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  #73  
Old 07-07-2015, 08:21 PM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

Well I won't say it was a total waste of my time reading the entire thread since apparently there is an apps button > settings to disable the paddles. Not that I want to anyways. I actually like the paddles when I'm feeling peppy. I've never accidentally tapped the paddles while driving and sometimes I actually have my hands around the horn. Each time I do I do it intentionally.

Coming from the 5thgen camaro SS L99 the paddles on the wk2 are far more comfortable in almost every way. Even while turning and switching gears. Idk everyone has their own dislikes I guess.

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  #74  
Old 07-08-2015, 03:26 AM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

Rarely ever use them on the highway but occasionally I do when driving in the mountains. However where they really shine is when driving off road, especially steep downhill stuff, where a Jeep is supposed to be ;-)


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  #75  
Old 07-08-2015, 07:39 AM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

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Originally Posted by ssgunner View Post
Well I won't say it was a total waste of my time reading the entire thread since apparently there is an apps button > settings to disable the paddles.
What models have a setting to turn off the paddle shifters? Neither of mine do.
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  #76  
Old 07-08-2015, 07:56 AM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

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Originally Posted by billt View Post
Not if you are going to damage the transmission in the process. And or put unnecessary stress or load on the engine. The ZF 8-Speed is computerized. Regardless if the transmission is in "Auto" or "Sport Mode", (manual), the computer must "OK the shift". It does this in milliseconds. If the computer deems the shift to be compliant to both the transmission and engines capabilities and operating parameters without damaging either, it will then allow it. If not, it will then reject the shift.

In this regard it is not a fully "manual transmission".... Or was it designed to be.
I don't think anyone ever said it was a fully manual transmission, but having it shut off by itself would take away the opportunity for it to act as close as you'll get to one.

Having said that, regarding "harmful shifts", you could say the same thing about a manual transmission car.

Most manual transmission cars have interlocks to prevent you from shifting into "harmful" gears, like the following:

- Most cars won't let you shift into reverse from a higher gear and most won't let you shift into reverse when doing anything more than gently rolling forward.

- Many won't let you shift into 5th gear from second to prevent accidentally lugging the engine or stalling.

- Most won't let you shift into first gear above a certain speed.

- Some prevent accidentally putting the car into 3rd gear when stopped.

Plus, whether the care is manual or auto, it will not let you exceed the rev limiter. The car will shut down before it allows excessive RPMs to be achieved.

The Jeep essentially does the same thing electronically that manual transmissions due mechanically. The only major differences are, the Jeep will shift down to match speed to prevent stalling (probably on the off chance you forget you're in manual mode) and it will prevent shifting into a gear low enough to spike the rev limiter rather than allow it and stall.

However, I can shift up well before the Jeep normally would do on its own and I can downshift to the point where I will stab the red line, neither of which is normal shifting behavior. The Jeep will prevent something that call stall or damage the vehicle, but beyond that, it's up to me.

Considering this is linked to an automatic transmission, that's good enough for me.

It lets me cruise at the gear I want and lets me downshift manually to engine brake on slippery roads or when entering curves on rural roads.

The bonus is, though, I'm not riding the clutch in a traffic jam. I also don't need to take a hand off the wheel to shift. It's really the best of both worlds.
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  #77  
Old 07-08-2015, 07:57 AM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

I have to wiggle my steering wheel backing out of my garage and driveway, like a stripper does her butt. I never hit the paddles. How are you guys doing this?
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  #78  
Old 07-08-2015, 08:24 AM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

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Originally Posted by billt View Post
I have to wiggle my steering wheel backing out of my garage and driveway, like a stripper does her butt. I never hit the paddles. How are you guys doing this?
My guess, when people are turning their body to look behind them, they grab more of the inner wheel when the angle their hands are at changes.

That causes them to bump the paddles when backing up while turning the wheel sharply - especially when the wheel is orientated 180 degrees from center and the paddle are upside down.

I did do it once without noticing until it didn't shift up from first and also did it one other time when I noticed it immediately. Since then, I pay attention to avoid bumping the paddles.

That's why I say the way to activate/deactivate them should be to tap both paddles, instead of just pressing the + paddle.
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  #79  
Old 07-08-2015, 09:48 AM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

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Originally Posted by billt View Post
I have to wiggle my steering wheel backing out of my garage and driveway, like a stripper does her butt. I never hit the paddles. How are you guys doing this?

X2. Most of the time I forget they're even there. I rarely use them other than occasionally to set up a pass.


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  #80  
Old 07-08-2015, 12:27 PM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

I'm with them^^^ Never once have the paddles gotten in my way while driving or accidentally been hit. I have had mutual cars with paddles and I will say this Jeep of all cars has th best ones in the sense of shift quickness. In other automatics I would never touch the paddles because they sucked, every now and then with my Summit V8 I'm finding myself having a little fun with this thing.
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  #81  
Old 07-08-2015, 12:42 PM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

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Originally Posted by billt View Post
I have to wiggle like a stripper does her butt. I never hit the paddles.
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  #82  
Old 07-09-2015, 12:36 AM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

Quote:
Originally Posted by NetworkTV View Post
I don't think anyone ever said it was a fully manual transmission, but having it shut off by itself would take away the opportunity for it to act as close as you'll get to one.

