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To hot

17K views 79 replies 20 participants last post by  airjeep 
#1 ·
Was in traffic yesterday, mid-70s & windows open. Saw 215+ F at stoplight. Is too hot but factory does not turn fan on yet.

Anyone know of an aftermarket device that can turn fan on earlier, say 197F. Personally get bothered by temps over 200F.

ps at 215F the guage had not yet reached 1/2.
 
#2 · (Edited)
That is reasonably normal for stopped in traffic, max I've seen is circa 220F, again while stopped motor running. I do not see anything beyond 210F while moving, even with a big tow load and major elevation gains.

Maybe the 180 Tstat guys will chime in here.
 
#3 ·
The aftermarket device is called COLDER THERMOSTAT if you want a mechanical solution. Most thermostats these days are 195, 180 or 160 deg F. Probably the Jeep has a 195 deg F unit.

I have a 160 deg F thermostat on the Subaru and keeps the engine temps around 180 deg. (I have a dedicated gauge for that).

Fan operation can also be controlled at the level of cooling fan relays (which on a Subaru Legacy fail every 2-3 years); thermistor (that detects the temperature and opens the switch) and the ECU himself.

You can also turn on the heat in the cab or engage the AC in the cab - both operations actually open a new pathway for the cooling fluid to go through. One goes to the circuit that will blow hot air in the cab (probably undesirable) and the other method engages the A/C compressor which itself needs to be cooled but as the engine coolant exchanges heat with the A/C juice there will be an overall reduction in your engine coolant temps (at least on Subarus).

But I would not worry about it. Remember, 195 deg thermostats are needed to control emissions.
 
#6 · (Edited)
215F is relatively cool for todays engines, don't worry about it. You may just be a bit paranoid. You could try to put a lower T Thermostat in, but the lower temps will affect how much and when fuel is squirted, so your performance is not going to be optimum. I think your cats will run hotter on the richer mix and will burn out sooner, and there would be no affect on the reliability of other components. So if your goal is long life or reliability, you may be shooting yourself in the foot.

I think your best option is to add auxiliary cooling fans and turn them on in stop-go traffic.
 
#8 ·
Oh I will explain and prove it no worries. Give me about 2 hrs. But if you think that the compressor runs all the time you are wrong. Just like the fridge it cycles as for the refrigerant to not freeze the pipes/clutch. The heat exchange is actually different than how you think
 
#9 ·
Damn owner's manual must have it wrong again. :lol:

"This light warns of an overheated engine condition.
As temperatures rise and the gauge approaches
H,
this indicator will illuminate and a single
chime will sound after reaching a set threshold. Further
overheating will cause the temperature gauge to pass
H,

the indicator will continuously flash and a continuous
chime will occur until the engine is allowed to cool.
If the light turns on while driving, safely pull over and
stop the vehicle. If the A/C system is on, turn it off."
 
#16 · (Edited)
(A-C 101)

Actually, the A-C system removes heat and moisture from the cabin air and the air is returned "cooled".

A little more explanation:

Air conditioners remove heat from indoor air and transfer it outdoors. Cool air is then returned to the cabin. The cycle continues until the indoor air reaches the “set point,” or the desired temperature on your thermostat. Cool refrigerant gas is pumped into the compressor where it is—you guessed it—compressed, which heats the refrigerant. The hot refrigerant gas then passes through the condenser coil, where it is cooled, and changes from a gas to a liquid. This liquid runs through an expansion device, which further cools the gas as it enters the evaporator coil. This cooler gas collects moisture (in the form of water beads on the outside evaporator coil surface) and heat from the air to be cooled. The cooled air is then returned to the cabin and the process repeats until the cabin temperature reaches the desired set point.
The compressor pumps and heats the refrigerant, increasing the temperature and pressure of the gas. The hot gas passes through coils, loses heat and condenses into a liquid. This liquid runs through an expansion valve and evaporates to become cold, low-pressure gas. The cold gas passes through a set of coils that cools the air. A fan blows the cool air into the cabin.
 
#17 · (Edited)
Really don't want to get in the middle of this........ but if you turn the A/C on while sitting in an idling WK2 that has coolant temps at 220*+ the fans will immediately turn on and the coolant temperature will decrease! Thats the way your WK2 works, as designed by the engineers who built it.

If you don't believe me, go out and try it in your driveway. :cool:
 
#18 ·
My apologies to the OP, we sure highjacked your thread.

This is not a reliable test. The ambient temperature will play a big part in the results.

If the A-C condenser is mounted in front of the radiator, the fan will pull "hotter" than ambient temperature air (with A-C on) across the radiator and the engine cooling will be less efficient.
 
