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  #73  
Old 06-27-2016, 09:45 AM
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Re: Shifter Recall

QUOTE
This shifter is objectively more difficult to use safely than a traditional shifter. Furthermore, this shifter has failure modes where does not do what it is commanded to do.
UNQUOTE

Show me the proof for that failure mode statement please???

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  #74  
Old 06-27-2016, 10:42 AM
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Re: Shifter Recall

Roadkill,
QUOTE
This shifter is objectively more difficult to use safely than a traditional shifter. Furthermore, this shifter has failure modes where does not do what it is commanded to do.
UNQUOTE

Less intuitive becomes objectively more difficult for some, I agree!
Let's face it, tradition has nothing to do with most anything in consumer products and manufacturing these days, does it?

And please show me the evidence that there are, indeed, failure modes (see the linky to the NHTSA document) ???

As I stated earlier, as an owner, of course I am concerned about any gearshift FAULTS but as of this writing, no one has shown any proof that there is any fault/failure in its design other than, as NHTSA states in the document that it is "not as intuitive" etc...

FYI - Here is a linky to the ODI document :
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/acms/cs...16002-6630.PDF

Look, I simply want reasoned, not emotional, argument about this serious subject. My point being, exactly how much "nannying" does a manufacturer have to put into a vehicle and its systems and at what cost to the consumer in increased vehicle prices? How much the percentage of a vehicle purchase price will increase to include increased costs for product and general liability insurance?

By chance, are you a lawyer.... !

Hello o o o o o o o o o o o o o o o o o !!!!
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  #75  
Old 06-27-2016, 11:23 AM
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Re: Shifter Recall

Just a VERY small selection from the first couple of pages of the NHTSA site.
Poor design and or a combination of human error or not adapting to a new technology aside - there is obviously a serious problem here.


SUMMARY:
ON THE MORNING OF THURSDAY 3/6/14, AS I WAS LEAVING FOR WORK, I STOPPED MY JEEP GRAND CHEROKEE AT THE END OF MY DRIVEWAY TO PICK UP MY NEWSPAPER. (I THOUGHT) I PUT THE CAR IN PARK AND EXITED MY VEHICLE. AS I WAS PICKING UP THE PAPER, I REALIZED THE CAR WAS ROLLING BACKWARD, DOWN THE REMAINDER OF MY DRIVEWAY AND ACROSS MY CUL-DE-SAC. AS I RAN BESIDE THE CAR I SAW THE CAR WAS IN REVERSE. I WAS CERTAIN I HAD PUT THE CAR IN PARK! REALIZING THAT NOTHING WAS GOING TO STOP THE CAR UNTIL IT HIT SOMETHING (OPTIONS WERE A FIRE HYDRANT OR MY NEIGHBOR'S HOUSE,) I FOOLISHLY ATTEMPTED TO JUMP IN THE CAR TO STOP IT. I MISSED.... BADLY. AFTER TRYING TO JUMP INTO A MOVING VEHICLE AND MISSING, I FELL TO THE STREET. I WAS ON MY BACK. AT THAT MOMENT I KNEW THAT I WAS GOING TO BE RUN OVER. I DID NOT KNOW WHERE I WAS IN RELATION TO THE CAR AND, IN THAT SPLIT SECOND, PREPARED FOR THE WORST. I COUNTED MYSELF "LUCKY" WHEN THE VEHICLE "ONLY" RAN OVER MY LEFT LOWER LEG, ANKLE AND FOOT! THE VEHICLE CAME TO REST, LUCKILY, IN A SNOWBANK ACROSS THE STREET FROM MY HOUSE (PICTURE ATTACHED). AAA WAS CALLED TO PULL THE CAR OFF THE SNOWBANK, AS IT HIGH-CENTERED. I SOUGHT MEDICAL TREATMENT. I HAD A BADLY SPRAINED ANKLE AND DAMAGE TO MY LEFT FOOT ARCH. I HAVE NOT WALKED CORRECTLY SINCE AND CONTINUE TO HAVE PAIN IN THE ARCH OF MY FOOT AND KNEES. WHILE I TOLD MY NEIGHBORS AND CIRCLE OF FRIENDS, I DID NOT NOTIFY MY CAR DEALER AS I THOUGHT THE INCIDENT WAS MY NEGLIGENCE BY NOT PUTTING THE CAR IN PARK. IT HAS ONLY BEEN THROUGH THE RECENT MEDIA THAT I REALIZE THAT I AM ANOTHER VICTIM OF THIS VEHICLE'S GEAR SHIFT DEFECT.

