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  #37  
Old 07-02-2016, 11:25 AM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

Firstly, ensure that you have the correct hitch ball height on your JGC, required by your trailer.

Measure the wheel wells first with it in Tire Change mode, checking the differential...if it is 1" or whatever.

Put your loaded trailer on the hitch ball, ensuring all the weight is now on the wheels and hitch ball.

Adjust your hitch per instructions, all the while ensuring that, when adjusted, the differential between your front and rear is (as near as dammit) that measurement (1" or whatever) that you saw in Tire Change Mode.

Once you have the WDH set up as above, you can then turn on QL. It will adjust accordingly and you don't have to worry about whether it goes into Aero or whatever. The hitch height is critical.

It would be helpful to have a tongue weight scale handy, as this will enable you to fine tune the hitch ball loading. This is especially true if you have a heavy trailer and, thusly, a heavy tongue loading. Remember our JGC's have about a 1070/1100 lb payload. See the chart below :

Jeep Capabilities - Towing Capacity Chart

Remember, the payload includes the weight of passengers, stuff in the rear storage, WDH hitch receiver weight etc.


Hope this helps you.

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2014 GC Overland 4x4, 3.0CRD, ATG, ORAII ("Smiffy")
2015 Lance 1685 Travel Trailer "#4"
2011 Kia Optima EX-L ("MC"
2003 BMW R1150RT "Darth"
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  #38  
Old 07-02-2016, 03:32 PM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by philbytx View Post
Firstly, ensure that you have the correct hitch ball height on your JGC, required by your trailer.

Measure the wheel wells first with it in Tire Change mode, checking the differential...if it is 1" or whatever.

Put your loaded trailer on the hitch ball, ensuring all the weight is now on the wheels and hitch ball.

Adjust your hitch per instructions, all the while ensuring that, when adjusted, the differential between your front and rear is (as near as dammit) that measurement (1" or whatever) that you saw in Tire Change Mode.

Once you have the WDH set up as above, you can then turn on QL. It will adjust accordingly and you don't have to worry about whether it goes into Aero or whatever. The hitch height is critical.

It would be helpful to have a tongue weight scale handy, as this will enable you to fine tune the hitch ball loading. This is especially true if you have a heavy trailer and, thusly, a heavy tongue loading. Remember our JGC's have about a 1070/1100 lb payload. See the chart below :

Jeep Capabilities - Towing Capacity Chart

Remember, the payload includes the weight of passengers, stuff in the rear storage, WDH hitch receiver weight etc.


Hope this helps you.
Great - thanks a lot! How do I know what hitch ball height I need, would it be to line it up closely with the level trailer hitch height? Regarding payload, the trailer is only about 4200 lbs unloaded with a tonge weight of 512lbs. Does the Jeep payload rating include the tonge weight in addition to passengers, cargo and the hitch itself or is that separate?
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  #39  
Old 07-02-2016, 05:16 PM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

The trailer manufacturer usually has the recommended hitch height on their website. But, if they don't you, should have the TV and trailer pretty much level. Here's a linky to an article on the subject :

http://rvhandbook.com/weight-distributing-hitch-use/

The tongue weight will be part of the payload and will actually be the "dry weight", which doesn't include batteries, propane and actual WDH hitch. Reckon a battery weighs about 60lbs and a 5 gallon propane tank around 40lbs.

You then need the weight of your WDH and add that as well. Remember, the WDH has the ability to shift weight forward on your Jeep and rearward on your trailer.

Now, it does get a little more complicated when you start adding water because some trailers have the tank at the rear, which actually helps with the hitch weight. Because if you add water, it shifts the CG of the trailer rearward and you actually lessen the tongue weight.

Reckon on the 512lbs plus battery(ies), propane tank(s) and hitch weight, then adjust the WDH to shift some of that rearwards.

You can also take your complete TV/TT combo to a CAT or agricultural scale and actually weigh the whole thing when it is loaded up. Jeep Front axle, rear axle and Trailer axle(s). Knowing the loaded weights will help set up the combo properly with the actual trailer loading and the WDH settings.

Find out if you can scrounge/borrow a Sherline tongue scale, which will get your exact tongue weight. Otherwise, here is a neat linky explaining Tongue weight and how to measure it:

https://www.etrailer.com/faq-how-to-...ue-weight.aspx

It is part magic, part science and you can never trust the manufacturer tongue weight figures. In fact, I haven't met many dealers that actually have a Sherline scale that they would lend you to get exact figures.......