#24 · (Edited)
It is to laugh. The factory thermostat is a 195 so what is wrong with wanting to keep it under 200 ? I know the factory does not turn fans on until later but do you think that any company that would come up with a "switch pitch" oil pump might keep the cooling fans off just to save load ?

Personally I have been running computer cars in Florida with 180F thermostats and fans (dual) reprogrammed to come on at 185 for over two decades. Only outside effect I have seen is the a/c cools better and I conssitantly get better MPG than the EPA estimates. Oh and I cannot remember losing a fan belt or radiator hose.

Is another reason: I suspect that heat is a factor in the Pentastar head issue. I do have a lifetime warrenty (says to 2099) so is more of I have just found that running an engine about 10% cooler than the factory settings result in much longer life of everything under the hood (particularly rubber items).

Another factor is that the temperature on a thremostat is just where it begins to open. While a fast thermostat like a Stant Superstat (plug) opens in 3-5 degrees, a typical OEM thermostat takes more like 10-12 degrees to fully open so a 180 will open fully around 192.

OK question one: anyone know of a 180F thermostat for a Pentastar (and the four piece design makes it more difficult than a standard 44mm thermostat) ?

Question two: does anyone know of a seperate device that could attach to the upper radiator hose and turn the fan on when coolant is flowing and stopped at a light or in slow traffic ? (I may just install a toggle switch).

ps running an a/c compressor puts a load on an engine (once saw 10hp for an A6) which makes it generate more heat that must go somewhere. I suspect the main reason the fan comes on with the a/c is that you would not get any cooling at a stop light without. Turning the heater on full add a second small radiator with its own fan so can help an overtemp if not caused by low coolant.
 
#25 ·
It is to laugh. The factory thermostat is a 195 so what is wrong with wanting to keep it under 200 ? I know the factory does not turn fans on until later but do you think that any company that would come up with a "switch pitch" oil pump might keep the cooling fans off just to save load ?

Personally I have been running computer cars in Florida with 180F thermostats and fans (dual) reprogrammed to come on at 185 for over two decades. Only outside effect I have seen is the a/c cools better and I conssitantly get better MPG than the EPA estimates. Oh and I cannot remember losing a fan belt or radiator hose.

Is another reason: I suspect that heat is a factor in the Pentastar head issue. I do have a lifetime warrenty (says to 2099) so is more of I have just found that running an engine about 10% cooler than the factory settings result in much longer life of everything under the hood (particularly rubber items).

Another factor is that the temperature on a thremostat is just where it begins to open. While a fast thermostat like a Stant Superstat (plug) opens in 3-5 degrees, a typical OEM thermostat takes more like 10-12 degrees to fully open so a 180 will open fully around 192.

OK question one: anyone know of a 180F thermostat for a Pentastar (and the four piece design makes it more difficult than a standard 44mm thermostat) ?

Question two: does anyone know of a seperate device that could attach to the upper radiator hose and turn the fan on when coolant is flowing and stopped at a light or in slow traffic ? (I may just install a toggle switch).

ps running an a/c compressor puts a load on an engine (once saw 10hp for an A6) which makes it generate more heat that must go somewhere. I suspect the main reason the fan comes on with the a/c is that you would not get any cooling at a stop light without. Turning the heater on full add a second small radiator with its own fan so can help an overtemp if not caused by low coolant.
Nothing wrong will wanting to run a little cooler, especially in the Florida heat. Your points are valid and lower coolant temps would be beneficial to the long term life of your engine and most everything else under the hood.

Just don't go crazy, your WK2 was designed to operate in a chosen coolant temp range, too cold would be almost as bad as to hot. What you want is the ability to turn on the fans at a lower temp. than their programmed too right now. On my C4 Corvette this can be done with a lower auxillary fan coolant temp. switch. On a WK2 a tuner may be the only way to change these coolant fan temp. settings. I would look into that along with a lower temp thermostat that compliments the new lower fan settings.
 
#27 ·
Thermostats are there, not too keep the engine cool, but to make sure it reaches a predetermined minimum temperature. I doubt that the minimum temperatures aren't just set with the roll of the dice. At least I hope not.

Just sayin'
 
#30 ·
I've been following this thread since its inception. Interesting arguments, and data, although I find a lot of it above my pay grade. But I have to ask, don't you guys trust the engineers who designed the cooling system?
 
#40 · (Edited)
Wait! :confused:

:lol::lol: I'm I the brunette on top or the blond on the bottom? :lol::lol:
You are the Brunette on top, given that her claws are out, like a Raptor. Beware, however, the blonde is taking a photocopy of her own arse, which will momentarily disarm you, and will soon regain top position.

This discussion has suddenly become relevant to my interests. Thanks moosehead. :thumbsup:
My pleasure. Just staying OT ie: too hot.
 