SUMMARY:
MY WIFE PULLED THE CAR INTO A COMMUNITY PARK AND PUT THE JEEP IN PARK AND OPENED THE DOOR TO GRAB HER SONS LOST DOG. NEXT THING SHE KNOWS THE JEEP IS ROLLING, AND PROCEEDS TO RUN HER OVER AND CONTINUES DOWN A SMALL HILL INTO SOME TREES. SHE WAS TAKEN TO THE HOSPITAL VIA A 911 CALL AND WE ARE NOW WAITING FOR RESULTS FROM AN MRI. THIS PROBLEM COULD HAVE KILLED HER IF SHE DIDN'T GET HER HEAD OUT OF THE WAY.

SUMMARY:
ON AUGUST 19, 2014, I STEPPED OUT OF MY STATIONARY 2014 JEEP GRAND CHEROKEE OVERLAND--BELIEVING I HAD PUT THE VEHICLE IN PARK ON A GENTLE CITY-STREET SLOPE--WHEN IT SUDDENLY MOVED BACKWARD, ROLLING OVER MY LEFT LEG AND SEVERELY DAMAGING MY KNEE, SKIN, ARTERY, AND QUAD MUSCLES. MY WIFE IMMEDIATELY CALLED AN AMBULANCE, WHICH TRANSPORTED ME TO A LOCAL HOSPITAL, WHERE DOCTORS SURGICALLY ATTACHED AN "EXTERNAL FIXATOR" IN THREE PLACES, STABILIZING AND COMPLETELY IMMOBILIZING MY LEG (FOR THE NEXT FIVE WEEKS). AFTER A SECOND SURGERY AND OVER A YEAR OF PAINFUL AND ARDUOUS THERAPY LATER, I CAN NOW WALK WITH A KNEE-BRACE, HALTINGLY AND WITH A NOTICEABLE LIMP . . . ALL DUE TO THE JEEP GRAND CHEROKEE'S TRANSMISSION THAT DOES NOT ACCURATELY INDICATE WHAT GEAR IT IS IN! UNLESS ONE IS CONCENTRATING 100+% OF THE TIME ON THE CONSOLE SHIFTER--AND CONSTANTLY GLANCING AT THE INDICATOR LIGHTS ON THE VEHICLE DASHBOARD--THE DRIVER NEVER KNOWS WHAT POSITION THE JEEP'S TRANSMISSION IS IN! THE SHIFTER ON THE CONSOLE ALWAYS LOOKS EXACTLY THE SAME, NO MATTER WHAT GEAR HAS SUPPOSEDLY BEEN SELECTED. WE HAD NO ABSOLUTELY FOREWARNING OF THE POTENTIAL LIFE-THREATENING PROBLEM INHERENT IN THIS VEHICLE'S DESIGN, AND I CAN ONLY THANK GOD THAT I'M STILL ALIVE TODAY. LAST WEEK WE WERE SURPRISED TO RECEIVE WRITTEN NOTIFICATION FROM FIAT CHRYSLER AUTOMOBILES THAT THE COMPANY AND NHTSA HAD RECALLED 2014 JEEP GRAND CHEROKEES FOR THE SPECIFIC DEFECT DESCRIBED IN MY INCIDENT ABOVE!. (FINALLY! VINDICATION!) THE RECALL NUMBER IS SHOW BELOW, I BELIEVE. FCA VEHICLE RECALL NUMBER: S27 / NHTSA 16V-240


SUMMARY:
I PARKED MY VEHICLE IN MY DRIVEWAY AND EXITED THE VEHICLE TO ENTER MY HOME. I WAS IN THE HOUSE FOR 5 MINUTES AND HEARD A LOUD CRASH, UPON LOOKING OUT THE WINDOW MY VEHICLE HAD COME OUT OF GEAR AND DROVE ITSELF THROUGH MY GARAGE DOOR DAMAGING THE DOOR, THE FRONT END OF MY JEEP AND MY HARLEY INSIDE THE GARAGE.