Good luck with your set-up......
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2014 GC Overland 4x4, 3.0CRD, ATG, ORAII ("Smiffy")
2015 Lance 1685 Travel Trailer "#4"
2011 Kia Optima EX-L ("MC"
2003 BMW R1150RT "Darth"
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  #40  
Old 07-02-2016, 08:20 PM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by philbytx View Post
The trailer manufacturer usually has the recommended hitch height on their website. But, if they don't you, should have the TV and trailer pretty much level. Here's a linky to an article on the subject :

Weight-Distributing Hitch Use | RV Handbook

The tongue weight will be part of the payload and will actually be the "dry weight", which doesn't include batteries, propane and actual WDH hitch. Reckon a battery weighs about 60lbs and a 5 gallon propane tank around 40lbs.

You then need the weight of your WDH and add that as well. Remember, the WDH has the ability to shift weight forward on your Jeep and rearward on your trailer.

Now, it does get a little more complicated when you start adding water because some trailers have the tank at the rear, which actually helps with the hitch weight. Because if you add water, it shifts the CG of the trailer rearward and you actually lessen the tongue weight.

Reckon on the 512lbs plus battery(ies), propane tank(s) and hitch weight, then adjust the WDH to shift some of that rearwards.

You can also take your complete TV/TT combo to a CAT or agricultural scale and actually weigh the whole thing when it is loaded up. Jeep Front axle, rear axle and Trailer axle(s). Knowing the loaded weights will help set up the combo properly with the actual trailer loading and the WDH settings.

Find out if you can scrounge/borrow a Sherline tongue scale, which will get your exact tongue weight. Otherwise, here is a neat linky explaining Tongue weight and how to measure it:

https://www.etrailer.com/faq-how-to-...ue-weight.aspx

It is part magic, part science and you can never trust the manufacturer tongue weight figures. In fact, I haven't met many dealers that actually have a Sherline scale that they would lend you to get exact figures.......

Good luck with your set-up......
Oh wow, I didn't realize they added! So does that mean I basically can only have 400lbs total weight in the Jeep for passengers when towing? Didn't really appreciate that before...
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  #41  
Old 07-03-2016, 10:27 AM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

Yup!

It is all about weight management and most TT dealers do not (or will not!) give you the real "skinny" about ACTUAL tongue weights of TT's.

In the end, it is all down to simple math. Y'know, addition and subtraction

To be exact, you really need to load your trailer with your usual 'stuff', including any onboard fresh water (reckon 8lbs per gallon) etcetera, then use a tongue weight scale. In our case, we always keep around 10 gallons of water onboard when we are on the road.
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2014 GC Overland 4x4, 3.0CRD, ATG, ORAII ("Smiffy")
2015 Lance 1685 Travel Trailer "#4"
2011 Kia Optima EX-L ("MC"
2003 BMW R1150RT "Darth"
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  #42  
Old 07-03-2016, 11:44 AM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by philbytx View Post
Yup!

It is all about weight management and most TT dealers do not (or will not!) give you the real "skinny" about ACTUAL tongue weights of TT's.

In the end, it is all down to simple math. Y'know, addition and subtraction

To be exact, you really need to load your trailer with your usual 'stuff', including any onboard fresh water (reckon 8lbs per gallon) etcetera, then use a tongue weight scale. In our case, we always keep around 10 gallons of water onboard when we are on the road.
Bummer - so does no one else use a TT with a family? Luckily we only have two lighter weight dogs but all total the Mrs and them would easily be 400lbs...

Wouldn't a WDH actually balance the tongue load across the front axle of the jeep and trailer axles, in essence halving the load the Jeep "sees"? I also noticed that the front and rear axles have different load ratings, so do I need to account for that with the WDH setup?

Sorry for the continued confusion . I also posed a related question on another thread regarding an apparent discrepancy between the specified payload capacity (GVWR minus curb weight) of 1590lbs vs the tire placard value of 1050lbs.
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  #43  
Old 07-09-2016, 10:16 PM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by philbytx View Post
Firstly, ensure that you have the correct hitch ball height on your JGC, required by your trailer.

Measure the wheel wells first with it in Tire Change mode, checking the differential...if it is 1" or whatever.

Put your loaded trailer on the hitch ball, ensuring all the weight is now on the wheels and hitch ball.

Adjust your hitch per instructions, all the while ensuring that, when adjusted, the differential between your front and rear is (as near as dammit) that measurement (1" or whatever) that you saw in Tire Change Mode.

Once you have the WDH set up as above, you can then turn on QL. It will adjust accordingly and you don't have to worry about whether it goes into Aero or whatever. The hitch height is critical.

It would be helpful to have a tongue weight scale handy, as this will enable you to fine tune the hitch ball loading. This is especially true if you have a heavy trailer and, thusly, a heavy tongue loading. Remember our JGC's have about a 1070/1100 lb payload. See the chart below :

Jeep Capabilities - Towing Capacity Chart

Remember, the payload includes the weight of passengers, stuff in the rear storage, WDH hitch receiver weight etc.


