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  #13  
Old 09-29-2015, 10:47 AM
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Re: Towing with Grand Cherokee Diesel

I have a 14 I bought just after new years and now have 10k problem free miles. I recently bought a 26' SeaRay that with trailer & fuel about 6500lbs. Towed her about 130 miles 2 weeks ago. Florida is pretty flat but many overpasses. I got about 17mpg which is great but not as good as my 31+ non-towing. My oil temp was around 225-230 and trans temp never went over 199. Did not really pay attention to coolant when looking at oils, but don't think she was bad or it would have caught my eye. Tows the boat off the ramp with no problem and I am NOT 4wd. Just figured I would leave a comment on my experience.

PS I bought a 2005 Liberty CRD new in 2005 and towed about 5k with it for years. Never had a problem with that CRD for 8 years except EGR valves and a turbo hose(had a chip so my bad). Traded it in 1/13 for a used Hemi Ram but had to sell after 15months due to parking garage issues at work. Got a used Wrangler which I loved but it can't "legally" tow crap and with sue happy people, she had to go for the GC which I absolutely love.

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Old 04-05-2016, 12:23 PM
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Re: Towing with Grand Cherokee Diesel

Akinny: Not trying to put you on the spot, just trying to validate what you said. Here is your quote.

"Just before the needle hits the red part of the gauge, your thermostat fully opens up and lets the coolant flow unrestricted. If the temperature continues to climb into the danger zone (note: not *near* the danger zone, but *in* the danger zone), the engine will defuel and temperatures will fall."

Where in our owners manual does it discuss the operation of the thermostat? In all the vehicles I have owned, once you hit the rating of the thermostat, 180,190etc it opens fully to cool the engine. Say when we are traveling in our ecodiesels on the freeway for hours on a hot day. I assume (that bad word) we are at operational temperatures and the thermostat opens and closes to keep it at the operational temperature. At this point my gauge hangs out in the middle of the gauge. But start to go up hill or hit a headwind and the needle climbs. That tells me the cooling system is not handling the increased heat. Now what you say. Which I would like to see it, because I like what you said. The thermostat does not open fully until it gets to the danger point (orange area). You would think that if that happened, when you hit the orange area the thermostat would open up fully and you should see at least a slight dropoff in the needle. Which I don't until I level out or go down hill. The bottom line of all this is I want to feel comfortable that there is not an issue approaching redline with my light tow. No disrespect here, just want to validate what you say is backed up by Jeep engineering or some documentation. I have towed with many vehicles and never seen the coolant temperature react to load like our does. It's only 2500lbs. And even driving with out towing go up hill or hit a headwind and the gauge climbs. Maybe the gauge needs to be re calibrated. Thank You
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Old 04-05-2016, 04:10 PM
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Re: Towing with Grand Cherokee Diesel

Quote:
Originally Posted by mbaessler View Post
Akinny: Not trying to put you on the spot, just trying to validate what you said. Here is your quote.

"Just before the needle hits the red part of the gauge, your thermostat fully opens up and lets the coolant flow unrestricted. If the temperature continues to climb into the danger zone (note: not *near* the danger zone, but *in* the danger zone), the engine will defuel and temperatures will fall."

Where in our owners manual does it discuss the operation of the thermostat? In all the vehicles I have owned, once you hit the rating of the thermostat, 180,190etc it opens fully to cool the engine. Say when we are traveling in our ecodiesels on the freeway for hours on a hot day. I assume (that bad word) we are at operational temperatures and the thermostat opens and closes to keep it at the operational temperature. At this point my gauge hangs out in the middle of the gauge. But start to go up hill or hit a headwind and the needle climbs. That tells me the cooling system is not handling the increased heat. Now what you say. Which I would like to see it, because I like what you said. The thermostat does not open fully until it gets to the danger point (orange area). You would think that if that happened, when you hit the orange area the thermostat would open up fully and you should see at least a slight dropoff in the needle. Which I don't until I level out or go down hill. The bottom line of all this is I want to feel comfortable that there is not an issue approaching redline with my light tow. No disrespect here, just want to validate what you say is backed up by Jeep engineering or some documentation. I have towed with many vehicles and never seen the coolant temperature react to load like our does. It's only 2500lbs. And even driving with out towing go up hill or hit a headwind and the gauge climbs. Maybe the gauge needs to be re calibrated. Thank You
It's not in any manual. I read it somewhere on the RAM 1500 Ecodiesel forums. Guys there tow a lot more frequently, so there are lots of threads about coolant temp versus thermostat. If I recall correctly, it begins to open around 210F, but doesn't fully open until 225F or so. It's not simply on or off, which is why you don't see the needle bounce as the thermostat fully opens. The RAM 1500 Ecodiesel has a digital readout for coolant temp and our Jeeps just have a needle.

