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  #25  
Old 04-06-2013, 08:32 AM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

Our Ford C-Max has SYNC and it pretty much works as advertised.
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  #26  
Old 04-06-2013, 09:24 AM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

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Originally Posted by Winecity View Post
I owned two Touaregs. Both loaded V8 with air springs. The 2013 Summit is very close to my 05. The later Touaregs lack features that I got with my Summit. VW has so many issues, transmissions, drive shaft, leaking valve covers, tires . The Diesel is nice but you need a maintenance contract and a plan to sell a week before it ends. I did not and I spent a lot fixing it.
Maintenance is very high. My ownership over 95k miles was over $15,000.
Don't think this was high. If you get into a forum for them you will get a good idea of the issues.
Are the new ones better? I question VW as the issues did not get addressed with the Valvebody on the 6speeds, or the driveshaft center bearing. Both are now 60 to 90k replacements.
VW does engineer a good SUV. Mine looked almost new after 8 years. I wanted to keep forever. I found it cheaper to buy a new GC vs the repair costs and maintenance of keeping it.
I think this was the case with the T1. Many T2 owners (including myself) haven't come across the same problems. Maybe VW fixed many of them? Truck is built better? Needless to say, the cost of a German Automobile (I've owned five of them, Porsche, BMW, twp Audis, VW) is ridiculous at times, and I would caution anyone that was considering one to consider ponying up for the extra warranty features if they planned on keeping it long. One "simple" repair can cost a ton. Heck, even replacing a battery on my Touareg was quoted at nearly $600 by the dealer.

Again, German cars. German prices.

And again, if VW still had the features on the T3 that I have on my T2, I wouldn't be on Jeep Garage (I am happy to be here, though). Can't wait for a sexy 2014.
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Old 04-06-2013, 10:50 AM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

I looked at the T3 . Three years of maintenance for free is good. The interior is not that nice. Dealer was going to sell the Diesel Ex for 55k. I got another deal on the X5 for the same. I the looked at my GC. It had the same content as my 05. air sup, twospeed transfer case.
I like to buy and keep. The GC is a better fit with the lifetime warranty. Any German SUV will cost you going forward. The X5 has run flat The Maintenance won't rotate the tires. If your brakes are 1% left ate the end of maintenance, they won't replace.
The VW dealers won't replace brake fluid at year two you will pay.
I do think the Germans make a good SUV that is expensive to own. The GC is a great SUV, with German engineering and American practically. Reg gas, cheep maintenance and 19 miles to a gallon puts the Diesel into a needs basis not my needs.
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  #28  
Old 04-08-2013, 12:27 PM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

Well, having spent the entire weekend with two different rigs I can honestly say, that while the Explorer Sport is a nice rig, it's not my cup of tea.