Hope this helps you.
So last time I messed around with this trying the tire change mode approach, I was able to get the rear to squat down about 1'' with the front staying roughly the same as before. Pre-loaded differential was +1 on the rear. Another chain link up would actually have the front end lower than before which seems to violate many standard rules of thumb. Is that "close enough" for balance? I like having a bit more chain length as well to have reasonable clearance to the dual cam hardware.
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  #44  
Old 07-10-2016, 03:17 PM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

Depends on how much lower on the front. A small amount wouldn't matter much but how level was your trailer?
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2015 Lance 1685 Travel Trailer "#4"
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  #45  
Old 07-10-2016, 08:12 PM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by philbytx View Post
Depends on how much lower on the front. A small amount wouldn't matter much but how level was your trailer?
After driving around a few minutes the QL picked up the slack and the trailer was nice and level - just want to make sure I started off in a good enough place pre QL adjustments
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Old 07-22-2016, 11:59 AM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

I pull a 21' travel trailer/toy hauler (Starcraft ar-one 17xth) with a 2015 JGC Altitude 3.6l w/ factory tow package and Equalizer hitch. Dry weight is 3,750lbs, this is a toy hauler and has a cargo weight of ~1,800lbs (5,500 total) but so far I have only had the trailer loaded to about 4,200lbs. Pulling this with the jeep so far has been a non issue for me, the equalizer hitch helps, keeps the Jeep level, it would drop another 2, maybe 3 inches without it and no doubt, sway more. Besides, Jeep requires the wds > 3,500lbs.

Occasionally on the freeway I feel a little sway in open areas when the wind picks up but I can quickly mitigate that by laying off the gas or putting a little more on (I cruise around 65-68). Overall, paired with the Tekonsha Primus IQ electronic brake controller I am very satisfied with the towing capabilities of the Jeep. I have not driven up into any mountains yet, I could see having to manually shift on prolonged climbs if I did.

IMG_2257.JPG
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  #47  
Old 07-25-2016, 06:29 PM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by scony View Post
I pull a 21' travel trailer/toy hauler (Starcraft ar-one 17xth) with a 2015 JGC Altitude 3.6l w/ factory tow package and Equalizer hitch. Dry weight is 3,750lbs, this is a toy hauler and has a cargo weight of ~1,800lbs (5,500 total) but so far I have only had the trailer loaded to about 4,200lbs. Pulling this with the jeep so far has been a non issue for me, the equalizer hitch helps, keeps the Jeep level, it would drop another 2, maybe 3 inches without it and no doubt, sway more. Besides, Jeep requires the wds > 3,500lbs.

Occasionally on the freeway I feel a little sway in open areas when the wind picks up but I can quickly mitigate that by laying off the gas or putting a little more on (I cruise around 65-68). Overall, paired with the Tekonsha Primus IQ electronic brake controller I am very satisfied with the towing capabilities of the Jeep. I have not driven up into any mountains yet, I could see having to manually shift on prolonged climbs if I did.

Attachment 70247
About how much squat do you see on the rear with your equalizer? I have to choose from either zero change on the front, -0.75'' on the back (zero differential) or -0.5'' on the front -0.5'' on the back (+1'' rear differential)

My unloaded differential was about +0.75'' on the back so as of now I'm leaning towards the first option to avoid throwing too much weight to the front. On a trial run the trailer seemed a bit more wiggly with the extra front loading.
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  #48  
Old 07-25-2016, 07:43 PM
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Re: Towing / Travel Trailer Advice Needed

My Reese dropout shank has splines to offer minute adjustment angles on the spring bars. Take a bit of fiddling but with my '14 ecodiesel set first into Sport (thus aero) mode at a standstill then putting the Jeep in jack mode, I have my spring bars set so that I only see about .5" drop in the rear, normal front height when the Dualcam pieces are in the configuration. If I go one more chain link stiffer then the pieces bind. So I tried one spling of angle further (thus dropping the chain end of the spring bars about 1", then it was too stiff. So back to the first config with the rear -0.5". Tows beautifully.
We went racing this past weekend on vacation (yea I'm one of those crazy people who thinks that sitting in a race car in 95 degree temps with the track surface at 125 degrees wearing 3 layers of flame retardant clothing is actually fun, and so does my wife), towed 800 miles round trip in 90+ degree weather with the a/c blasting, never a wiggle from the trailer even in some strong gusty winds coming home in the rain. 6,200 lbs, 13.3 mpg out at 72-73 mph, 11.8 back into a headwind.

Pic is as the JGC and trailer sit before letting the air suspension do anything.
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File Type: jpg JGC trailer.JPG (146.1 KB, 26 views)
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