I have never seen anyone report an Ecodiesel overheating here or on the RAM 1500 Ecodiesel forums. The engine reduces fuel levels automatically before that can happen.

The operation of the coolant temp needle causes some to worry since it's not like their prior vehicles, but you're not overheated until it throws a flashing coolant temp light at you. That's in the manual (not sure where, but I remember reading it).
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Old 04-05-2016, 05:19 PM
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Re: Towing with Grand Cherokee Diesel

Akinney: Thanks for the response. I too have looked all over the net and have seen that some of the guys on the RAM site have said fully open at 228degF. I'm trying to validate that number buy asking engineering at Jeep. I sent them the part number. Also sent the same question to a vendor that sells the thermostat. I will let you know what I find out. Wish we had a gauge like the Rams. Akinney how about this theory. If it is true like you said that it opens up fully at 225-228. Then maybe our temperature gauge which is the same for the 5.7 and 3.6 gas engines is not calibrated for our ecodiesel thermostat. So when it gets hot to the point where it opens fully it's at the high side of our guage, where on the gas engines when they open fully at the lower temperature the neddle is dead center or just below center. Just hate depending on a idiot light to tell me it got too hot. I will let you know what I find out. And it is comforting that no one on the RAM site or the Jeep ecodiesel site have had an over heating issue. Mike
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Old 04-05-2016, 05:58 PM
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Re: Towing with Grand Cherokee Diesel

Akinney. You are correct! I finally hunted down the engineering data on that thermostat.
Opens at 208degF fully open at 225deg F. Temperature gauge for gas engines and ecodiesel are the same. So when gas engine is loaded at operating temperature (different thermostat probably a 190 deg), the needle is left of center. With us being loaded at 225deg puts us right of center. Does that make sense? Mike
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Old 04-05-2016, 06:55 PM
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Re: Towing with Grand Cherokee Diesel

Quote:
Originally Posted by mbaessler View Post
Akinney. You are correct! I finally hunted down the engineering data on that thermostat.
Opens at 208degF fully open at 225deg F. Temperature gauge for gas engines and ecodiesel are the same. So when gas engine is loaded at operating temperature (different thermostat probably a 190 deg), the needle is left of center. With us being loaded at 225deg puts us right of center. Does that make sense? Mike
So does that mean that we should be installing a lower opening temp thermostat to cater for the over temp while towing. I have a digital temp gauge and often towing with the outside temp around 36-38 C the temp readout will go to 113-115 degrees C. Have had the red light on a couple of times.
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Old 04-05-2016, 07:58 PM
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Re: Towing with Grand Cherokee Diesel

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Originally Posted by Peter.T View Post
So does that mean that we should be installing a lower opening temp thermostat to cater for the over temp while towing. I have a digital temp gauge and often towing with the outside temp around 36-38 C the temp readout will go to 113-115 degrees C. Have had the red light on a couple of times.
Peter all I know is what I have read, that says the engine is designed to run hotter to be more efficient. I would talk to Jeep and discuss with them based on your environment what you have been seeing temperature wise. They may be able to recommend that cooler option for you.
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Old 04-06-2016, 05:32 PM
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Re: Towing with Grand Cherokee Diesel

Quote:
Originally Posted by mbaessler View Post
Peter all I know is what I have read, that says the engine is designed to run hotter to be more efficient. I would talk to Jeep and discuss with them based on your environment what you have been seeing temperature wise. They may be able to recommend that cooler option for you.
You want it hotter to get more complete combustion of the diesel. More complete combustion = less fuel to make same power = better MPG. Installing a lower temp thermostat would work against that.

I like your theory about the coolant temp gauge. I've adapted my thinking so it doesn't concern me until it gets into the orange area of the gauge, though. My other vehicle has no temperature gauges of any kind except outdoor air temp, so I didn't have anything to unlearn.

For anyone who does get high temps, you may want to consider bumping down a gear. The extra air moving through the engine reduces EGT and heat soaking. Sounds weird, I know, but it's been proven repeatedly. You can get similar results by using sport mode. Here's the most recent video showing the technique in a RAM 1500 (increase revs by bumping down a gear to bring down EGT). The video is actually about an aftermarket oil cooler for the RAM 1500, but he comments about RPM, gears, and EGT several times while showing the temperature readings before and after the gear change.

https://youtu.be/dhBtCZiGF7Q
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Old 04-06-2016, 05:38 PM
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Re: Towing with Grand Cherokee Diesel

I should also add that if you want the effects of sport mode without biasing your torque to the rear (for those with 4WD) and turning down stability/traction control, just turn off eco mode. You'll get earlier shifts, which helps with coolant/oil temps under load.
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