SUMMARY:
OUR 2014 JEEP WAS RUNNING AND STATIONARY IN OUR GARAGE WITH MY HUSBAND AND MYSELF BESIDE THE JEEP WHEN IT SHIFTED INTO REVERSE, CRASHING OUT OF OUR GARAGE KNOCKING MY HUSBAND DOWN AND OUT, DRAGGING HIM OUTSIDE. IT HIT NUMEROUS LAWN MOWERS, WHEEL BARROWS AND FINALLY A LARGE TREE BEFORE STOPPING.

SUMMARY:
ON FEBRUARY 25TH, I SHIFTED MY CAR INTO PARK AND WAS GETTING OUT TO LOOK AT BACK WIPER WHICH SEEMED TO BE STUCK. I HAD LEFT THE CAR RUNNING. THE CAR TOOK OFF IN GEAR AND CAUSED ME TO FALL AND BREAK MY ANKLE IN AN OPEN COMPOUND FRACTURE THAT REQUIRED HOSPITALIZATION AND SURGERY. MY JEEP ENDED UP HITTING A PARKED GARBAGE TRUCK AND SUSTAINED ABOUT $5000 DAMAGE. WHO KNOWS WHAT MY MEDICAL BILLS WILL END UP BEING. PLUS MY ANKLE MAY NEVER BE RIGHT. I WILL INCLUDE A PHOTO OF MY CAR AND X-RAY. IT HAPPENED ON PRIVATE PROPERTY (TACO BELL PARKING LOT). A POLICE OFFICER CAME AND PARKED MY CAR AND CALLED AN AMBULANCE BUT DID NOT MAKE A REPORT SINCE ON PRIVATE PROPERTY. WE HAVE NOT HEARD FROM GARBAGE TRUCK AND DOUBT IT DID ANYTHING TO IT. THE CAR WAS IN PARK AND NOT SURE HOW FAST WAS GOING WHEN HIT THE GARBAGE TRUCK.
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  #76  
Old 06-27-2016, 12:05 PM
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Re: Shifter Recall

philbytx, Roadkill, I think there's truth in both of your points of view. All one has to do to verify that the tranny is in park is visually check the indicator on the shifter or the instrument panel.

I personally don't like the feel of the shifter and how it operates. 99% of the time I have no issues if I don't get in a hurry but there have been a few occasions where I thought it was in park and it was in reverse.

I just like the feel of a shifter that moves from moves in the gate from gear to gear.

I think it could have been better designed but it is what it is. We'll see what FCA does to "solve" the "problem".

My understanding is that the 2016 shifter is different. True? Is it more intuitive compared to the 14-15 models?

Maybe that will be the fix, use the 16 shifter in the recall. The death of the actor changed the whole ballgame.
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  #77  
Old 06-27-2016, 12:14 PM
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Re: Shifter Recall

ferntree, to me there is a issue in design but I don't think any of these complaints can prove they had the vehicle in park and somehow, magically the tranny shifted it self from Park to R or D.


My opinion is that people are not putting the tranny into park, for whatever reason, and not visually checking the indicator. I have done it myself, but caught the mistake before exiting.
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  #78  
Old 06-27-2016, 12:26 PM
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Re: Shifter Recall

That is the issue - people ARE putting it into Park - poor design means it stays in either reverse or neutral and fails to engage on movement of the lever.
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  #79  
Old 06-27-2016, 12:42 PM
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Re: Shifter Recall

10-4 A visual check of gear selection would solve 99.9% of these issues, regardless of it being a poor design.
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  #80  
Old 06-27-2016, 12:44 PM
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Re: Shifter Recall

Is the 2016 going to also be an electronic shifter, just configured differently?
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  #81  
Old 06-27-2016, 12:58 PM
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Re: Shifter Recall

Interesting article. Another point of view.

Time to Standardize Automotive Controls, And Also To Make Them Different
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  #82  
Old 06-27-2016, 01:39 PM
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Re: Shifter Recall

Quote:
Originally Posted by Governor View Post
Is the 2016 going to also be an electronic shifter, just configured differently?
was rectified in the 2015s
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  #83  
Old 06-27-2016, 01:48 PM
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Re: Shifter Recall

ferntree, what do you mean rectified in the 2015 MY? I thought the 14-15 MY is the recall and the shifter was changed in the 16.
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  #84  
Old 06-27-2016, 01:59 PM
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Re: Shifter Recall

You maybe right - but my understanding was the shifter was fixed at some point during the 2015 range.
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