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  #61  
Old 10-26-2014, 09:35 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by devilsadvocate View Post
Diesel 0-60 is 7.8 seconds. That is pretty mediocre. Especially when you consider that the regular V6 is 7.5.

2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee EcoDiesel First Test - Motor Trend

Hemi is 6.5 seconds. That is solid for a large SUV.

2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Hemi V-8 Test – Review – Car and Driver

Both can be improved with tuners, after market parts, etc. I don't want to get into that conversation. Those of us that go the MaxCare lifetime warranty route won't touch any of that. Yes, I get there are more stats than the 0-60, but I think it gives the info we need and care about here.
The 8 speed on the 3.6 seems to have helped improve the acceleration times for sure, but these numbers are very misleading. Put the car in a real life situation with some passengers in the car, or driving up an incline, or acceleration from low speed where the revs are up a bit higher and you can call on the turbo, and things are very different to the numbers on paper. I have a favourite windy, up road section that the diesel flies through, because the torque moves the heavy car so well through the corners and up the hill. It's the torque delivery that gets some diesel owners, as opposed to the more lazy delivery of a v8. Thats not to say the v8 is bad, just different.

As someone else has suggested it seems diesels have a reputation problem in the states, and that is why they aren't popular, while other countries through europe and australia/NZ, etc have adopted diesel as a preferred choice.

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  #62  
Old 10-26-2014, 10:47 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by Benn0 View Post
The 8 speed on the 3.6 seems to have helped improve the acceleration times for sure, but these numbers are very misleading. Put the car in a real life situation with some passengers in the car, or driving up an incline, or acceleration from low speed where the revs are up a bit higher and you can call on the turbo, and things are very different to the numbers on paper. I have a favourite windy, up road section that the diesel flies through, because the torque moves the heavy car so well through the corners and up the hill. It's the torque delivery that gets some diesel owners, as opposed to the more lazy delivery of a v8. Thats not to say the v8 is bad, just different.
The typical published 0-60 tests are said to be from dead stop or 1 foot rollout and turbo lag adds a second to the results. Launching with the turbo spooled puts mine in the 6.8-6.9 range. The 0-30 is REALLY strong. The turbo diesel has a fairly flat 420 ft-lbs of torque from 1800 to 4000 rpm...not a "peak" only achieved at higher revs. That's great for everyday driving....not revved out like a racer. Its not "better", just different and very desirable once you get used to it. The downside is turbo lag from a dead stop but that's any turbo. Once you are moving, the low end grunt at typical traffic speeds is amazing. I test drove the Hemi several times and it has punch but it's after a huge downshift and rpm soaring towards redline...awesome feel but not something I would do daily. I do regularly use the grunt of my diesel to effortlessly pull away from traffic. Its working hard but just doesn't sound like it. Its all in what you are used to.
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  #63  
Old 10-27-2014, 04:42 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by ExcursionDiesel View Post
I test drove the Hemi several times and it has punch but it's after a huge downshift and rpm soaring towards redline...awesome feel but not something I would do daily. I do regularly use the grunt of my diesel to effortlessly pull away from traffic.
This. For normal day to day driving the diesel is in it's comfort zone in which you "use" its power constantly. The vast majority of V6/V8 users are only using a fraction of the available power in the day to day driving RPM range. Gasser's make all their power up high RPM, which typically isn't used all that much of the time.

That's why simple 0-60 charts don't tell the whole picture. The way it delivers it and the usability of the powerband is just as important.
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  #64  
Old 10-27-2014, 05:09 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by Zybane View Post
That's crazy such a low take rate for the diesel. A heavy off-road capable SUV is the perfect candidate for a diesel. American's are just too stupid to realize the huge benefit of diesel.
Wonder what the take rate trajectory is for the diesel?
I was quite interested in one, but availability a year ago could best be described in very round numbers. A single round number.

