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  #25  
Old 10-08-2010, 02:36 PM
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Re: SmartBeams with HID High Beams

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Originally Posted by cutt288 View Post
please keep me posted on the out come i have the smartbeam system and i like it also. but how did you get your fogs to stay on with your high beams. did you have to cut anything?
So dredging up this thread renewed my vigor in getting this figured out. I started researching this again and it seems that a couple of solid-state relays might just be the ticket. I ordered a pair of them and they will be delivered in like a week and a half.

My only concern with doing this is that I have each HID ballast individually relayed. In other words, the passenger side high beam has its own relay and the driver side high beam also has its own. Same for the low beams and the fogs. After reading how this whole sitch is supposed to go down, I fear that the lights may shut off at slightly different times instead of operating as one. If this is the case, the solution would be to run both lights off of a single relay.

We'll see what happens. Unfortunately, we can not alter the modulation frequency of the PWM signal, which puts us at a major disadvantage. It is up to the relay at this point. Also, solid-state relays actually switch faster than a regular relay. This could actually prove to be detrimental because the relay may switch so fast that the HID kit begins to flicker. This is where altering the modulation frequency would be beneficial. We'll see what happens. Hopefully the modulation is fast enough that the HID kit "sees" a consistent signal.

Sound like gibberish? I'm thinking out loud. Bottom line: I'll test the solid-state relays and report back on whether or not they are a viable option.
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2008 Grand Cherokee SRT - Steel Blue Metallic - SRT Option Group I

Interior: Full V-LED Interior, Kicker Audio System Upgrade (w/ Dual Subs), Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT Nav System, SRT Door Sills (all 4 doors), Illuminated SRT Sills, Full WeatherTech Floor Coverings
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  #26  
Old 02-10-2011, 01:50 PM
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Re: SmartBeams with HID High Beams

Any new updates on this? I just installed HID's and really liked the smart beam feature that is now not working. There has to be a solution.
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  #27  
Old 02-10-2011, 01:55 PM
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Re: SmartBeams with HID High Beams

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Originally Posted by Skinner5.7 View Post
Any new updates on this? I just installed HID's and really liked the smart beam feature that is now not working. There has to be a solution.
My god, there is actually someone else that is interested in these???

I tried the other set of "cancellers" and they didn't work at all.

I have the previously mentioned solid-state relays sitting on my table at home, all I need to do is work up the motivation to pull my front bumper off and try them. I will post results when I do so.
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2008 Grand Cherokee SRT - Steel Blue Metallic - SRT Option Group I

Interior: Full V-LED Interior, Kicker Audio System Upgrade (w/ Dual Subs), Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT Nav System, SRT Door Sills (all 4 doors), Illuminated SRT Sills, Full WeatherTech Floor Coverings
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  #28  
Old 02-10-2011, 02:11 PM
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Re: SmartBeams with HID High Beams

Sounds good. I will begin researching as well and let you know what I find. I'm thinking it has to do with resistance values in the can-bus system
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  #29  
Old 02-10-2011, 02:45 PM
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Re: SmartBeams with HID High Beams

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Originally Posted by Skinner5.7 View Post
Sounds good. I will begin researching as well and let you know what I find. I'm thinking it has to do with resistance values in the can-bus system
More than likely. Our grandfather Rob has been kind enough to provide me with the factory service manual so I am going to look in there, too. However, even if that is the case, I don't believe that is the problem at hand. If you read back through my admittedly boring posts, I believe the problem is that the system uses pulse-width modulation (PWM) to "dim" the high beams before it shuts them off completely. You may or may not have noticed this with your halogens.

Again to recap, PWM is essentially equivalent to switching the circuit on and off extremely fast at verying rates and duty cycles. This is fine for most things (including halogen bulbs) but one thing that doesn't seem to be okay with this is a relay. When the PWM gets to a certain point, the relay switches off altogether and then the ballast shuts off. For the most part, this is okay save for the fact that the relay makes a horrendous buzzing noise as it switches on and off at god knows how many times per second. Not to mention the untold life-shortening you are subjecting the relay to.

