So, I'm about to fix the floaty Jeep handling by adding Bilstein HDs all around. I also know that the Commander/SRT8 rear sway is effective and an easy mod, but I won't add that until later AND only if I feel the Bilsteins weren't enough.
What if I add just the Bwoody Sway bar links? Bwoody claims they tighten up handling, but I don't see how.
Hear me out. When the WK leans in a turn there's little side load on the stock end-links. It's only push or pull and a little side load because of the sway bar's twist. So, the stock metal end-link isn't really flexing. However, I guess the flex/slop comes from the weak stock rubber bushings and this is where the Bwoodys could excel. It would eliminate that bit of slop, and also probably that dribbling sound on certain bumps. That in-turn would make the sway bar more effective. Too bad poly bushings only aren't available for the WK without new end-links.
But, is that worth $219?
I also feel that replacing the sway bar mounting bushings could be an even better way to increase the effectiveness of the stock WK sway bar. That's because the bar would be forced to twist/torque instead of the bushings flexing (another source of slop). At least these bushings are available on their own.
In summary, I feel some of the stock sway bar's torque is being lost to the flexing of the bushings holding it in place.
So, my real question is, would only replacing the stock WK sway bar mounting bushings and sway bar end link bushings with poly bushings, while leaving the stock WK sway bar in place, have a positive effect and reduce the slop in the WK?
i dont know the technical aspects of this question, but i know that i added the end links and srt sways and the difference is night and day. the sway links on the wk are very weak and the bwoodys are much stronger. you can also buy them from bwoody on ebay for much cheaper than the price they offer JG members on this website. i guess they would rather pay ebay fees?
very good question indeed if i understand correctly replacing the sway bar mounting bushings and sway bar end link bushings with poly bushings should do the trick ... and yes the $219 is too much for them ...
The firmer bushings would isolate the sway better allowing it to apply its full force in preventing body roll. I feel some of it's force is lost to the flex/slop of the bushings.
The endlinks are twice as thick as stock. It tightens up the suspension because there is the thicker diameter bars that prevent the body from rolling around.
Or just thick of it as witchcraft, and it works but as mentioned, its night and day
it all depends on how aggressive you drive. i take turns(24/7) like i have a sports car and the jeep handles it remarkably well. still have that floating feeling when i'm on the gas hard in the 80mph and up range and on uneven highway. so the bilstein swap is in the near future.
i added the addco front and rear sway and kept the stock links. the difference was night and day. 2 months later i developed a clunk in the right rear side anytime i made a turn, right or left. the rear stock links have a ball joint on the lower end that will wear out if you have the heavier/beefier rear sway bar...its just to much stress. so i ordered the bwoody links and installed them 4-5 days ago. the clunk is gone. i have not noticed any difference in handling(sp?)/cornering with the bwoody's. you can find them cheaper...go to ebay, got mine powdercoated for under $200-delivered. have a hard time justifying spending that much but there aren't any other choices i know of unless you make them yourself.
if you decide to only install bilsteins as your suspension upgrade you will notice a huge difference in stability. i had a 98zj that i only changed out the bilsteins and the jeep handled alot better but it seemed like the bilsteins were doing double duty...it had to be a shock and a swaybar. in my opinion i would rather change out the sway bars than the shocks if i only had one choice to make in the handling dept. personally i would upgrade the sways, links and shocks in one shot. you will have a jeep that handles like it's on rails. good luck.
I have the stock shocks, rear srt bar and new bwoodies on all 4 corners. The floaty feeling is greatly reduced, cornering is far better, but there is some understeer with this setup, so will upgrade with front srt bar when I do the struts and shocks. Bwoodies are not for off road though, as there is no ball joint on them and the suspension does not articulate. I go off road regularly on weekends, and as much as they improve on road performance, they detract from off road, so going back to stock links and will have the Bwoodies up for sale soon when I get my Koni heavy tracks.
I don't want to diminish any off-road capability, as I need what it has now. Well, I like doing things in steps so I know what effect each mod has. So, I will install the Bilsteins first, but I will buy new OEM bushings for the sway bar mounts. Next, I'll probably try a set of endlinks from Rockauto, like the heavy duty deeza, moog, etc.
I looked at the links from rockauto and stay away from those cheapos, Deeza and some others have a plastic bearing, (see how long that lasts off road) and Moog is not so good as they used to be. Bendix/AC Delco are probably the best ones built that rockauto sells.
I installed the swaybar links and noticed a difference in the handling on my SRT8. There's less body roll turn in and more oversteer (or less understeer) than before. I can feel the edge of grip in the tires now whereas before, the body roll was telling me I was going to fast and I'd let up before reaching the edge of grip.
It's a difference in vehicle dynamics that depending on how you drive, you can leverage. I like the tighter suspension where I can drive up to and through the edge of tire grip. This means I can take turns at speeds that allow the vehicle to '4-wheel' drift through the apex rather than roll through it.
The difference in those two is substantial when 'racing' a course as you can keep your speed up in turn exits which produces faster lap times. On the street, you're probably never going to get that technical in your driving so it becomes a preference on your street driving style IMO.
To me, the price was well worth the upgrade. The swaybar flex you're talking about is not modified through the bushing -- it's modified through the swaybar links. This is the torsion point for the swaybar IMO. The bushing keeps the swaybar in place to the frame as a stability point. At least that's how I see it.
You are correct that some of the lean comes from the soft factory bushings,but it's not the only culprit. The factory sway bar is responsible for about 75%. The other problem is that nobody makes just replacement bushings, other than the dealership. So those won't be any better than what you have now.
you have to grease them, and only use synthetic grease on any poly bushings; wheel bearing grease or any other petroleum based grease will degrade poly.
Also, I'll have to look into the plastic bushings. I thought some of the rockauto links had rubber with metal reinforcement and others even had polyurethane bushings.
Now I'm thinking I should just wait and install the bwoodys...
Well, I just ordered them. Is installing them as easy at looks? Just unload the suspension and jack the wheel a little to get things lined up.
If that's the case I plan to install the Bwoodys first and then the Bilsteins...or should I install the Bilsteins first and then the Bwoodys... I want to try to compare what effect each mod has so I can write a post about it. I'm also going to buy new stock sway bar bushings.
They don't seem all that hard to install and uninstall, right? Just eight more bolts after I remove the wheels. I probably won't do it back to back weekends, but maybe it's worth the effort.
BTW, while googling I read that a Saturn car owner that installed the BWoody links had the mounting point on his strut ripped off because of the additional force that the links transmit. Am I right to expect that the mountings points on the WK are much stronger? I mean it's an off-road truck.
IF you are buying stock replacement links and Bwoodies, note that there are many different manufacturers, and a few seem poorly designed, with plastic bearings. Even the OEM from Chrysler are not very well built, and wear out in about 25-35k or so.
The Bwoodies and rear SRT really tighten up the handling and rid the floaty feeling, but the ride is also rougher as a result. It all depends on what you use the vehicle for; for off road, the SRT Sways and Bwoodies are a negative and far too rough, but for on road only, and highway driving, they are much, much better.
I bought the Bwoody's. Not buying any other end links. BIG-O I'll take pictures when I do the install probably a couple weeks from now.
I'm changing out shocks to Bilstein HDs, putting in new stock sway bar bushings, and Bwoody endlinks. I do want to leave some offroad capability for slightly rougher trails and washed out dirt roads. I won't really be rock-crawling, but may have to scale the occasional soccer ball sized rock....like twice a year...
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