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  #13  
Old 06-10-2015, 04:14 PM
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Re: Should General Motors Rescue Fiat a Second Time?

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Originally Posted by ssgunner View Post
Good to know Jeep is the golden goose of FCA. I don't think it would be a good idea of GM or Ford buying Jeep or RAM only cause i'm affraid of what they'll do to the brand to expand GM or ford trucks, SUV's.

With that history of fiat and GM i'd say GM should let fiat tank. GM should focus on bringing back pontiac and focus on giving the Camaro their evil twin (Trans Am/Firebird).
Fiat did upgrade the interiors of the GC.
Their problem is that prior management let Alfa and Maserati wither on the vine pretty much completely, ended all of the larger Fiats [which were nice little pocket rockets competitive with VW on the Autostrada], and seems to have forgotten they have a truck division. And is uncoupling from their other money maker, Ferrari.

The European 2 litre Fiats were nice sports coupes, and the Alfa sports coupes were really nice--until they were allowed to just die. We won't even mention the Citroen/Maserati mutant or the final models of Maserati sold in the USofA--that were so bad even K-Cars made fun of them.

The Mopar engines will likely all need to be scrapped real soon now for CAFE, and there aren't any obvious replacements with direct injection, etc. in the works to bump mileage without being outrun by turtles.

Maybe Elon Musk?

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Old 06-10-2015, 04:18 PM
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Re: Should General Motors Rescue Fiat a Second Time?

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Originally Posted by lstowell View Post
Rattan Tata?
Didn't they take on Land Rover and Jaguar? Can't have Jeep there too...

I agree with other posters in that as a potential flagship brand, Jeep would only languish under another automotive umbrella - GM is NOT going to kill GMC and hype Jeep/Ram.

Now Google, on the other hand, could really use a better platform for their autonomous vehicle, as their tiny bubble-car won't likely win over the masses. I figure Google will buy Tesla soon (Iron Man, I mean Elon Musk, will HAVE to choose between his two babies, and he will choose SpaceX), and I suppose Jeep/Ram could make a strong complement to that portfolio...
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  #15  
Old 06-10-2015, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by GCLimited View Post
No, GM should not save FCA. Fiat bought Chrysler for a song, and STILL couldn't turn things around.

I say let Fiat/Chrysler rot on the vine, and hope some investment firm buys up Jeep.

I just got a taste of what Fiat has to offer Jeep in future models...I was given a 2015 Renegade as a loaner when I dropped off my 2014 Grand Cherokee yet again for service...what a POS the Renegade is. And I thought my Grand Cherokee had a rough shifting transmission...Jeez ! Only 945 miles on it, and the Renegade isn't even a good rental!
Fiat is not rotting in the vine or even in trouble. This is a merger where fca is actually in better shape than GM. Look at both stocks for instance. Look at FCA sales as well....breaking records every month. Look at fca in europe vs. Gm in europe. This is a strategic move.
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  #16  
Old 06-11-2015, 01:04 AM
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Re: Should General Motors Rescue Fiat a Second Time?

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Originally Posted by GCLimited View Post
I just got a taste of what Fiat has to offer Jeep in future models...I was given a 2015 Renegade as a loaner when I dropped off my 2014 Grand Cherokee yet again for service...what a POS the Renegade is. And I thought my Grand Cherokee had a rough shifting transmission...Jeez ! Only 945 miles on it, and the Renegade isn't even a good rental!
The transmission has a few issues, I guess. I was reading somewhere the other day where the froze all Renegade shipments for a while so they could update transmission software.

However, the Renegade has been getting a lot of good initial reviews for other things, even by Consumer Reports. I've seen it praised more than once for having a very nice interior for its segment.
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  #17  
Old 06-11-2015, 07:32 AM
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Should General Motors Rescue Fiat a Second Time?

Please remember, the JGC is all still based around German Engineering, at least until the new model JGC is released. The development start for a totally refreshed model is typically 5-7 years out. All the stuff we see on our current JGC is not Fiat infused. Just look at the Cherokee and Renegade, then you see Fiat design.