#39 ·
This discussion has suddenly become relevant to my interests. Thanks moosehead. :thumbsup:
 
#43 ·
came across this in the owners manual

IF YOUR ENGINE OVERHEATS

In any of the following situations, you can reduce the
potential for overheating by taking the appropriate action.

• On the highways — slow down.

• In city traffic — while stopped, place the transmission
in NEUTRAL, but do not increase the engine idle
speed.

NOTE: There are steps that you can take to slow down
an impending overheat condition:


• If your air conditioner (A/C) is on, turn it off. The A/C
system adds heat to the engine cooling system and
turning the A/C off can help remove this heat.

• You can also turn the temperature control to maximum
heat, the mode control to floor and the blower control
to high. This allows the heater core to act as a
supplement to the radiator and aids in removing heat
from the engine cooling system.
 
#47 ·
I'll add to this:

CAUTION!
Driving with a hot cooling system could damage
your vehicle. If the temperature gauge reads HOT
(H), pull over and stop the vehicle. Idle the vehicle
with the air conditioner turned off until the pointer
drops back into the normal range.
If the pointer
remains on HOT (H), and you hear continuous
chimes, turn the engine off immediately and call for
service.

Cooling System
To reduce potential for engine and transmission overheating,
take the following actions:
− City Driving
When stopped for short periods of time, shift the transmission
into NEUTRAL and increase engine idle speed.
− Highway Driving
Reduce speed.
Air Conditioning
Turn off temporarily.


 
#44 ·
Surprised nobody has mentioned the Trailer Tow Group IV and it's Heavy Duty Engine Cooling. I'm hoping that makes a difference keeping the engine temp in a good place. The heaviest thing I'll stick in the receiver will be a bike rack and a couple of bikes, but I'm glad for the cooling upgrade.
 
#46 ·
Your mission, if you choose to accept it, is to answer those questions for all of us. Really! I'd love to know!
 
#51 ·
Remember your original post on this topic?

Here it is:

"Really don't want to get in the middle of this........ but if you turn the A/C on while sitting in an idling WK2 that has coolant temps at 220*+ the fans will immediately turn on and the coolant temperature will decrease! Thats the way your WK2 works, as designed by the engineers who built it.

If you don't believe me, go out and try it in your driveway. :cool:"

All I ever said was this is not true because the fan will already be on at 220*+. Your real world test is not possible with a properly functioning cooling system.

I wasn't attacking you or anything like that. It's nothing personal. I simply corrected the misinformation. Isn't that what these forums are all about?

Bottom line: if your WK2 is running hot (220*+), Turn off the A-C. Do not turn on the A-C.
 
#53 · (Edited)
Remember your original post on this topic?

Here it is:

"Really don't want to get in the middle of this........ but if you turn the A/C on while sitting in an idling WK2 that has coolant temps at 220*+ the fans will immediately turn on and the coolant temperature will decrease! Thats the way your WK2 works, as designed by the engineers who built it.

If you don't believe me, go out and try it in your driveway. :cool:"

All I ever said was this is not true because the fan will already be on at 220*+. Your real world test is not possible with a properly functioning cooling system. YES I KNOW WHAT YOU SAID & IT"S WRONG!!!

For the third time in this thread!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! YOUR FANS WILL NOT BE ON UNTIL ABOUT ~ 225*
TRY IT......Enlighten yourself.... STOP THE IGNORANCE!!!!!!!!!!!! EVEN WITH A PROPERLY FUNCTIONING COOLING SYSTEM!!!! TRY IT!! TRY IT!! TRY IT!! GET THE MESSAGE!!

I wasn't attacking you or anything like that. It's nothing personal. I simply corrected the misinformation. Isn't that what these forums are all about?

Bottom line: if your WK2 is running hot (220*+), Turn off the A-C. Do not turn on the A-C.
The misinformation posted in this thread HAS BEEN POSTED BY YOU!!!!!!!!!!
The assumptions on how you think a WK2 cooling system works are incorrect! The temps wouldn't get to 220*+ in an idling WK2 if the fans were already on!! They are not on until the coolant temps reach ~ 225*! By turning on the A/C you're activated the fans manually to immediately start lowering your coolant temps.

Again for the last time, put your butt in your Summit, in your driveway, pop the hood, set your EVIC to coolant temp, do my real world test & tell me who has posted misinformation! Enough already!! :rolleyes:
 
#55 · (Edited)
Try putting your head under the hood of your Summit, instead of banging it against an imaginary wall, and watch your incorrect assumptions go up in smoke like that dope you must be smoking!

What have you got to lose?

Possibly your credibility!! :lol::lol:

It's OK to admit it when your wrong.... we all are sometimes!
 
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