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  #37  
Old 12-09-2013, 05:56 PM
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Re: making the 14 v-6 a little faster

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Originally Posted by MSCA View Post
Or better yet, grow up and don't street race at all.
Thanks Gramma.
[Obviously not a Pasadena resident]
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  #38  
Old 12-10-2013, 07:41 AM
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Re: making the 14 v-6 a little faster

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Originally Posted by lstowell View Post
You can deal with the bolt ons that lean you out by bumping injector size a bit--presuming the fuel management cannot handle it with your stock injectors.

As long as you keep the A/F reasonable, flowing more air pretty much equals more power since you would also be flowing more fuel. Counter-intuitively, a good exhaust and air flow can increase fuel efficiency.
Actually, the more air you flow, the richer you want the mixture. The more air you flow, the more you have to cool it because the faster you move it, more heat it will have. It is not a matter of just keeping it reasonable. Sometimes, upgrading hardware elicits more upgrades without having a performance increase.

For example, the stock Subaru Legacy GT came with an IHI-VF-40 turbo and a stock psi of 14.7 and an AFR of 12. It also had stock injectors of 400 cc/min and a fuel pump of 140 L/min. And a small intercooler. With tuning, you could push the car to about 17-18 psi and you maxed out the hardware. On stock equipment but several levels of tuning deep plus exhaust, I made 250 whp / 250 lb-ft and a nice curves on the dyno graph - a nice whopping torque curve that stays essentially flat between 3000 and 7000 (tapers off a little towards the end).

With a bolt-on upgrade to a TD-04-16-G turbo (a slightly larger, yet quicker spooling turbo that offers more air flow across the entire RPM range), you can get to about 16-17 psi before having to upgrade injectors and fuel pump. So technically, you can push more air, but make less power because you are boosting less than before. The turbo in itself is capable of up to 22-23 psi but it is imperative that you get 650-850 cc/min injectors, a Walbro (or equivalent) fuel pump of 255 L/min; a larger intercooler, an electronic boost controller and so on... AFR's are now 10:1 and people start shaking when they see 10.5...I've had my share of problems with injectors and count them 4 fuel pumps so I settled on a de-tuned version, with reliable stock injectors, STI fuel pump and all the other supporting hardware. Five tunes later, 19 psi, 278 whp, 352 wheel lb-ft, AFR 10.1 and 3300 lbs of total weight, it's enough.

Merely pushing more air and watching the AFRs isn't even beginning to describe the challenges of pushing more air, even in a car designed for turbocharging.
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  #39  
Old 12-10-2013, 08:27 AM
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Re: making the 14 v-6 a little faster

There are tuners available for the 2012 and on Wrangler. You get 4 to 5hp more with 87 octane and maybe 8 to 9 with 91 octane. Wow. Lets see along with a CAI and exhaust you arent even getting 10% increase. Best part is the numbers from the manufacturers of these products arent verfied by independent labs so who knows if there are any real increases and butt dyno runs dont count.

So the numbers may or may not be valid and peak numbers are great for advertising copy buts its the area under the curves thats most important.

I have been modifying with vehicles since mid 70's and I just dont believe most aftermarket manufacturers claims.

Anyone know if the Pentastar meets or exceeds its published hp and torque numbers on a dyno. Most automakers engines rarely meet their published specs. BMW, Porsche Range Rover, AMG, Jag, Ferrari, and Corvette are all known to meet or exceed published hp and torque figures for their engines.

One bit of advice if some aftermarket manufacturer wants to use your vehicle to develop a tuner or whatever and wants you to sing a waiver. Dont sign unless you can afford to have the engine or whatever replaced. they arent going to pay for it.
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