference between MS-11106 and the MB spec

http://www.jeepgarage.org/f190/ms11106-attached-82069.html
 
#6 · (Edited)
From reading that document, it appears that Chrysler has its own testing procedures. HOWEVER, and more importantly, any oil manufacturer would be happy to add MS-11106 to their list of approvals IF and I say IF their oil(s) were approved by Chrysler.

In other words, if it doesn't MEET Chryslers MS-11106, it is NOT a Chrysler approved engine lubricant. I checked on the Total MSDS/Spec sheets section on their corporate website and FCA or Chrysler MS-11106 is not mentioned anywhere. You will see MB, BMW, Porsche and VW approvals mentioned....but not FCA.

And just because that document mentions and refers (not defers) to ACEA and MB it doesn't mean that MS-11106 is the same spec as MB, as the WK2 JGC uses a VM-Motori engine NOT an MB sourced motor.

Section 8. of the document (Dated 11/27/2013) actually refers to ENGINEERING APPROVED source list for lubricants.
Exxonmobil
Valvoline
Shell
Petronas
As being the only approved sources as of that date.

Here is a linky to an earlier post regarding the difference between MS-11106 and the MB spec

http://www.jeepgarage.org/f190/ms11106-attached-82069.html
Color me not terribly impressed with Chrysler's MS-11106 spec, and I'll cite their approval of Kendall's GT-1 5w30 Euro formula, as an example. In order to meet VW's 507.00 spec (as I referenced earlier and above,) you have to first have a 5w30 viscosity. If you click the product PDF page, it says that it's GT-1 5w30 oil is only VW 505.01 / 505.00 / 502.00 approved. That's the previous oil used on VW's PumpeDiesels TDI's w/o DPF's. No way I run an oil in the EcoDiesel that isn't simultaneously VW 507 approved. Maybe this irk is more indicative of Kendall than Chrysler's spec, but they apparently approved it. Usually the BMW LL04, MB 229.51, and VW 507 go hand in hand.

Phillips 66 Lubricants: World-class products and services

On one line it says the below, and then yet somehow it still has an MB 229.51 rating?! The BlueTEC is their modern common rail diesel with HPFP!

"Mercedes-Benz automobiles, diesel engines except most BlueTEC® diesel engineswith the OM 642 engine, and most pre-2011 model-year gasoline engines."

I sent an email to Pierre at Total and we'll see what they have to say; until then, Mobil 1's ESP 5w30 seems like the best on out there that actually carries Chrysler's MS-11106 spec. If you have a Porsche dealer nearby, you should be able to get M1 5w30 ESP there as it also carries a Porsche C30 approval rating. (Actually had one Porsche dealer tell me that they just stick in regular M1 5w30, confirmed by one of the service writers; called Porsche and told them about that.)
 

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#8 ·
Like others on here, I've been sourcing my Pennzoil Ultra Euro L from Amazon in the 6 packs. Currently priced at $43.25 shipped for 6qts, not bad at a few cents over $7.00 per qt including shipping.
 
#9 ·
Yeah, but it's Pennzoil. I've heard their new 5w30 Ultra is good stuff, but they earned their reputation and I just have hard time going that way with others readily available. Maybe, and I mean maybe, if they gave it to me for free I'd use it, but I'd still have to think about it.
 
#11 ·
Spoke with a product engineer from Total here in the US today, and he agreed that their 5w30 Ineo Longlife should otherwise meet the Chrysler spec as it meets the MB 229.51. He also said that he will speak to his counterparts in France (where Total is headquartered,) about getting the Chrysler MS-11106 spec added to their label as he believes that makes good sense.

He mentioned that specific info on the Chrysler spec was hard to come by, so I forwarded him the nice PDF that the previous user on this and the other Ram 1500 diesel forum scanned and posted, (so thank you to that user!.)

Pending formal approval of the spec, this will be a great oil to use in all our EcoDiesel motors that can be had relatively inexpensively via Amazon.
 
#12 ·
I bought the 3 pack and will use the rest of my Pennzoil then move on to this Total. It is all what you are comfortable with. I plan to do another Blackstone on my oil next change which will put me just short of 28K miles...
 
#13 ·
Thanks AirBull, my Dealer (also Ford) here in Australia used this on my first 10,000 klm service.

Total-EngineOils | Quartz INEO MC3 5W30

He says it;s what they use in some of the Euro spec fords as well.

The only real difference I can see is it specifies it for use with vehicles fitted with DPF's
 

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#14 ·
Saw an analysis from Ineo 5W30; didn't look too inspiring about the same makeup as EURO L; unless it has a PAO in the Base oil I can't see; however most C3 oils are Group III hydrocracked base Dino oil.

Still, run it analyze it. Show us the way.

BTW when MB was in bed with Chrysler the spec read in manuals, "MS-11106 ( MB 229.51)" ; when they companies divorced so did 229.51 from the Chrysler manuals. Much as many may argue, they are both same type of oil. Not many vehicles require MS-11106 vs millions worldwide require MB 229.51, economies of scale.




