Go Back   Jeep Garage - Jeep Forum > Jeep Platform Discussion > Grand Cherokee - WK2 -

Join Jeep Garage Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
  #37  
Old 02-10-2014, 09:59 PM
thebc2's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2014 3.0L WK2
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 95
Thanks: 4
Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts
Rep Power: 422
thebc2 is on a distinguished road
Re: USA Today - Test Drive: New diesel Cherokee not quite Grand

Quote:
Originally Posted by crabman View Post
Plus he hates the smell of his tractor. lol This is not how you make an objective assessment, its how you try and sell an agenda.
What??? You mean you don't have to put on a gas mask, gloves and ear plugs every time you fire up the diesel JGC? I can't believe I've been doing it wrong this whole time....

I agree with crabman, this thread should be left to die. If you're interested in buying a JGC, go and actually test drive the different engine options you're considering like a rational human being and find the one that suits your needs and wants the best. I find it pretty funny that people who've never even driven a specific engine option seem know all about them. Before I bought the diesel I had already test driven the V6 and V8. I had to wait for the diesel to arrive before I could test drive it. The dealer wouldn't even let me finalize the purchase until I'd test driven the diesel first to ensure I still wanted it.
__________________

__________________
2014 JGC Overland EcoDiesel
Maximum Steel/Black
ORAII
Adv. Tech
Changes: 265/60/18 Goodyear Wrangler AT Adventure w/ Kevlar | Mopar Rock Rails | Weathertechs
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 02-10-2014, 10:07 PM
Member
My Jeep: 2014 3.0L WK2
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Virginia Beach, Va
Posts: 26
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 270
zona75 is on a distinguished road
Re: USA Today - Test Drive: New diesel Cherokee not quite Grand

Quote:
Originally Posted by thebc2 View Post
What??? You mean you don't have to put on a gas mask, gloves and ear plugs every time you fire up the diesel JGC? I can't believe I've been doing it wrong this whole time....

I agree with crabman, this thread should be left to die. If you're interested in buying a JGC, go and actually test drive the different engine options you're considering like a rational human being and find the one that suits your needs and wants the best. I find it pretty funny that people who've never even driven a specific engine option seem know all about them. Before I bought the diesel I had already test driven the V6 and V8. I had to wait for the diesel to arrive before I could test drive it. The dealer wouldn't even let me finalize the purchase until I'd test driven the diesel first to ensure I still wanted it.
And that's exactly what i've done. test drove the engines i'm interested in. Initially I drove a v6 4x2 base Laredo, but I want to go back and drive the v6 4x4 Overland as that is what I'd actually be getting. Didn't think there would be an issue coming on here to ask questions and to explain my dilemma in trying to figure out which one I want. I've managed to talk myself into and out of each engine several times now. People seem to be so quick to condemn a thread, it isn't like one more forum post is going to make us run out of internet.
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 02-10-2014, 11:17 PM
thebc2's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2014 3.0L WK2
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 95
Thanks: 4
Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts
Rep Power: 422
thebc2 is on a distinguished road
Re: USA Today - Test Drive: New diesel Cherokee not quite Grand

I think you were perfectly justified to ask around and I applaud you for driving the different models, I wish everyone would do the same. It would go a long way to curbing the disinformation found in some of these threads. I'm just disappointed this thread degenerated the way it did. We have a passionate community, it just gets a bit absurd sometimes with the line of reasoning people will use to justify their thought process.
__________________
2014 JGC Overland EcoDiesel
Maximum Steel/Black
ORAII
Adv. Tech
Changes: 265/60/18 Goodyear Wrangler AT Adventure w/ Kevlar | Mopar Rock Rails | Weathertechs
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 02-11-2014, 12:35 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Boston
Posts: 819
Thanks: 0
Thanked 31 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 73086
mswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond repute
Re: USA Today - Test Drive: New diesel Cherokee not quite Grand

Quote:
Originally Posted by f1anatic View Post
Please explain again where did you come up with the 2 % efficiency increase ? The cost of the fuel is another matter altogether. Maybe you were looking for another word or words altogether...I know what you mean, but let's save the word efficiency for what it really is intended to be: a ratio of the output to input, always less than 1 since the beginning of the universe.


Efficiency, as in Thermal Efficiency of an Engine, is definitely in the favor of the Diesel engine. The economics might not be favorable to the Diesel Jeep, but the thermodynamic efficiency is.
Energy consumption (city/hwy)

Hemi 241/169 kW-hrs/100 mi
V6 198/140 kW-hrs/100 mi
Diesel 182/137 kW-hrs/100 mi
SRT 259/177 kW-hrs/100 mi

Read more: 2014 Motor Trend SUV of the Year Contenders - Motor Trend Page 4

Highway 137/140 = 97.8% (V6 efficient as Diesel).

