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  #25  
Old 10-30-2016, 08:54 AM
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Re: Towing 20+ foot travel trailer - feedback?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjodotcom View Post
For what it's worth, I discussed this with the service department folks at my local Jeep dealer and they agreed that the 6800 GVWR is what should be the guide when looking at total weight of the vehicle, passengers, cargo and trailer tongue weight and didn't understand why the one reference note said to include tongue weight in the lower tire placard value. They thought perhaps it was to cover against if someone put lower rated tires on the vehicle. They also didn't seem to think I would have any issues at all pulling a roughly 5k trailer with my rig. This guidance is consistent with page 542 of the manual that states total weight must be distributed such that GVWR, GTW, GAWR and Trailer Tongue rating / values are not exceed (no mention of tire placard values).

I actually found a CAT scale about 30min away from my house and took a trip out there. My 2012 V8 Overland with tow package clocked in at 5280lbs with a full gas tank but without me in it so very close to the 5210 online specification. As far as I am concerned, this means my effective total payload capacity (which would include passengers, cargo, and trailer tongue weight) is 1520lbs, meaning even at max tongue weight I would still have 800lbs left over for the hitch, people, cargo, dogs etc provided of course everything is properly distributed. Therefore, my tire placard value can be ignored given this measured information and the load rating of my tires (107). Please let me know if I am missing anything!


I am looking into pulling a trailer as well, but just realized that my tire and loading placard states 1050, not the 1270 I had previously seen in the spec sheets for my diesel Grand Cherokee Limited.

I believe the issue to be the optional 20" tires the dealer had added to this vehicle. These tires have a lower weight rating than the 18" tires that come stock on the Limited. The Summit comes stock with the 20" tires and therefore shows the same limit of 1050.

It's a shame that they allow the tow package and "premium" tire package to be combines together when the tires reduce the effective towing capability by 220 lbs of tongue weight! This is a huge problem for families!

I am now looking into buying new tires for the Grand Cherokee. The load index on the 18" stock tires is 110 while the load index on the 20" stock tires is 107. I do not know how that correlates to the tire placard, but I see that I can buy a new 20" tire with a load index of 111. I that that would be more than sufficient to safely load 1300 lbs of payload.

Does anybody else have thoughts on the tires being the limitation?

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  #26  
Old 10-30-2016, 03:23 PM
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Re: Towing 20+ foot travel trailer - feedback?

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Originally Posted by sfarw View Post
I am looking into pulling a trailer as well, but just realized that my tire and loading placard states 1050, not the 1270 I had previously seen in the spec sheets for my diesel Grand Cherokee Limited.

I believe the issue to be the optional 20" tires the dealer had added to this vehicle. These tires have a lower weight rating than the 18" tires that come stock on the Limited. The Summit comes stock with the 20" tires and therefore shows the same limit of 1050.

It's a shame that they allow the tow package and "premium" tire package to be combines together when the tires reduce the effective towing capability by 220 lbs of tongue weight! This is a huge problem for families!

I am now looking into buying new tires for the Grand Cherokee. The load index on the 18" stock tires is 110 while the load index on the 20" stock tires is 107. I do not know how that correlates to the tire placard, but I see that I can buy a new 20" tire with a load index of 111. I that that would be more than sufficient to safely load 1300 lbs of payload.

Does anybody else have thoughts on the tires being the limitation?
Absolutely correct on all counts. Definitely go with XL tires. Also, over inflate them between 10-15% above the placard when towing. I'd suggest setting up your rig in it's anticipated tow configuration (load and weight distribution) and head for a CAT scale. This is the easiest way to determine where you stand.
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  #27  
Old 11-01-2016, 06:59 PM
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Re: Towing 20+ foot travel trailer - feedback?

Ok, so I think that the 1050 lbs on the tire placard is not something I should care about, and this is why:

Of theee vehicles I checked personally:
2012 Laredo V6 has specs for 1840 but the placard says 1050
2013 Laredo V6 has specs for 1377 but the placard says 1050
2015 Limited EcoDiesel has specs for 1270 but the placard says 1050

The GVWR, curb weight, trims, options, wheel size, tire load limits, and advertised payload all differ. Those advertised pilot specs come from PDF files on wk2jeeps.

I'm gonna stick with 1270 as that's more accurate for the standard GVWR - curb weight rule.

