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  #49  
Old 10-08-2013, 06:57 PM
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Re: 2014 V6 versus 2013 V8

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Originally Posted by JohnC View Post
Herr is a good real world example for those who don't get the difference gearing and multiple speeds can do. My first car that I got in 1987 was a '69 Firebird with a 350 2bbl and a 2spd powerglide. It had 2.56:1 rear end gears. The first time I ran it down the 1/4 it needed over 17 seconds. I changed the transmission to a 3spd TH400 and a 3.55 rear. It then ran the 1/4 in 15.8. 1-1/2 seconds just because of gearing and the trans.
Honestly, It sounds like you really wanted the HEMI and maybe you should of got it. I'm not going to say the 2011 V8 or the 2014 V8 is up to SRT standards but it also wasn't tuned for outright performance. If it was, jeep would of tuned the engine for 91 octane. My reason for choosing the V8 was because a 50K+ jeep should drive like luxury and feel effortless to move around. I couldn't validate the argument that I was buying a 50K + SUV to save gas and be economical. Even though the diesel was the first reason I started to look into the 2014.
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  #50  
Old 10-08-2013, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CIEGOS View Post

Please enlighten us on the differences between Motor Trends and Motorweeks testing equipment and (THIS IS THE BIG ONE)how the differences would generate a substantial discrepancy between times. Specifics would be best. This is the internet after all.
Also, 7.3 (v8) < 7.5 (v6) is not a dead heat.

You are aware the 11-13 v8 had a 3.45:1 rear end? The '14 v6 has a 3.45:1 rear end. 3.45:1=3.45:1

Are you sure a comparison of going from a 2 speed to a 3 speed with large increase in rear end ratio is a good example to use in this circumstance?
You just don't get it. The 8 spd has a first gear somewhere around 4.70:1. The '13 Hemi had around a 3.00:1. Every gear is multiplied by the rear gear for the overall ratio. The 8 spd. Would have to start in 3rd in order for it to be the same gearing. You can't just look at the rear end gear. If you really want accurate measurements, look at the same magazine. Car and Driver got the same times for the '11 Hemi and the '14 V6. The V6 was quicker on the passing. The 2/10 of a second you are citing would be less than 1 car length to 60. There have also been tests that show the Hemi at 8 seconds. The slight slip of the tire is more than 2/10. How quickly one presses the accelerator could be 2/10. The same car running the same test back to back could be more than 2/10. If it weren't so, then you should enter some bracket racing. You'd win every time. Why are you trying to argue with facts. Either take it or trade up for Hemi 8spd.
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  #51  
Old 10-08-2013, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilv2128 View Post

Honestly, It sounds like you really wanted the HEMI and maybe you should of got it. I'm not going to say the 2011 V8 or the 2014 V8 is up to SRT standards but it also wasn't tuned for outright performance. If it was, jeep would of tuned the engine for 91 octane. My reason for choosing the V8 was because a 50K+ jeep should drive like luxury and feel effortless to move around. I couldn't validate the argument that I was buying a 50K + SUV to save gas and be economical. Even though the diesel was the first reason I started to look into the 2014.
I would have just bought a Hemi then. A jeep is not a performance vehicle and I don't tow. The V6 is more than adequate and I only paid $42 and change. My BMW is much quicker than a Hemi and fills the need when I want some performance. If not the motorcycle comes in handy.
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  #52  
Old 10-08-2013, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lstowell View Post
Now, for your benefit, since you are ignoring Carroll Shelby's cubic inches rule, why not remove that 350 and put in a 421?

More gears helps an engine with a very narrow torque curve and peaky horsepower far more than it does a larger engine with a fatter torque curve and broad power band.

My old 66 SS 427 [taken to 466 for grins] with a 4 speed and 3.07 rear end would have eaten that Firebird for lunch, even if launched in 2nd gear--but it was never stupid enough to take on a Keith Black Mopar 426 with 4.56 locker rear.

This is just beating a dead, slow, V6 horse, even if it is wearing 8 horseshoes.
The firebird bacame a bored 400 shortly after. It ran low 12's all day long. Tried a 150 shot on it once at the track and got kicked off for no roll bar. That ended up with a 10.70. Would gladly have run your SS.
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  #53  
Old 10-08-2013, 07:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilv2128 View Post

I'm driving the V8 as a daily driver now so I'm not sure what you mean the V8 is a dog, are you comparing it to a corvette?
You can compare it to 80% of the cars on the road. The 8 spd just got it to run a 14.9. A Toyota Camry with a V6 runs a 14.2. The Accord does 14.4. A Subaru Forester with a 4cyl. turbo is quicker. A V6 Rav4 is quicker. Just about every V6 SUV us quicker than it. When it had the old fake 6spd. Most 4cyl cars were quicker than it. This is where us V6 owners accept that its a 2.5 ton SUV and not a hot rod. The Hemi guys can't seem to get over this though.
P.S. I just got back from a trip down the shore. Got 26.2 mpg on regular gas and can still run the same 0-60 and 1/4 mile as the '13 Hemi.
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  #54  
Old 10-08-2013, 07:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnC View Post

