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  #13  
Old 05-02-2012, 04:01 PM
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Re: Should I buy another WK2?

Early model years builds of any vehicle can be a problem. I worked for a major equipment manufacturer and we learned from building our own products to NEVER to buy an early build of any new product . I would bet if you charted the number of TSBs over time that they peak early and drop off as the build cycle moves over several years.
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Old 05-02-2012, 04:04 PM
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Re: Should I buy another WK2?

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Originally Posted by MikeD View Post
I ordered a 2012 Raptor SuperCrew back in November and picked it up on 2/15/12, still have the M3 for the wife.
Nice! Can't argue with the Raptor, or the wife's M3 for that matter.
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Old 05-02-2012, 05:00 PM
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Old 05-02-2012, 05:13 PM
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Re: Should I buy another WK2?

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Originally Posted by MikeD View Post
I ordered a 2012 Raptor SuperCrew back in November and picked it up on 2/15/12, still have the M3 for the wife.
How does the build quality seem to be on that Raptor compared to the Overland?
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Old 05-02-2012, 05:40 PM
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Re: Should I buy another WK2?

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Originally Posted by bromhead View Post
So, net net, (sorry I am going on), even if I received another new vehicle, I am not sure that would allay any fears. While my problems are related to the vehicle, I think the majority of my dissatisfaction was with Service. While many of the problems are easy to rationalize, I am left with the distinct impression that QL is not ready for prime time, or at least their support network isn't ready to support this option.

Any opinions, shared observations?
First of all, I feel bad for you and it will not help for me to say that you are not the first nor the last whom has and will experience the same thing but s**t happens...in every manufacturer's customer base. Having been in the auto business a number of years ago it surprises me today with abundant and affordable information technology that the service networks of every manufacturer are still abysmal when it comes to service parts supply. It is an absolute joke the way GM does it, and I am quite certain Ford and Chrysler operate on the same model as do GM, Mercedes, Audi, BMW, yada yada. Even Hyundai has service problems and they are a huge multi-level corporation with a tremendous cash reserve, but alas they are viewed as simply copycats, so.....

One of my customers is in a similar delay like you and is looking at a $7000 out of warranty transmission replacement for his Audi. He has been told that it could be 6-8 weeks before a replacement unit arrives from Europe and then another week plus to complete the repair and paperwork (really). That is no consolation to you, but it happens. A few posts point out, and you alluded to, the WK2 is a great vehicle and a good value, the ever sought after win-win proposition. Regarding the QL, that is one reason I wanted a Laredo or Limited instead of the Overland. The QL and also the ELSD adds to the potential of what "Mr. Murphy" and his laws can throw at us as well.

If you really liked the vehicle, find a dealer with some record of good service and then try another WK2, but this time go with a Limited to remove the QL and ELSD from the equation. One of the benefits of not having the QL is that you can add your own suspension improvements much easier later on if you so choose for serious trail work. However, I would hesitate in believing Chrysler is the only one with service after the sale issues; all the marques could use improvement in that area.
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  #18  
Old 05-02-2012, 06:31 PM
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Re: Should I buy another WK2?

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Originally Posted by jp467 View Post
How does the build quality seem to be on that Raptor compared to the Overland?
Overland had better quality leather and was obviously more luxurious but as for tightness/rattles and panel fitment there is no comparison. My Brother has a 2010 Raptor and has had no dealer visits other than oil changes and he beats the hell out of it. I miss a few things like HID's and the Nav was nicer in my opinion in the Jeep, able to pause Sat radio and was much faster with better voice control. I also get better city mileage in the truck compared to my old Jeep which I was only able to get about 11mpg, and that was driving like a Grandpa. I may look at a diesel Grand in the future but would get a Limited instead as I never cared for the overly soft air suspension.
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Old 05-03-2012, 03:00 PM
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Re: Should I buy another WK2?

