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  #13  
Old 12-09-2011, 11:57 AM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

After 5000 miles I have found out how to actually drive my V6. If I want to accelerate I put at least 50% on the gas all at once so it drops gears. If I am just driving I keep it below that and it stays in gear which I like. It takes a more aggressive foot than any other vehicle I have driven but it doesn't bother me anymore. You just have to be kind of rough with her but that's how she likes it
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  #14  
Old 12-09-2011, 03:09 PM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

I agree. You have to learn how to work the throttle.
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Old 12-16-2011, 03:54 PM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

I agree that you can learn and compensate for the poor programming-- to some degree. I've been a lot more aware of things lately, so now it's not just the general "this sucks", but more specific criticism:

The one thing that is entirely reproducible is a surge during a downshift from 4th gear. You can reproduce by slowly coasting down to 35mph with a super light throttle, so your revs should be at 1250. Give it some gas. It will delay for a sec or two, then surge up to 2500, then drop immediately down to around 1800. Even my wife notices it, and she hates it. It almost sounds like the neutral condition described here:
http://www.wk2jeeps.com/tsb/tsb_wk2_1801211a.pdf

.. But I've already had that update applied, supposedly. Milious said I've had:

April 1, 2011 45495 - WESTGATE CHRYSLER JEEP DODGE
181906J7 - Module, Powertrain Control (PC
096575 832 Miles 2011041 WARRANTY

.. which is when I brought that TSB into the dealer. So I got the PCM update, but I didn't get the TCM update because my car was built after it in January 2011. Anyway, I'm wondering if everything was applied correctly and if I maybe should insist something be reapplied. I'm fairly polite, so I completely dread having to go in person and question whether people have done their jobs correctly.

BTW, the instructions I gave are an easy way to reliably reproduce, but this nasty downshift manifests itself a lot of other times. Most often after turning or pretty much any time I'm feeling like the pig is slow ... and this only pisses me off more.

And I stopped using Sport mode. There was no way to force an upshift in a lot of situations, and chugging around at 2200 RPM was almost more annoying. One way to overcome it though is to set cruise control. Once set it seems to use a different program that will give you an upshift. You can cancel immediately or keep it going since if you're forcing an upshift, you probably aren't accelerating anymore (and I have adaptive cruise). I know it sounds like a PITA, and it was, which is why I'm back here bitching about the main transmission program.
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Old 12-16-2011, 06:46 PM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

CJ, when you say surge are you describing slipping? I think the trans is briefly in 2nd. I've tried manually downshifting under the situation you describe and not all that much happens in third. I think it needs to get to second to get moving.
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Old 12-17-2011, 07:29 PM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

Maybe more power would help the problem?

By this weekend i should have feedback about Pentastar TB porting. Might make the throttle response better.
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Old 12-17-2011, 09:30 PM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

Quote:
CJ, when you say surge are you describing slipping? I think the trans is briefly in 2nd. I've tried manually downshifting under the situation you describe and not all that much happens in third. I think it needs to get to second to get moving.
Yes, it sounds like it goes down to 2nd, but then immediately back to 3rd where I want it. I'm not looking for huge acceleration, just to maintain speed. I'm usually just in a hilly area where I've been coasting down and incline then need to go up an incline where 4th gear @40mph won't quite cut it. But 3rd gear would. And it seems impossible to get the transmission to downshift to 3rd without the brief time in 2nd, which like I said, _really_ annoys me! I used the "autostick" today to drop down to 3rd and it worked as I'd like it, but then I have to tap it twice to the right to get it out of that special mode.

I feel like I'm nitpicky at times, but then other times I can't imagine how transmission programming this awful was ever released to the public.

So, you've had the drivability TSB applied and you experience the same behavior?
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Old 12-17-2011, 10:33 PM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

The WK's shift quickly out of 2nd the exact same way. It's not nitpicking when you paid ~$33,000
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Old 12-18-2011, 08:21 AM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

CJ, yes, the exact same behavior. I rented the GC in Florida almost a year ago and loved it. Of course, it's flat as a pancake down there. The pre-TSB upshift was noted. When the TSB came out I thought I was golden. I live in a hilly area and the test drive was fine but the scenario you describe wasn't something I encountered. I went up hills after making a 90 degree turn so the slow witted trans had enough time to figure out what was going on at the lower speed it reacted correctly with a downshift to 2nd.

I suspect the problem may have more to do with the incredibly frustrating refusal to downshift quickly. By the time the trans realizes I want to downshift my right foot is approaching the floor. By then it interprets this as a request for major thrust. The downshift to third should come as soon as some right foot pressure is applied like every other car I've owned. Here's where the fuel economy thinking totally screws up the experience by attempting to use torque to conquer the hill. Hey Jeep, it doesn't work!

I'm also very unhappy with my $40K plus purchase and don't consider this 'normal behavior' in any way acceptable. I've already decided to get rid of this GC. If the new GC drivetrains come out soon I'll look but I'm losing patience rapidly and may say good bye to Jeep before they get a chance to keep me in the family.
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Old 12-18-2011, 11:36 AM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

I'm guessing the "Autostick" section here is wrong? :
http://www.wk2jeeps.com/wk2_transm.htm

Is there any way to get true autostick behavior on this car?


FlyinRyan, nothing short of a reprogram or ability to manually select gears (paddle shifters or at least autostick) will make me happy. Bring a product to market for that and you'll have a buyer.
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Old 12-18-2011, 11:52 AM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

He can do even better if the PCM and TCM can be programmed.
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Old 12-18-2011, 12:12 PM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazyJ View Post
I'm guessing the "Autostick" section here is wrong? :
http://www.wk2jeeps.com/wk2_transm.htm

Is there any way to get true autostick behavior on this car?


FlyinRyan, nothing short of a reprogram or ability to manually select gears (paddle shifters or at least autostick) will make me happy. Bring a product to market for that and you'll have a buyer.
Well, if i read into all this correctly, this condition sounds like it is multi-causal. The quirky programming, combined with the slow throttle response and even the marginal low end power the Pentastar provides.

If throttle response or lack of is part of the issue, i CAN help with that. Increased throttle response will take some of the laziness out of the downshifts too.

I am hoping that Diablo can crack the PCM/TCM soon. I am hearing some rumors but its all speculation until it happens.
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Old 12-18-2011, 12:27 PM
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Re: I hate my truck sometimes-- disorganized rant

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyinRyan View Post
Well, if i read into all this correctly, this condition sounds like it is multi-causal. The quirky programming, combined with the slow throttle response and even the marginal low end power the Pentastar provides.

If throttle response or lack of is part of the issue, i CAN help with that. Increased throttle response will take some of the laziness out of the downshifts too.

I am hoping that Diablo can crack the PCM/TCM soon. I am hearing some rumors but its all speculation until it happens.
What about the "Gear Limit Request" that can be sent over CANBUS:
http://www.sequentialtaillights.com/dodge/TCM-NAG1.htm

Does that sound possible? Purely speculation, but suppose the current shifter sends a gear request like 1-1, 1-2, 1-3, 1-4 if the ERS is used. What about paddles that send a 1-1, 2-2, 3-3, 4-4, or 5-5?
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