The solid-state relay (SSR) has no moving parts and thus will not make noise. I am hoping that this will make operation acceptable. I do have a few concerns, however. SSR's switch much faster than regular relays. I am worried that the SSR will actually be able to keep up with the PWM and the HID's will start flickering.

The other concern is that all relays have a "pull-in" voltage and a "hold-in" voltage (prob not the correct tech terms). Pull-in is the amount of voltage that is required to close the relay and hold-in is the amount of voltage required to hold it closed (which is always less than the pull-in voltage). Depending on the specs of the PWM, there could be some interferences there that mess with the operation. I need the specs of both the relay and the jeep computer to determine if they will occur.

It's probably just easier to go straight to a functional test...
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  #30  
Old 02-11-2011, 07:57 AM
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Cant wait to see if you can get it to work. I'd like to put HID on my WK but i like the smartbeam feature and since I'm in Canada I need daytime running light which is using the highbeam bulbs at a lower voltage with he help of the pwm.
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  #31  
Old 02-11-2011, 08:40 AM
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Re: SmartBeams with HID High Beams

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Originally Posted by Gomer View Post
Cant wait to see if you can get it to work. I'd like to put HID on my WK but i like the smartbeam feature and since I'm in Canada I need daytime running light which is using the highbeam bulbs at a lower voltage with he help of the pwm.
Yeah, the DRL function is something I don't have so I dunno how much help I am going to be there. V-LED's makes a module that is designed supposedly for what you are talking about:

http://www.v-leds.com/Exterior-LED/D...-p6297704.html

A lot of people have used these on GM cars/SUV's with great success and the GM cars also use PWM for their DRL's.


Anyways, concerning the SmartBeams, I had an epiphany yesterday that made me think I had cracked it. While reading about the SmartBeams in the FSM, I read that the high beam indicator on the dash comes on whenever the SmartBeams turn on, and stays on until they turn off completely. I know this sounds obvious but the important thing here is that the high beam indicator is NOT affected by the PWM of the SmartBeams.

As such, I thought, "Oh, I'll just splice into that wire and then they will work great, right? Wrong. Problem is, there is no discrete wire. The cluster has a module inside of it and receives the signal to turn on the high beam indicator via the CANBUS communications system. I don't think there is any real way to separate this signal and make it usable. I was pretty bummed out.

Thus, it seems my only option is to try the solid-state relays. I also spoke to a hardcore electrical engineer out here at the plant (I'm a mechanical who "dabbles" in electronics) and he said that the only way to filter out a PWM signal is to use capacitance. He then went on further to say that the required amount of capacitance is inversely proportional to frequency of the PWM signal. He guessed that since this is on a car, the frequency is probably pretty low, thus, I would need a "shitload" of capacitance.
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  #32  
Old 02-11-2011, 02:10 PM
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Re: SmartBeams with HID High Beams

So does the vled product work?
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  #33  
Old 02-11-2011, 02:17 PM
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Re: SmartBeams with HID High Beams

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Originally Posted by wkjeepgirl86 View Post
So does the vled product work?
For DRLs? I don't know. My Jeep does not have DRL's activated on them.

I did try them for the SmartBeam problem and they did NOT work. I don't know what was going on but when the SmartBeams were trying to shut the headlights off, the headlights would stay on indefinitely. I think what was going on was that the DRL module was essentially a capacitor and it was not allowing the coil of the relay to collapse.

The only way I could get the high beams to shut off was to pull the relay out. This jives with my theory.
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Interior: Full V-LED Interior, Kicker Audio System Upgrade (w/ Dual Subs), Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT Nav System, SRT Door Sills (all 4 doors), Illuminated SRT Sills, Full WeatherTech Floor Coverings
Exterior: 8000k Highs/Lows/Fogs/Reverse HID's, Color Changing LED Front Turn Signals, LED Tails, LIPS Rear Fog Harness, LED Corner & License Lights, RM360 Antenna
Performance: BWoody 4" CAI, Predator with MHP tune, SW 1-7/8" Headers (Off-Road), SW Exhaust, BWoody End Links, R1 D/S Rotors, Hawk Pads
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