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  #13  
Old 03-17-2011, 11:18 AM
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Re: Trade-In: "Kelly Blue Book" vs. "Black Book"

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Originally Posted by Dan JGC View Post
berk483 --- I checked out carmax but they basically use the Black Book pricing like my dealership does and I would lose the sales tax savings of about $1K.
Oh well, worth a shot. Good luck with your situation.
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Old 03-17-2011, 11:41 AM
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Re: Trade-In: "Kelly Blue Book" vs. "Black Book"

They completely low ball you because now you are already OK with the "fair" price. Don't be a sucker.
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  #15  
Old 03-17-2011, 11:50 AM
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Re: Trade-In: "Kelly Blue Book" vs. "Black Book"

Regardless what you think about Black Book being for suckers it's what they use and how they make their money, no way to get around that.

You may want to check Autotraders trade in marketplace. https://tradein.autotrader.com/ATPag...rketPlace.aspx

It gives you a firm offer on what your car is worth that participating dealers honor. It will give you the number you can expect but it doesn't factor in the dealer's desire to have your car on the lot. Do a quick search on used cars similar to yours on Autotrader or cars.com and use that as the yardstick. Assume your trade will be at most 85% of that number.
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  #16  
Old 03-17-2011, 11:53 AM
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Re: Trade-In: "Kelly Blue Book" vs. "Black Book"

^^^ Trust me, I haven't tipped my hand yet.
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  #17  
Old 03-17-2011, 01:45 PM
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Re: Trade-In: "Kelly Blue Book" vs. "Black Book"

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Originally Posted by mjw930 View Post
You may want to check Autotraders trade in marketplace. https://tradein.autotrader.com/ATPag...rketPlace.aspx
+1 for the Autotrader tip. Unlike NADA and all the others, Autotrader takes into account market conditions and returns a value usually very close to what most dealerships will offer.

That said, there are several points to consider:

First, what you perceive to be "excellent" may be relative. Minor scratches, worn tires, dirty carpet, small dings in the doors, etc. may seem trite to you, but to restore your car to excellent may cost more than you think.

Also, most manufaturer dealerships (at least in my area) retail used cars below KBB retail and, believe it or not, there is not a "huge profit" in most used cars. Can't speak to your area, but in my area the used car market is every bit as competitive as the new car market. Reputable dealerships cannot afford to rip off customers on the trade or at retail.

Also, there are money factors at play which KBB does not factor in but NADA does. For example, if your car is out of warranty, the loan value the banks are willing to underwrite drops dramatically. If you have a 2007 car valued by KBB at $18K fair and $20K good, at one year out of warrany, there's an excellent chance that the banks will not loan more than $20K on the car. If it retails for $24K the next purchaser will have to put down a very large amount which greatly reduces the market for the car. Therefore the dealership needs to retail the car at a price close to the loan value, so they will likely offer you a trade in price less than the KBB "fair" price.

Finally, some dealerships will offer more for trades and offer less relief on the MSRP of the new car. Others offer greater relief on the MSRP of the new car and less on the trades. The bottom line is - does the total deal work for you? If it does, go for it. If not, go somewhere else. Don't get too hung up on the trade alone or the MSRP alone... they run in tandem. Get hung up on the bottom line.
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Old 03-17-2011, 01:54 PM
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Re: Trade-In: "Kelly Blue Book" vs. "Black Book"

^^^ I agree with a lot of what you wrote ar15nove, but "The bottom line is - does the total deal work for you?" doesn't really apply for me since I did an order with the affiliate pricing so that half is a done deal...the trade-in price is an independent part. Which is the way it should be done.

With respect to excellent, yep it is excellent. No dings, no scratches, no dirty or worn carpet. Maintenance records available, etc. All I want really is the KBB "fair" for the trade-in price....that isn't asking too much now is it?
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Old 03-17-2011, 02:57 PM
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Re: Trade-In: "Kelly Blue Book" vs. "Black Book"

I'd say the odds are 10:1 that ar15nova is a car salesmen (works at a dealership).
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Old 03-17-2011, 03:11 PM
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Re: Trade-In: "Kelly Blue Book" vs. "Black Book"

Pretty much if you do not want auction prices you need to sell it yourself.
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  #21  
Old 03-17-2011, 07:31 PM
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Nobody in the car business uses kbb prices so you're wasting your time even looking at them. Private party values can be estimated by watching prices on autotrader and otherwise nada prices are free online I think. I've also always sold my own cars to maximize value but will trade that if the net sales tax impact is within a grandish. Keep in mind if you're buying the new car below invoice and eating the holdback the store still makes money on the trade and pricing it just above loan value or at auction prices is one way to do that.

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Old 03-17-2011, 07:39 PM
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Re: Trade-In: "Kelly Blue Book" vs. "Black Book"

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Originally Posted by dobiegillis View Post
Nobody in the car business uses kbb prices so you're wasting your time even looking at them. Private party values can be estimated by watching prices on autotrader and otherwise nada prices are free online I think. I've also always sold my own cars to maximize value but will trade that if the net sales tax impact is within a grandish. Keep in mind if you're buying the new car below invoice and eating the holdback the store still makes money on the trade and pricing it just above loan value or at auction prices is one way to do that.

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If that's true that "Nobody" in the car business uses kbb prices, that is new in the last 2-3 years, because 2-3 years ago the local Jeep dealers were sending me fliers offering $1000 above kbb price and when I went into negotitate they would print out and show me kbb prices. These are some of the largest Jeep Grand Cherokee dealers with 50 new Grand Cherokees on one lot and the other dealer with 150 Grand Cherokees on the lot at all times.
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  #23  
Old 03-17-2011, 10:23 PM
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Re: Trade-In: "Kelly Blue Book" vs. "Black Book"

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Courtesy of JoeSchmoe


This says it all, most use KY.
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  #24  
Old 03-18-2011, 06:11 AM
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Re: Trade-In: "Kelly Blue Book" vs. "Black Book"

Around here, many of the dealers use NADA. I've had one dealer tell me as much, and another actually pulled out his little yellow and black NADA book to look up the price the last time I traded-in. He looked up my vehicle (Explorer), actually underlined the row on the page and handed it to me. He stuck to that price; no negotiating on it. I think I had them too low on the new vehicle price, so he wasn't willing.
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