I am unsure if the more luxury orientated manufacturers offer better post sale service. Chrysler certainly has been lacking, but perhaps I am kidding myself that others would be better. But its this lack of support (i really do have more details, but an open forum is probably not the best place to share them), is my main concern about going back with a wk2, not the car itself. But, there are 2 things that might influence my next move.
1. I wonder if i would have had more attention and a quicker resolve rate if I was in a loaner vehicle. Suddenly, they have a financial reason to get things fixed quicker. In my case, they took a 2.5 week or so break when absolutely nothing happened.
2. In real estate, i have heard that you never want to have the most expensive home on a street...conversely, i assume having a more modest home on a expensive street is the goal. is that the same here....you spend 50k on a car, and you expect white glove service....just a thought....
3. Can anyone confirm that you have to have QL in order to get ELSD? I don't think there is a mechanical reason for this, it just seems to be the way the configuration groups the packages...
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  #20  
Old 05-03-2012, 03:36 PM
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Re: Should I buy another WK2?

Chrysler bought back our Summit and we then purchased a Limited with everything but the QL. There are two programs, buyback and replacement. They are pretty self explanatory on how they work.

We have had zero problems with the Limited and do not miss the QL and its associated problems. We even like the handling better on the standard suspension. The automatic leveling shocks are simply amazing and worth reading up on if you haven't already. Great feature and not mentioned nearly enough as a selling point.

We bought a 2012 Unlimited Rubi for rough off road excursions so we do not miss the QL. For the money, we looked again at many new vehicles and still bought the Limited as it is a heck of a value and so far has been great. Time will tell.
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Old 05-04-2012, 07:05 PM
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Re: Should I buy another WK2?

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Originally Posted by MikeD View Post
Overland had better quality leather and was obviously more luxurious but as for tightness/rattles and panel fitment there is no comparison. My Brother has a 2010 Raptor and has had no dealer visits other than oil changes and he beats the hell out of it. I miss a few things like HID's and the Nav was nicer in my opinion in the Jeep, able to pause Sat radio and was much faster with better voice control. I also get better city mileage in the truck compared to my old Jeep which I was only able to get about 11mpg, and that was driving like a Grandpa. I may look at a diesel Grand in the future but would get a Limited instead as I never cared for the overly soft air suspension.
The Raptor is nice but not without issues. Lots of bent frames for trucks that were run as advertised.



Credit to MeInSoCal from JF for pic links.
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  #22  
Old 05-05-2012, 11:04 AM
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Re: Should I buy another WK2?

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Originally Posted by xmonger View Post
The Raptor is nice but not without issues. Lots of bent frames for trucks that were run as advertised.



Credit to MeInSoCal from JF for pic links.
I knew this would come up, that was a few people that found the limit of the truck, you can't treat a factory built Raptor like a full on trophy truck and not expect damage. I would like to see any stock F-150, Chevy truck or Dodge Ram hit that bump at 100mph and see what happens. There is a youtube vid of the Raptor engineer stating why that happened and and if the frame didn't bend it could have been a much worse outcome. Like I said my Brother has taken his off road with no issues and I don't plan an doing anything so extreme to where I would damage anything other than a skid plate.
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  #23  
Old 05-05-2012, 01:49 PM
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Re: Should I buy another WK2?

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Originally Posted by MikeD View Post
I knew this would come up, that was a few people that found the limit of the truck, you can't treat a factory built Raptor like a full on trophy truck and not expect damage. I would like to see any stock F-150, Chevy truck or Dodge Ram hit that bump at 100mph and see what happens. There is a youtube vid of the Raptor engineer stating why that happened and and if the frame didn't bend it could have been a much worse outcome. Like I said my Brother has taken his off road with no issues and I don't plan an doing anything so extreme to where I would damage anything other than a skid plate.
Exactly. Ford has long since addressed and put the bent frame non-issue to bed.
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  #24  
Old 05-06-2012, 08:22 AM
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Re: Should I buy another WK2?

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Originally Posted by SMG1 View Post
Exactly. Ford has long since addressed and put the bent frame non-issue to bed.
Yes, if by addressing the issue you mean the frame was designed to bend as a safety feature for owners who took their vehicles off-road and ran them "too hard".



Personally, it wouldn't stop me from getting a Raptor. Most likely, what bends the frame on the Raptor might completely destroy a WK2 ....but FORD marketing gives the impression that you are getting a vehicle that can run at a decent clip off road.

http://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/gallery/photos/raptor/
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