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  #49  
Old 01-19-2012, 02:47 PM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

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Originally Posted by CaptRB View Post
I take it back. They don't even compete on paper! The loaded Overland GC offers too much in the way of 4X4 technology for the 4runner to come close.

;-)

Robert B
NY
Enlighten me. Other than the Quadralift (which isn't the 4wd system, btw) tell me what the WK2 offers that the 4Runner does not.
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  #50  
Old 01-19-2012, 03:25 PM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

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Originally Posted by MSCA View Post
Enlighten me. Other than the Quadralift (which isn't the 4wd system, btw) tell me what the WK2 offers that the 4Runner does not.
Made in America and American history while fighting against the countries that created Toyota and BMW.
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  #51  
Old 01-19-2012, 03:29 PM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

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Originally Posted by nathantw View Post
Made in America and American history while fighting against the countries that created Toyota and BMW.

OMG....lol.

Let me rephrase the question into something more specific and understandable for those who don't follow the discussion:

Other than the Quadralift (which isn't the 4wd system, btw) tell me what the WK2 offers in its 4wd system that the 4Runner does not.
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  #52  
Old 01-19-2012, 05:07 PM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

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Originally Posted by MSCA View Post
Enlighten me. Other than the Quadralift (which isn't the 4wd system, btw) tell me what the WK2 offers that the 4Runner does not.


If you're referring specifically to the 4x4 systems, the quadra lift is as much a part of it as the tires and suspension geometry. The ability to increase ground clearance in heavy snow is a huge factor and I don't see off roaders complaining either.

Based on my admittedly shallow research up to this point I also believe that the Grand Cherokee's Quadra Drive system is more advanced.

Beyond that you only have to drive the 4runner at 60MPH to know the differences. The Jeep feels a lot like the Mercedes M class we test drove, solid, incredibly quiet and yet responsive at the wheel, which is to say....not at all like the 4runner. As I understand the dated 4runner is getting a full makeover, so it's probably unfair to compare them after Jeep's recent makeover.

Robert B
NY
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  #53  
Old 01-19-2012, 06:25 PM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

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Originally Posted by MSCA View Post
OMG....lol.
Sorry, I was just being a d*ck. I knew what you meant.
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  #54  
Old 01-19-2012, 06:33 PM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

Don't do it, if you aren't comfortable then you'll only have regrets.

For me I'll never purchase another VW (/Audi/Porsche/Lambo/Bentley) based on my experiences their products may be good or bad like all others but there is a 100% chance in my mind that their customer service is the worst and they just don't give a crap.

On the other hand, I have had some occasional issues with Chrysler products in the past and they have always made it right, it's why I'm a repeat and continuing customer. Current products are phenomenal.
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  #55  
Old 01-19-2012, 07:58 PM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

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Originally Posted by MSCA View Post
Like I said, if YOU don't like the 4Runner, that's fine. But just because YOU don't like it doesn't mean it's not a competitor. Plenty of people cross shop both vehicles because they compete in the same market segment and for the same buyers.

And if you think the Grand Cherokee is in a different class when it comes to driving in the snow, you are sorely mistaken, I happen to own both vehicles in question and I can say with authority that they are very comparable. And to be completely fair, the WK2's snow capability depends largely upon the 4wd system, with QT1 being the least capable system. A Grand Cherokee with QT1 simply does not compare to a 4Runner. I know because I own one.

And by the way, the 4Runner IS a truck. It's a body-on-frame chassis with a fully boxed ladder frame underneath. And it has a live rear axle, not IRS. So yeah, it rides like a truck. I find mine very comfortable, even though I know it's a truck at heart.


I drove the Limited 4runner and it was not even close to the 2012 Overland I drove. You even point out that the 4runner IS a truck without IRS. And I was never comparing the base Grand Cherokee's 4x4 system. The Overland with Quadra Drive is what I'll be buying and combined with the quadra lift I don't think a 4runner is in the same class. It sure doesn't handle as well, ride as well, dampen noise and vibration or really do anything as well. It's getting a redesign for that very reason.
In one respect you're right. I looked at both and at first they looked like the same class. But as I dug deeper and test drove them I could see that the Jeep was light years better by design (build quality? we'll see!). Some might say the Subaru WRX STi and Mistubishi Evo X are in the same class. But a good driver who's spent time in both knows otherwise.

Robert B
NY
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  #56  
Old 01-19-2012, 09:11 PM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

Consider Lifetime maxcare.

One thing to note, jeeps (and chrysler in general) has a pretty stringent maintenance schedule. 30-36k fluids front rear diff, tcase, spark plugs. 60k tranny fluid. Adds to cost of ownership.