My actual weight at a CAT scale with a full tank, myself, and everyday supplies weighed in at:

Front: 3020
Rear: 2620
Total: 5640

My ratings are:
Front GAWR: 3200
Rear GAWR: 3700
Total GVWR: 6800

That leaves another 1160 pounds for the family, cargo, hitch, and tongue weight.

Also, it was ridiculously easy to weighed in on a CAT scale at a Pilot a little ways up the interstate. 11 bucks.
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  #28  
Old 12-25-2016, 07:50 AM
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I also have a GC Limited with Diesel. Mind if you share your weight for comparison so I can get an idea of how much it weighs without any person in the vehicle? Did you appreciable weight in gear "everyday supplies" in it?

This may sound crazy....but I'm thinking if I go with a bigger trailer I'd take the spare in the trunk and move it to the travel trailer when towing....every litttle pound is starting to add up.
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  #29  
Old 12-26-2016, 09:21 AM
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Re: Towing 20+ foot travel trailer - feedback?

Quote:
Originally Posted by geight View Post
I also have a GC Limited with Diesel. Mind if you share your weight for comparison so I can get an idea of how much it weighs without any person in the vehicle? Did you appreciable weight in gear "everyday supplies" in it?

This may sound crazy....but I'm thinking if I go with a bigger trailer I'd take the spare in the trunk and move it to the travel trailer when towing....every litttle pound is starting to add up.
I was actually standing on the front scale, so my numbers should be:
Front: 2820
Rear: 2620
Total: 5440

The "everyday supplies" would be my heavy work laptop and some reference books, a backpack of emergency supplies, and some recovery gear. I would estimate that to be about 50 lbs total in the cargo area.

I think that moving the tire would not be that crazy of an idea, as I thought about moving my emergency and recovery gear to the trailer.

We looking at a Jayco 23BHM. Its about 5100 unloaded with a GVWR of a 6250.

What size/weight/model trailer are you looking at?
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  #30  
Old 01-07-2017, 06:15 PM
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Re: Towing 20+ foot travel trailer - feedback?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sfarw View Post
I am now looking into buying new tires for the Grand Cherokee. The load index on the 18" stock tires is 110 while the load index on the 20" stock tires is 107. I do not know how that correlates to the tire placard, but I see that I can buy a new 20" tire with a load index of 111.
Which tires are these?
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  #31  
Old 01-07-2017, 07:29 PM
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Re: Towing 20+ foot travel trailer - feedback?

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Originally Posted by Mike H. View Post
Which tires are these?
Pirelli Scorpion Verde All Season Plus

Size: 265/50R20 111V
Load Range: XL

Pirelli Scorpion Verde All Season Plus

They are a best seller on Tire Rack and they have better reviews that the OEM Goodyear Fortera HL. I'm leaning towards getting these when the Forteras wear out. In addition to giving me peace of mind towing the reviews seem to indicate they should perform better in the snow than the slippy Forteras.
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  #32  
Old 01-07-2017, 08:23 PM
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I'm looking at a Nash 25C

Dry Axle Weight (approx. Lbs.):5145
Dry Hitch Weight (approx. Lbs.):555
Net Carrying Capacity:2300
Gross
Gross Dry Weight ? Lbs.:5700
Gross Vehicle Weight (GVWR) ? Lbs.:8000

It's definitely pushing the limits. I'd obviously add the propane, battery which would increase the tongue weigh and maybe add the ~180lbs generator which is at the very rear of the TT to help counteract that and keep the tongue weight under 600.

I wish the manufacturers gave layouts of where the fresh water is relative to the axles so I could do some math and see how screwed I am.

Maybe it's time I move to looking at something smaller.
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  #33  
Old 01-08-2017, 09:03 AM
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Re: Towing 20+ foot travel trailer - feedback?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Huskercory View Post
Pulling a 29’ Forest River Surveyor Select behind my 2014 Hemi Limited. It is an ultralight at only 4300lbs dry weight and uses torsion springs, so it sits a little bit lower to the ground than most campers. I am using an Equal-i-zer hitch setup that does have the solid friction bars on each side.
Overall, love the flexibility of using my Grand Cherokee to pull my camper, but wouldn’t recommend going any bigger or much heavier than my setup – otherwise, get a truck.
I went to the Forest River site, and all the Surveyor's in that length range seem to be over 5000lbs dry. So, I'm probably looking at the wrong trailers. Can you confirm which model you have?
Did you tow in mountainous areas?
How was "descending"?
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  #34  
Old 01-08-2017, 09:08 AM
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Re: Towing 20+ foot travel trailer - feedback?