Having said that, regarding "harmful shifts", you could say the same thing about a manual transmission car.

Most manual transmission cars have interlocks to prevent you from shifting into "harmful" gears, like the following:

- Most cars won't let you shift into reverse from a higher gear and most won't let you shift into reverse when doing anything more than gently rolling forward.

- Many won't let you shift into 5th gear from second to prevent accidentally lugging the engine or stalling.

- Most won't let you shift into first gear above a certain speed.

- Some prevent accidentally putting the car into 3rd gear when stopped.

Plus, whether the care is manual or auto, it will not let you exceed the rev limiter. The car will shut down before it allows excessive RPMs to be achieved.

The Jeep essentially does the same thing electronically that manual transmissions due mechanically. The only major differences are, the Jeep will shift down to match speed to prevent stalling (probably on the off chance you forget you're in manual mode) and it will prevent shifting into a gear low enough to spike the rev limiter rather than allow it and stall.

However, I can shift up well before the Jeep normally would do on its own and I can downshift to the point where I will stab the red line, neither of which is normal shifting behavior. The Jeep will prevent something that call stall or damage the vehicle, but beyond that, it's up to me.

Considering this is linked to an automatic transmission, that's good enough for me.

It lets me cruise at the gear I want and lets me downshift manually to engine brake on slippery roads or when entering curves on rural roads.

The bonus is, though, I'm not riding the clutch in a traffic jam. I also don't need to take a hand off the wheel to shift. It's really the best of both worlds.
What manual transmission car has interlocks that keep you from going into the wrong gear? I don't know of ANY manuals that have interlocks that keep you from downshifting into a gear that could damage the engine. I can guarantee that if you tried hard enough, you could engage reverse when moving forward at speed. It would be ugly and likely damaging, but you could do it. Same with going from 5th to 2th.

Perhaps what you are thinking of is the six speed Tremec T-56 and TR-6060 (used in Corvettes, Vipers, Caddy CTS-V) that had the skip-shift "econo" mode that made you shift from 1st to 4th gear when accelerating gently as a way to increase gas mileage. This had nothing to do with saving the engine or transmission from damage but rather CAFE ratings. These were also often bypassed by owners so they could pick the gear they wanted. I think the Corvettes even had a picture in the owner's manual showing the wire controlling the solenoid with a captioned to not disconnect that wire or the skip-shift function would not operate.
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  #83  
Old 07-09-2015, 11:45 AM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

When I want manual the Crossfire is taken (or the other less policially correct toy). In the Jeep I want automagic. Have used the "manual" mode on windy NC roads or rarely for a merge lane for instant power out of a tight on-ramp turn but usually just one less thing to worry about.

That said, flappy paddles might be good for an autocross but only if they did not turn with the wheel.
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  #84  
Old 07-09-2015, 12:15 PM
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Re: Paddle Shifters - Hate 'em

Quote:
Originally Posted by Qmulus View Post
What manual transmission car has interlocks that keep you from going into the wrong gear? I don't know of ANY manuals that have interlocks that keep you from downshifting into a gear that could damage the engine. I can guarantee that if you tried hard enough, you could engage reverse when moving forward at speed. It would be ugly and likely damaging, but you could do it. Same with going from 5th to 2th.

Perhaps what you are thinking of is the six speed Tremec T-56 and TR-6060 (used in Corvettes, Vipers, Caddy CTS-V) that had the skip-shift "econo" mode that made you shift from 1st to 4th gear when accelerating gently as a way to increase gas mileage. This had nothing to do with saving the engine or transmission from damage but rather CAFE ratings. These were also often bypassed by owners so they could pick the gear they wanted. I think the Corvettes even had a picture in the owner's manual showing the wire controlling the solenoid with a captioned to not disconnect that wire or the skip-shift function would not operate.
I'm not thinking of any of those examples you cited.

Every manual transmission vehicle I have driven since the 90's has some or all of those protections. None of them let you go from 3rd to reverse to ensure you don't hit it on your way to 4th. Most won't engage reverse while going forward above a certain speed. Some have a physical block that stops the shifter from going there when the transmission is spinning forward. Others will grind, but not engage.

None of those vehicles I have driven will let you jam it into first above a certain speed. Some of them prevent going into 5th gear directly from 2nd.

Going from 5th to 2nd, as you mentioned, is possible because it's not a shift you would likely make accidentally. Going to first above a certain speed is almost always locked out to prevent you from starting to slow down to, say, stop at a light, popping it into first in the process, then needing to start off again at 20 or 30 MPH when the light changes to green.

The mechanical systems can vary from a plate that effectively blocks the gear to a spring loaded mechanism that engages at speed. MY older VWs had a little oval plate that prevented engaging reverse while moving forward.

Obviously, some of those overrides can be defeated by putting it into neutral for a moment to release the interlock, but it's really hard to overcome the reverse lockout on most manual cars. Even those that let you grind the gears would require a gorilla to actually jam it into gear do the lack of a syncro on reverse.
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