I have an 07 WK here in upstate ny as well. Have winter tires on it with studs and the vehicle is an absolute beast in the snow. I'd put it up against my parents new outback or even older 4runner any day.
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  #57  
Old 01-20-2012, 10:51 AM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

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Originally Posted by CaptRB View Post
If you're referring specifically to the 4x4 systems, the quadra lift is as much a part of it as the tires and suspension geometry. The ability to increase ground clearance in heavy snow is a huge factor and I don't see off roaders complaining either.

Based on my admittedly shallow research up to this point I also believe that the Grand Cherokee's Quadra Drive system is more advanced.

Beyond that you only have to drive the 4runner at 60MPH to know the differences. The Jeep feels a lot like the Mercedes M class we test drove, solid, incredibly quiet and yet responsive at the wheel, which is to say....not at all like the 4runner. As I understand the dated 4runner is getting a full makeover, so it's probably unfair to compare them after Jeep's recent makeover.

Robert B
NY
Sigh....okay, I think we're finished here. I doubt you ever even drove a 4Runner, based upon the fact that you didn't even realize that the 4Runner was a competitor to the Grand Cherokee. And of course an even bigger hint is the fact that the new generation of the 4Runner came out at about the same time as the WK2. Based upon past history, the new 5th generation 4Runner should have about a 7-year run before it is gets a full makeover again. Sorry, but your research is weaksauce at best.
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Old 01-20-2012, 10:56 AM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

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Originally Posted by CaptRB View Post
.... It's getting a redesign for that very reason...
Robert B
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Um...no. No, it's not.

And yes, it is basically a truck. That was the intention/purpose from the very beginning. I find that as an advantage because I tend to use mine for things that would normally require a truck. Just this past fall, I used my 4Runner to uproot some stumps in the yard. I had no reservations at all because I know that the frame and suspension could handle it. I wish I would have taken some pictures....
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  #59  
Old 01-20-2012, 11:05 AM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

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Originally Posted by beepbeepimajeep View Post

I have an 07 WK here in upstate ny as well. Have winter tires on it with studs and the vehicle is an absolute beast in the snow. I'd put it up against my parents new outback or even older 4runner any day.

Where are you in upstate NY? And which 4wd system do you have on your WK? I ask because I'm actually looking for someone in my area to do a little snow competition with my 4Runner. If you are close, we should meet up.

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  #60  
Old 01-20-2012, 11:39 AM
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Re: Afraid to Buy a 2012 GC

Okay....let's take it from the top! And keep it friendly. Suggesting that I lied about test driving a car is a pretty sad way to discuss anything in a forum. FYI, I test drove the limited twice, once at a dealer in New Rochelle and then more recently here upstate. We also test drove the Overland two weeks ago. Also: I'm a 49 and a yachtbroker. I have a lot of friends with dealerships and sweet cars, so I get to try out a lot of nice rides. Most recently I fell in love with the Nissan GT-R.

According to Carevos.com a redesign for the 4runner IS on the way, probably for 2013 or 2014 announcement. When I explained to the dealer that we preferred the GC we had a nice chat and he also said that it would be getting a makeover. Specifically this would be a response to the GC and the new Pathfinder. Is this true? I don't know, but based on my time in the 4runner they had better be VERY busy sweetening that SUV.

You keep insisting that these two SUV's are the same, yet one has an adjustable air suspension and unibody while the other has a ladder frame and so on. A 2007 GC had more in common with a 4runner of course. I'd suggest test driving the latest Limited 4runner against the 2012 Overland and you can tell me if you think they feel remotely the same. The air suspension is a game changer, even on the highway. The quiet interior and solid handling is FAR above the 4runner. See for yourself.

True, for a consumer with minimal requirements, they might appear the same. Take a closer look and there's no question how far apart they now are. A new 4runner feels downright primitive at the wheel by comparison. Also: I started this thread because I've always owned Japanese cars and trusted them. You can bet that I would have LOVED for a 4Runner to win over the new Overland. It would have made my decision easier. In fact I still would have chosen the 4runner if it were a closer battle. But it's not. I have a seriously tough road to climb, especially in snow. We also want a road vehicle that has a lot of luxury. And we want to keep things in the 50K range as a top end.

Have you actually driven and closely inspected what a new Overland can do?

BTW, we are in Kent Cliffs, one of the highest points in our area. Snowfall is typically 30% worse here. Amazing since you can quite literally drive down our 2.4 mile road and find it just raining. If this was not the case I'd be getting a Q7!


Robert B
NY
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