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  #25  
Old 05-18-2013, 06:41 PM
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Re: 2014 V6 fuel !!

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  #26  
Old 05-20-2013, 06:49 PM
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Re: 2014 V6 fuel !!

<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:OfficeDocumentSettings> <o:AllowPNG/> </o:OfficeDocumentSettings> </xml><![endif]--> Let's get it straight!. The "85" in E85 refers to it being 85% ethanol. It has nothing to do with the octane rating. The "87" in 87 gasoline refers to the octane rating. Higher octane fuels are always better for the engine and potentially give better fuel economy if the engine is tuned for it or able to tune itself for higher octane fuels. It then becomes a trade-off of the higher cost of high octane fuel to the better economy. Which is best for you depends on your driving style and the relative costs of fuels in your area. Basically, if you are a little old lady, E85 is probably the most economical. Alternatively, if you are a lead-foot, higher octane might prove to be more economical for you.
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  #27  
Old 05-20-2013, 07:57 PM
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Re: 2014 V6 fuel !!

"Higher octane fuels are always better" I disagree strongly. Have said before octane has nothing to do with power. E85 is at least (some debate) 95 octane but requires a richer mixture to achieve the same power. Octane is about how fast the fuel burns (highter octane - slower burn - more advance required).

Not saying higher octane is bad, just does no good (exception, if pulling a heavy load at slow engine speeds in high temperature conditions then going up a grade or so (from 87 to 89) may avoid detonation).

But just saying more is better reminds me of Will Roger's saying, "It's not what people don't know that hurts them, it's what they know that ain't true."
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Old 05-21-2013, 02:36 AM
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Re: 2014 V6 fuel !!

I never said higher octane has more power. It has the same energy rating as low octane fuel. However, it allows higher compression and earlier spark advance before the onset of pinging so greater burn efficiency and longer power stroke. In other words, more power can be extracted from the fuel. Modern engines have knock sensors that adjust the timing to suit the detonation characteristics on the fuel so, in throry, they should be able to take advantage of higher octane fuel.
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  #29  
Old 05-21-2013, 03:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobT View Post
I never said higher octane has more power. It has the same energy rating as low octane fuel. However, it allows higher compression and earlier spark advance before the onset of pinging so greater burn efficiency and longer power stroke. In other words, more power can be extracted from the fuel. Modern engines have knock sensors that adjust the timing to suit the detonation characteristics on the fuel so, in throry, they should be able to take advantage of higher octane fuel.
In theory sure, but not in application. The timing will only advance as far as required for the recommended fuel, whether it be 87 or 89 depending on v6 or v8 here. It will not adjust for premium.
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Old 05-21-2013, 08:06 AM
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Re: 2014 V6 fuel !!

Is a little more complicated than that. Modern computers use look-up maps for engine settings like advance (faster than calculating). There are some variables (e.g. retard for knock) but usually there is a maximum allowed for a specified operating range which is designed for the expected fuel. If this is for 87 then 89 will never be optomised since it needs more advance.

If any current GC engine could run as well on higher octane it would be the V6 since it is designed for 95+ octane equivalent E85.

Back in the day, we would just bump the distributer a few degrees for premium fuel (heck half the time we'd pull the vacuum advance because few cared about MPG).

That is a tad more difficult today (tuners often "adjust" the advance maps for higher octane and tell customers to run premium).

Part of the problem is that few really understand combustion theory (most are kept in cages) and just about all IC engines are a kludge that tries to maximise chamber pressure at a specific point in the Otto cycle (see also Carnot).

We have come a long way since salesmen waved their ties over a badly knocking engine and a miracle occured.

Will admit to occasionally making obscure references to see if anyone knows what I am talking about but everything you need is online. Never in history has it been so easy to find out things, all you need is to know is how to ask the right question.
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Old 05-21-2013, 12:31 PM
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Re: 2014 V6 fuel !!

Quote:
Originally Posted by padgett View Post
Will admit to occasionally making obscure references to see if anyone knows what I am talking about but everything you need is online. Never in history has it been so easy to find out things, all you need is to know is how to ask the right question.
\

You also need a way to figure which answers are correct and which are bs.

In spite of what the blonde in the State Farm commercial says, they can put it on the internet, even if it isn't true.



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Old 05-21-2013, 12:54 PM
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Re: 2014 V6 fuel !!

In order to ask the right question you need to know most of the answer.
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Old 05-21-2013, 01:01 PM
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Re: 2014 V6 fuel !!

Quote:
Originally Posted by padgett View Post
In order to ask the right question you need to know most of the answer.
So true!
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Old 05-21-2013, 01:10 PM
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Re: 2014 V6 fuel !!

Quote:
Originally Posted by padgett View Post
In order to ask the right question you need to know most of the answer.




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