I wouldn't want Government Motors to take over Jeep....that's a no no.

Maybe Tesla will consider.... 😜

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  #18  
Old 06-11-2015, 07:51 AM
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Re: Should General Motors Rescue Fiat a Second Time?

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Originally Posted by SouthDakota View Post
The transmission has a few issues, I guess. I was reading somewhere the other day where the froze all Renegade shipments for a while so they could update transmission software.
They did the same thing when the Cherokee was coming out.

They can't get shit right when it's new. Or even 4 years old. Can't wait... Hopefully the next GC doesn't fall flat on its face. They'll probably butcher it. It's selling so well right now they probably don't know what to do with themselves..
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  #19  
Old 06-11-2015, 07:58 AM
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Re: Should General Motors Rescue Fiat a Second Time?

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Originally Posted by SouthDakota View Post

However, the Renegade has been getting a lot of good initial reviews for other things, even by Consumer Reports. I've seen it praised more than once for having a very nice interior for its segment.
I had that Renegade all day yesterday...drove it on back streets & the highway. The vehicle was noisy, it rode like shit, and the brakes were weak sauce...nothing like the Grand Cherokee.

I once received a new Chrysler 200 for a loaner as well, and I wasn't impressed with that vehicle either. Seats were WAY too soft & unsupportive, rear visibility through the distorted glass was terrible, and the torque steer was bad.

The Grand Cherokee is definitely the best Chrysler/Jeep has to offer (thanks to Daimler), too bad the V6 transmission sucks donkey a$$.
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  #20  
Old 06-11-2015, 11:20 PM
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Re: Should General Motors Rescue Fiat a Second Time?

Man you guys sure give Fiat a lot of credit for Cerberus' work...

BTW: The JGC isn't on a Daimler platform... the ML and GC were Co-Developed and is mostly Jeep.
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Old 06-11-2015, 11:26 PM
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Re: Should General Motors Rescue Fiat a Second Time?

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Originally Posted by Marlon_JB2 View Post
Man you guys sure give Fiat a lot of credit for Cerberus' work...

BTW: The JGC isn't on a Daimler platform... the ML and GC were Co-Developed and is mostly Jeep.

But it still isn't a Fiat development, not yet.


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Old 06-11-2015, 11:31 PM
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Re: Should General Motors Rescue Fiat a Second Time?

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Originally Posted by BlckWK2 View Post
But it still isn't a Fiat development, not yet.


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Gonna be a minute. If it ever happens, considering Marchionne's statements as of late.
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Old 06-13-2015, 11:51 PM
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Re: Should General Motors Rescue Fiat a Second Time?

I recently read that GM sales in China are down, then read that FCA could try to take-over GM.


The next administration, if a good Republican, would be crazy not to modify or scrap CAFE. For most people, a 50% improvement in fuel mileage results in minor dollar savings.


Bigger is not better, and that seems to be what this character now running FCA thinks. First, I doubt much could be saved on parts, as both companies are large enough to already be achieving whatever volume efficiencies are available. Even if money could be saved on parts, the many inefficiencies of a larger company would more than consume those savings. Therefore, what he needs to do is spin Chrysler and Ferrari off, then let the rest die.
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Old 06-14-2015, 12:40 AM
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Re: Should General Motors Rescue Fiat a Second Time?

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Originally Posted by FStephenMasek View Post
The next administration, if a good Republican, would be crazy not to modify or scrap CAFE. For most people, a 50% improvement in fuel mileage results in minor dollar savings.

Therefore, what he needs to do is spin Chrysler and Ferrari off, then let the rest die.
1.) CAFE was never about saving people money. It is about breaking our dependence on foreign-derived fossil fuels. Car guys like Jay Leno get it. Elon Musk gets it. George Bush got it. The leaders at Fiat should get it -- but don't.

2.) Chrysler? Why would they keep Chrysler -- of all the divisions -- alive. It has only 3 models -- and it is one of the weakest performers in the industry. Jeep and RAM are the money makers for FCA and are really the only thing a suitor would probably be interested in.
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