In objective terms, the repayment rate of diesel over hemi is quite a bit, since diesel is more expensive than midgrade so the better mileage takes a bit.

Better torque, "adequate" horsepower.
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  #65  
Old 10-27-2014, 05:11 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by Zybane View Post
Wow, some really clueless people posting about diesel's in this thread.
Yeah, I'd certainly have to agree with that single sentence.
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  #66  
Old 10-27-2014, 05:16 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by lstowell View Post

In objective terms, the repayment rate of diesel over hemi is quite a bit, since diesel is more expensive than midgrade so the better mileage takes a bit.

Better torque, "adequate" horsepower.
Comes back down to the "payback" not being the only variable. People that buy that V8 over the V6 have no payback and will forever be paying more upfront and more in fuel.

They pay the extra on both ends because of the V8's engine dynamics. The same thing applies to the diesel..

"Payback" was the least of my concerns when choosing the diesel engine.
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  #67  
Old 10-27-2014, 05:16 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by Hutch801 View Post
I love my diesel it is such a relaxed drive with so much grunt off the mark and if you want to go hard it still doesn't hurt the hip pocket.
ps I am in oz so fuel cost aside the diesel makes a heap of sense.
How much is the difference, and which is cheaper down under?

Diesel used to be cheaper in the USofA, but then some politics got involved.
Currently it is more expensive than premium, but some oil companies have noted this is as much of an artifact of tuning refineries to produce more gasoline for the orders of magnitude larger market compared to diesel.

Politics does the rest, where a bit of encouragement in pricing could possibly help the uptake rate now that modern diesels exist, although direct injection ultra high compression gasoline engines can compete reasonably well with diesel for power/torque even if the bulk energy content of diesel is still higher.

I don't even recall a decent diesel/electric hybrid in the USofA except those that run on railroad tracks.
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  #68  
Old 10-27-2014, 05:21 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by iboughtajeep View Post
Checked some prices and diesel is the same price as 95pulp in Brisbane.
Thanx

And since you don't have highways 10-14K feet above sea level, I can see the attraction of diesels. Here, I still see gas stations with only one diesel pump in an entire row of pumps. That's actually an improvement lately to actually have at least one diesel pump per row.
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  #69  
Old 10-27-2014, 05:23 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by nicjak View Post
Who buys a v8 to drive like an old grandpa?
Well, that would be me, being an old grandpa. I ain't from Pasadena, but if you think yer damn diesel can stay with me over Loveland Pass, I'd be glad to school ya on hemi's anyday.
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  #70  
Old 10-27-2014, 05:45 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by lstowell View Post
Well, that would be me, being an old grandpa. I ain't from Pasadena, but if you think yer damn diesel can stay with me over Loveland Pass, I'd be glad to school ya on hemi's anyday.
I bet a "chipped" diesel would give you a run for your money (and use half the fuel while doing it ), forced induction engines aren't as affected by high altitudes as much as naturally aspirated.
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Old 10-27-2014, 06:15 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by Zybane View Post
I bet a "chipped" diesel would give you a run for your money (and use half the fuel while doing it ), forced induction engines aren't as affected by high altitudes as much as naturally aspirated.
Seems like an unreasonable comparison. Wouldn't you need to compare a modded hemi to a modded diesel? Hemi has a ton of room for improvement. In fact, if you're REALLY ambitious you can even add a supercharger.
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  #72  
Old 10-27-2014, 08:16 PM
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Re: Sales - v6 vs hemi vs diesel?

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Originally Posted by devilsadvocate View Post
Seems like an unreasonable comparison. Wouldn't you need to compare a modded hemi to a modded diesel? Hemi has a ton of room for improvement. In fact, if you're REALLY ambitious you can even add a supercharger.
$6000 supercharger kit versus $300 chip that takes 30 seconds to remove. I think for most people that can afford a $50K SUV, a $300 chip for dramatic performance increase is a pretty easy sell.
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