Sent from my iPhone using JeepGarage
 
#15 ·
So this showed up on the Ram 1500 forum the other day. Can't find the new datasheet online yet, but this PDF datasheet dated 7/2015 was emailed to one of their members from Total.

Total Quartz Ineo MC3 5w-30 lists MS-11106 now.

View attachment QUARTZ INEO MC3 5W-30 PIB TOT.pdf
 
#17 ·
So this showed up on the Ram 1500 forum the other day. Can't find the new datasheet online yet, but this PDF datasheet dated 7/2015 was emailed to one of their members from Total.

Total Quartz Ineo MC3 5w-30 lists MS-11106 now.

View attachment 57965
Cheers MBDiesel, as posted I'm running this already, with Total adding the MS-11106 endorsement should make the purists happy ;)

:thumbsup:
 
#19 ·
I've gotten my oil changes down to $88 using the Total oil and a Mopar filter sourced from a dealer store on eBay. I don't even consider the dealer an option since I'm not convinced the diesel tech does the oil changes and I can do mine in the time it takes to drive to the dealer, wait and drive back.

It's one of the easier vehicles I've changed the oil on behind my Benz which doesn't even require getting under the car if you don't want to.
 
#20 ·
I have a problem with using their MC3 as opposed to their Long Life, and here's why. It's the same thing I noticed with Kendall's GT-1 and to me, it's illogical. If Chrysler's MS-11106 is this bad, I won't use it.

I'm coming from a long line of VW TDI's and one BMW diesel engine, so I've been keeping up with all these oil specs for the last decade plus.

See my chart below; the Long Life has the VW 504.00/507.00 spec, but the MC3 only has VW's 502.00/505.01.

We had a 2005 Passat TDI that had no SCR or DEF, and it required VW 502.00/505.01. The new Passat TDI that came out in 2012 required SCR and used DEF, so it now has a DPF. We had a 2013 TDI and now a 2015 TDI Passat, as well as also a 2012 Touareg TDI with a V6 diesel comparable to these VM V6 diesels in the Ram 1500 truck and Jeep Grand Cherokee, and they all have SCR, use DEF, and burn soot in the DPF.


VW mandates their VW 504.00/507.00 for these current common rail diesel engines that use SCR, DEF, and have a DPF. If I couldn't use MC3 in my late model VW diesel (TDI,) than what about the BMW LL-04 and Mercedes MB 229.51 believes they are interchangeable and/or comparable, I wonder?

I spoke with an engineer from Total last week and said they were going to update their MC3 label with the Chrysler MS-11106 spec. I asked him what's the difference in the MC3 that prevents VW from approving it with their VW 504.00/507.00 spec? Porsche (part of the VW auto group) C30 is basically their similar, comparable spec.


As for the Chrysler MS-11106 spec, I would not want to run the MC3 with only a VW 502.00/505.01 spec on it when the Long Life with the VW 504.00/507.00 is available. I'm certain that the Total Long Life 5w-30 is absolutely fine (if not preferred,) to run in my Jeep(/Ram) EcoDiesel despite it not having the MS-11106 spec that Chrysler calls for in these motors, but without the Chrysler spec endorsement, technically I would be doing so at my own peril, potentially putting my warranty at risk.



I'd really love to see the Chrysler MS-111006 spec on the Ineo Long Life 5w-30 along with the VW 504.00/507.00 rating, as this oil is interchangeable with our VW TDI's (as well as Audi and Porsche,) and as per the spec, I can only infer that it is a better oil for these modern diesels with SCR, DEF, and DPF's than an oil with the VW 502.00/505.01.

Long story short, I wouldn't reccommend using an oil with the Chrysler MS-11106 if it only had a VW 502.00/505.01, and not the VW 504.00/507.00 spec. What does VW know that the rest of the industry isn't acknowledging?


 
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#23 ·
Why VW 504.00/507.00 is superior to their VW 502.00/505.01, and why if an oil otherwise approved by Chrysler's MS-11106 rating doesn't have VW 504.00/507.00, I'm not using it.

Mobil 1 ESP 5w30 is both Chrysler MS-11106 and VW 504.00/507.00 rated, as is the Pennzoil Euro L 5w30, but watch out for some of those others out there that are not.

https://www.lubrizol.com/EngineOilAdditives/ACEA/RelativePerformanceTool/default.html
 

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#24 ·
Y'all bring up a point. I'll shoot an email to Total asking about MS-11106 on the Long Life oil.

Could be that they just haven't compared the MS-11106 specification to the Long Life product, like they did with MC3. If that's the case, how many other oils technically meet MS-11106 but the manufacturer hasn't done the analysis?

Looking at the datasheets, the oil specs are very similar. Long Life has a 0.8 lower TBN and is slightly less viscous than MC3.
 
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