Quote:
Originally Posted by volvite View Post
I have a 2015 Overland with the Eco Diesel. Love this jeep as it's a towing machine. I've posted in many of the other towing discussions on my experience but here it is again.
Like others have stated, this Jeep is a very capable towing machine. If you have the air suspension you'll want to set up the WDH and sway bars while on level ground with the air suspension disabled. This will help set up you load properly. When the air suspension kicks in it will pick up any little slack that's left. As stated you will want a WDH and sway bar.
I used to own a 2015 Jayco JayFlight 28BHS, 28ft box but 31ft from hitch to bumper. Dry weight of 5500lbs with max weight of 7400lbs.
Which WD hitch were you using?
Did you tow in mountainous areas?
How was "descending"?
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  #35  
Old 04-25-2017, 12:12 PM
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Re: Towing 20+ foot travel trailer - feedback?

I too am looking for feedback on towing. If possible, from other Pentastar V6 owners towing a travel trailer. If we were going to be towing more than occasionally would have gotten the 200 lb heavier Hemi but it's hard to beat the 22MPG average, 26+ MPG hwy we're getting for the 90% of our GC use.


We have a new 2017 Pentastar V6 powered 4X4 Limited GC with the factory Class IV towing package, P3 Brake controller. Yes, our payload rating is also says 1050 though the book says 1270... but for us not an issue.


We're considering either a lance 1685 or 1995 as a TT. Overall length of theses are 21' and 23'8" ball to bumper. Though both are full 8' width I measured the box on both and they both have the same profile of 6'10" height and including the AC makes them almost a perfect 55 sq ft frontal area with an aerodynamic front which should reduce the drag or equivalent frontal load by about 10% and should be well within limits. Both are dual axle trailers which should help with controlling hitch weight and stability.


The UVW for both TT's is just over 4200lbs and fully loaded will be under 5000lbs (about 80% of the rated 6200 lbs of the pentastar 3.6L GC) fully loaded with a hitch weight of about 620 including WDH with sway (12% of Loaded weight). Ball to rear axle for both is within 2X the wheelbase of the GC.


Everything I've read says we're about perfect length for the Lance 1685 and perhaps marginally over the "rule of thumb length" with the Lance 1995.


In 2007 with a 5" shorter wheelbase Jeep recommended a 25'(Class III hitch)-30'(Class IV Hitch) limit for the GC with a shorter wheelbase and many seem to be successfully towing to those limits with a lighter, shorter and narrower tracking GC...The shorter rear overhang axle to hitch probably helps there for all year GC's. And, yes, a hemi would let me exceed the speed rating of most trailer tires but I don't need to go there, I did my speed thing with a twin Cessna in the past. I can also tolerate doing 50-55 going uphill if needed, will just stay in the slow lane.


We run standard size so wife and I total about 300 lbs, it's just the two of us and I doubt we'll have more than 150 lbs of misc. in the vehicle with us as most will be in the trailer so we won't even come close to the GVWR for either the GC or TT.


Having done an overly cerebral study it all looks like it will work but I would really appreciate hearing from others who have gone our way with the 3.6L Pentastar.
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  #36  
Old 04-25-2017, 01:01 PM
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Re: Towing 20+ foot travel trailer - feedback?

We have a Lance 1685 and tow with our JGC Diesel, with almost 20k towing miles so far. You shouldn't have a problem with your V6 Pentastar as we have other owners towing Lances with that motor. Our 1685 weighs in around 4800lbs ready for a trip with food, clothing and supplies. That weight also includes an additional battery (2 batteries) and 10 gallons of fresh water on board plus 6 gallons in the HWH.

Never trust "published" weights, you really need to check the factory sticker on the actual unit itself.

Ours is loaded with every factory option except for the slide out tray in the front storage. The tray actually detracts from the storage space in that compartment.

Our factory weight sticker shows 3900lbs "out the factory door". Have you joined the Lance Owners Group forum yet? We are a mine of information on the trailers, modifications, set-ups etc. etc.

If you need any more info, just PM me...happy to help
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