All Saturday I spent with the Overland V8 (as the power will be inline with the CRD):
  • It was supremely quiet (my in laws kept remarking how quiet it was)
  • Roomy (vastly more so than my current 09)
  • Very smooth ride (way better then I would have expected)
  • Lots of features (with the ability to turn them on and off, like the Blind Spot monitoring chimes for example)
  • The ACC took a bit to get to set right (took me a couple tries to figure out how to set it versus normal cruise)
  • Fits in the garage (barely)
  • The heated and reclining rear seats are a big hit with my 60+ father in law.
  • Transmission is like butter (I literally could not tell it was shifting).
  • The MPG was horrid though (I have no idea how you Hemi guys can afford these things). I did 100 miles and averaged 14MPG with mixed City/Highway driving (70% highway, 30% city, staying at or below 60 on the highway).
  • UConnect lay out is a bit odd (as other have said, having to go through 3 menu's to get to the heated/cooled seat controls is annoying).
I then spent all Sunday with a Ford Explorer Sport (again, because the power is inline with the V8 and CRD):
  • It had very sharp handling
  • Overall a smooth ride (not as smooth as the Grand)
  • Intrusive road noise (more akin to the 09 I currently drive)
  • HUGE amount of cargo space with the back row of seats down. If I dropped both rows of seats I practically had a pickup truck bed.
  • Second row is atleast as comfortable as Grand (there was some disagreement on if it was more comfortable than the Grand).
  • Third row was not as uncomfortable as I'd expect (not roomy, but also not designed for a 6 year old only). Having the passenger side second row seat be able to roll forward 2 inches helped even more.
  • Having a 3rd row is hella nice (especially one this well designed)
  • Center stack was ok (not really any better or worse than the Grand).
  • "Overly" roomy. That is, it felt cavernous inside. We found in the front seats that we had to lean to a side to rest our arms on the door or center console. (Clearly designed for someone a lot "wider" than I am).
  • Backup camera is not as nice as it does not do the predictive lines based on the angle of the wheel like the Grand does)
  • The ACC was better than the Grand (to use/setup), but less friendly in function (The Grand geared down for me every time I signaled a lane change left in anticipation of an overtake).
  • The doors are HUGE and heavy. Very irritating and not overly user friendly in a parking lot (In a normal spot, we had trouble getting folks out of the back. Getting an adult out of the third row was actually impossible due to the way the second row folded up and the limited amount the doors would open).
  • MPG was a solid "Meh" at 16.7 MPG in mixed driving (70% highway, 30% city). The killer here is, that in order to get the full 365HP, you need to run some jungle juice in there and spring for Premium. Which is *more* then diesel where I live.
  • No Rain Sensing Wipers (WTF??)
  • I did see some weird glitches with the center stack:
    • The system locked out all volume controls (seriously, I had no ability to change the volume, I had to restart the vehicle to regain that ability).
    • The backup camera went nuts and would not clear form the center stack (again, had to restart the vehicle to clear it).
    • Plugging in my iPod, it spent the entire day indexing it (16GB, so not a ton), and never enabled the advanced features like, Shuffle, Play by Album, etc.. (Compared to the Grand, which, I plugged in my iPod and away we went, full control of everything)
  • No remote start (atleast via the fob)
  • I did like the instrument cluster in the Ford. Having the side screens be alterable was really nice, gave me a great deal more info than the Jeep system did in a glance (not spending a bunch of time poking through the menus like I did in the Grand to get what I was looking for).
  • Lower ride... which meant it scraped the air dam as I pulled into my drive way (NOT COOL.. a 4x4 SUV should not have that issue)
  • Barely... (like, literally 1/4 inch between the garage door and the front license plate bracket) fit in the garage.
  • $3,300 less then the Hemi equipped Overland (with ADG and AWY)
All in all, a nice rig, however, after the air dam scrapping, the difficulty getting in and out of the rear doors, the intrusive road noise, and the fuel expense (sure, you can run Regular in there, but you lose some horses and torque), the Ford Explorer Sport is out of the running.
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  #29  
Old 04-08-2013, 01:42 PM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

Helpful comparison, thanks Temerarius. I spent yesterday evening driving a couple rigs too, but just mere test drives. I took the GC V6 and the V8 for a spin, as well as an X5 35d. The V6 was impressively more spry than the 2013 version I drove 6 months ago (presumably because of the 8 speed) so that was a pleasant surprise. The hemi clearly wasn't lacking for power, but I probably don't NEED that type of power in my ride.

I was almost settled on the V6 (to not wait for the CRD) until I went and drove the X5 diesel. The X5 was quite a bit louder (due to the diesel) but the power was NICE! I think the specs shake out pretty similar (265 hp, 425 lb ft) and the X5 would accelerate just as well as the Hemi GC. My brother's trying to convince me to just go with the X5 (MUCH better handling and comfort on the inside - you can drive it like a sports sedan, as you'd expect from BMW). I'm not sure I want to go that route (would probably mean buying used, and I wanted something different since my last car was a BMW) but it's hard to think of many factual reasons against the X5. All of my counter arguments are emotional (the Jeep seems more "rugged", I don't want to buy used, etc.)

The one thing the X5 test drive definitely assured me of, though, is that I want the diesel. Whether it's an Italian diesel (in an American car) or a German diesel is still TBD, but I don't think I'll be springing for the V6 as quickly.
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  #30  
Old 04-08-2013, 01:52 PM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

I did the same comparison.

I took a V6 Grand out and played with it abit. It's nice. Much more zip than I was expecting and to be perfectly honest, probably perfectly fine for me.