You can compare it to 80% of the cars on the road. The 8 spd just got it to run a 14.9. A Toyota Camry with a V6 runs a 14.2. The Accord does 14.4. A Subaru Forester with a 4cyl. turbo is quicker. A V6 Rav4 is quicker. Just about every V6 SUV us quicker than it. When it had the old fake 6spd. Most 4cyl cars were quicker than it. This is where us V6 owners accept that its a 2.5 ton SUV and not a hot rod. The Hemi guys can't seem to get over this though.
P.S. I just got back from a trip down the shore. Got 26.2 mpg on regular gas and can still run the same 0-60 and 1/4 mile as the '13 Hemi.
This guy has to be an out of work US congressman. I am almost positive.
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Old 10-08-2013, 07:35 PM
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Nah, then I wouldn't be posting truths.
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Old 10-08-2013, 08:10 PM
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Re: 2014 V6 versus 2013 V8

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Originally Posted by JohnC View Post
You can compare it to 80% of the cars on the road. The 8 spd just got it to run a 14.9. A Toyota Camry with a V6 runs a 14.2. The Accord does 14.4. A Subaru Forester with a 4cyl. turbo is quicker. A V6 Rav4 is quicker. Just about every V6 SUV us quicker than it. When it had the old fake 6spd. Most 4cyl cars were quicker than it. This is where us V6 owners accept that its a 2.5 ton SUV and not a hot rod. The Hemi guys can't seem to get over this though.
P.S. I just got back from a trip down the shore. Got 26.2 mpg on regular gas and can still run the same 0-60 and 1/4 mile as the '13 Hemi.
Yeah, that's a good point and something that I've said before. These aren't fast vehicles in any sense. Well, maybe compared to a basic econobox, but not compared to your average midsize sedan and certainly not compared to anything "sporty". So it's not so much a comparison about numbers, but more a comparison on how it feels out on the road. To me, driving an underpowered vehicle is no fun. Now with the 8-speed, I don't think the V6 is underpowered at all. And I never thought the V8 was underpowered in the first place. The 8-speed just made it even better. Still though, my 4-cylinder car would easily run circles around either engine. Actually, it runs low 13s, so it would be in the same league as the SRT8 Grand Cherokee....and that's with a 4 banger.
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Old 10-08-2013, 08:14 PM
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Re: 2014 V6 versus 2013 V8

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Originally Posted by CIEGOS View Post

(Motorweek)



2014 v6 0-60: 8.3
Please don't use Motorweek as an example. If you look at their test results, they are consistently waaay slower than the times a car mag like Car and Driver or Motor Trend gets. Why? I dunno...but they always seem to be far off the mark. Strange, but true.
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Old 10-08-2013, 08:40 PM
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My jeep does drive effortless! On the hwy or in the city what ever speed you are driving and when you give it gas it just moves accordingly. most times it drops a gear or two at a time and you wouldn't know unless u seen it on the dash go from 8-6 or 8-7. And that was the biggest selling point when buying this one and trading down from a truck with so much power and torque. To say it feels under powered I think is crazy for daily driving. Only when towing you can argue that but that's another time and place. As for Eco mode if u leave it on and drive it the way you want to drive it learns your driving and will eliminate 80% of that short shifting stuff. One other thing my 5.3 chevy CC with a real 6 spd auto feels stronger than the jeep but the jeep is quicker and easier to drive because the 8 spd is more efficient.
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Old 10-09-2013, 10:56 AM
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Re: 2014 V6 versus 2013 V8

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Originally Posted by JohnC View Post
You can compare it to 80% of the cars on the road. The 8 spd just got it to run a 14.9. A Toyota Camry with a V6 runs a 14.2. The Accord does 14.4. A Subaru Forester with a 4cyl. turbo is quicker. A V6 Rav4 is quicker. Just about every V6 SUV us quicker than it. When it had the old fake 6spd. Most 4cyl cars were quicker than it. This is where us V6 owners accept that its a 2.5 ton SUV and not a hot rod. The Hemi guys can't seem to get over this though.
P.S. I just got back from a trip down the shore. Got 26.2 mpg on regular gas and can still run the same 0-60 and 1/4 mile as the '13 Hemi.
I wouldn't say "80%". Most of the new Camrys and Accords bought are 4-bangers. Most of the Foresters are N/A. RAV4 no longer has a V6. I do agree with you that the 11-13 Hemis were a disappointment in acceleration -- most real tests posting 7.3-7.5s 0-60s. Most of those were high-end (loaded/heavy) models. Luckily, Jeep fixed that in '14, and it now runs 0-60 in 6.5 secs.
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  #60  
Old 10-09-2013, 11:11 AM
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Re: 2014 V6 versus 2013 V8

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Originally Posted by JohnC View Post
The firebird bacame a bored 400 shortly after. It ran low 12's all day long. Tried a 150 shot on it once at the track and got kicked off for no roll bar. That ended up with a 10.70. Would gladly have run your SS.
Well, gee, why not just change your story every time someone questions your story or facts?

Not being psychic that you went on and made more modifications, I questioned your logic and conclusions.... and possibly the relevance to the hemi/vs v6 comparison where even the magazines themselves note that unless both tests are done the same day, they are pretty much irrelevant and are also irrelevant when compared to results from other magazines.
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