But then I took the V8 and the crazy ass Ford Explorer Sport V6 Turbo out. I am usually a pretty sedate driver, but, holy cow, slapping down the petal on those and getting hurled into the back of your seat when I wanted to pass someone was *nice*. You can REALLY feel the torque coming into play.

It pretty much sealed the deal for me as well. I want the power (torque) of the V8 and the DI/Turbo V6, but want the mileage of the normal V6 (or better).

I have played around in an X5 and they are sharp in the corners (the Sport was similar, sport tuned so nice tight turns, little body roll, etc...). However, I have owned German before. German is nice... but pricey. That's my main hold off at truly delving into the X5, the ML350 BluTech, or the VW lines. Plus, as you pointed out, the Jeep is more rugged (more truck like). The woman commented that she felt safer and had a better command of the road (better view and such) in the Jeep. Add in the QD2 and QL systems in the Jeep are really nice to have. Not sure how often I'd use em, but they are there if I do (and I do a fair amount of hiking/kayaking/camping).
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  #31  
Old 04-08-2013, 06:29 PM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

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Originally Posted by Temerarius View Post
It pretty much sealed the deal for me as well. I want the power (torque) of the V8 and the DI/Turbo V6, but want the mileage of the normal V6 (or better).
So, what are going to go with? Just curious. Your post isn't clear as to what you have decided on. Thanks.
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Old 04-08-2013, 06:40 PM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

Beware of the BMW diesels. They are nice rides but I think they're in the shop often. At least mine is. It's all covered and nothing of significance but annoying even if you get nice loaners.
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Old 04-08-2013, 08:04 PM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

I think those expecting Hemi-like levels of performance out of the CRD will be very disappointed. I'd expect it to be right smack in the middle of the V6 and V8 in terms of performance.
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Old 04-08-2013, 08:13 PM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

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Originally Posted by FAUEE View Post
I think those expecting Hemi-like levels of performance out of the CRD will be very disappointed. I'd expect it to be right smack in the middle of the V6 and V8 in terms of performance.
I agree. My 335d has more HP and torque (265 HP and 425 ft lbs) than the CRD will. The hemi drives very differently. It definitely has more grunt. But I don't think a gasser engine feels the same in any way, particularly a v6.
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Old 04-08-2013, 10:56 PM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

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Originally Posted by ClarkKent View Post
Helpful comparison, thanks Temerarius. I spent yesterday evening driving a couple rigs too, but just mere test drives. I took the GC V6 and the V8 for a spin, as well as an X5 35d. The V6 was impressively more spry than the 2013 version I drove 6 months ago (presumably because of the 8 speed) so that was a pleasant surprise. The hemi clearly wasn't lacking for power, but I probably don't NEED that type of power in my ride.

I was almost settled on the V6 (to not wait for the CRD) until I went and drove the X5 diesel. The X5 was quite a bit louder (due to the diesel) but the power was NICE! I think the specs shake out pretty similar (265 hp, 425 lb ft) and the X5 would accelerate just as well as the Hemi GC. My brother's trying to convince me to just go with the X5 (MUCH better handling and comfort on the inside - you can drive it like a sports sedan, as you'd expect from BMW). I'm not sure I want to go that route (would probably mean buying used, and I wanted something different since my last car was a BMW) but it's hard to think of many factual reasons against the X5. All of my counter arguments are emotional (the Jeep seems more "rugged", I don't want to buy used, etc.)

The one thing the X5 test drive definitely assured me of, though, is that I want the diesel. Whether it's an Italian diesel (in an American car) or a German diesel is still TBD, but I don't think I'll be springing for the V6 as quickly.
You can drive the GC Hemi w/ Air Suspension like a sports sedan too. I do. And it's not rough riding like those German SUVs.
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Old 04-08-2013, 11:08 PM
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Re: GC Diesel vs. V6 vs. V8 vs. Touareg TDI

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Originally Posted by FAUEE View Post
I think those expecting Hemi-like levels of performance out of the CRD will be very disappointed. I'd expect it to be right smack in the middle of the V6 and V8 in terms of performance.
And you would know this how? That's what I thought.
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