City the spread is bigger, Diesel is 8% more efficient.

This way of comparing is nice because it basically factors in the different cost of fuel without getting into the variability based on season and location. It's going to get roughly priced based on the "Work" it can do.

But if you want REAL numbers.

EPA is the only fair Apples to Apples way to compare MPG. That's what it's for. You get a whopping 4 miles per gallon more. A whopping 16% increase. In my area (currently) Diesel cost ~25% more ($3.35 vs $4.15). I'd lose money even if the upgrade was free and Urea was free.

Don't buy the Diesel to save money (over the V6), no matter how many miles you plan to drive it. It may be worth it if you are comparing a Hemi.

I would have considered a Diesel if it saved me money. But there is no way, no how it would save me a dime when you run the numbers.

If someone says they get 32 MPG on the Diesel, the same driver and conditions would have got 28 on V6. Roughly.

It's just not a big enough jump. It's very close to the cost difference in the Fuel.
__________________
08-10-2014 Limited 3.6L Red W/Black Int, Tow Group IV, 8.4AN Radio, ProClip, OBDLink/Torque, Zeigler Lifetime MaxCare
OEM: Mud Flaps, Matts, Cargo Liner, Cross Rails
UConnect: 13.48.3 TSB: 21-007-13C (Yippy) Tires: OEM/Nokian
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 02-11-2014, 07:01 AM
f1anatic's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2014 3.6L WK2
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Illinoize
Posts: 959
Thanks: 5
Thanked 68 Times in 50 Posts
Rep Power: 158192
f1anatic has a reputation beyond reputef1anatic has a reputation beyond reputef1anatic has a reputation beyond reputef1anatic has a reputation beyond reputef1anatic has a reputation beyond reputef1anatic has a reputation beyond reputef1anatic has a reputation beyond reputef1anatic has a reputation beyond reputef1anatic has a reputation beyond reputef1anatic has a reputation beyond reputef1anatic has a reputation beyond repute
Re: USA Today - Test Drive: New diesel Cherokee not quite Grand

Thank you for the explanation on the number you quoted.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 02-11-2014, 08:35 AM
ExcursionDiesel's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2014 3.0L WK2
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: W. TN.
Posts: 1,564
Thanks: 4
Thanked 221 Times in 149 Posts
Rep Power: 2935
ExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by mswlogo View Post
Energy consumption (city/hwy)

But if you want REAL numbers.

EPA is the only fair Apples to Apples way to compare MPG. That's what it's for. You get a whopping 4 miles per gallon more. A whopping 16% increase. In my area (currently) Diesel cost ~25% more ($3.35 vs $4.15). I'd lose money even if the upgrade was free and Urea was free.
Diesel is 3.80 where I live and gas is 3.20.
Quote:
Don't buy the Diesel to save money (over the V6), no matter how many miles you plan to drive it. It may be worth it if you are comparing a Hemi.

I would have considered a Diesel if it saved me money. But there is no way, no how it would save me a dime when you run the numbers.
Based on that criteria, why are you not driving a Prius? The GC cost more! 😁 (Doesn't save money).

Diesel buyers are interested in V8 performance with better economy. I test drove the Pentastar and it is anemic by comparison...unless you like to drive with a heavy foot.….and there goes the efficiency.
Quote:
If someone says they get 32 MPG on the Diesel, the same driver and conditions would have got 28 on V6. Roughly.
Every gas powered SUV I've owned has fallen short of the EPA ratings. Every diesel has exceeded it. I don't drive with different habits per engine type but may not replicate the EPA test cycle either. I'm not typically in a heavy traffic area and the terrain is relatively flat. I'm a regional service engineer and drive 35k a year.
__________________
----------------------
The founder of JeepGarage.org, Scottina06, has a son Max who is in need of corrective surgery from an infection at birth that left one leg 4 inches short. We need to support our Jeep brothers. His family has started a fund on giveforward.com. If you have ever been helped by someone else, now is a good time to pay it forward. Here is a link to that page. God bless you! http://gfwd.at/1rz33PW
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 02-11-2014, 11:09 AM
Member
My Jeep: 2014 3.6L WK2
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Northern California
Posts: 67
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Rep Power: 490
roots4x has a reputation beyond reputeroots4x has a reputation beyond reputeroots4x has a reputation beyond reputeroots4x has a reputation beyond reputeroots4x has a reputation beyond reputeroots4x has a reputation beyond reputeroots4x has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExcursionDiesel View Post
Diesel is 3.80 where I live and gas is 3.20.

Based on that criteria, why are you not driving a Prius? The GC cost more! ?de01 (Doesn't save money).

Diesel buyers are interested in V8 performance with better economy. I test drove the Pentastar and it is anemic by comparison...unless you like to drive with a heavy foot.….and there goes the efficiency.

Every gas powered SUV I've owned has fallen short of the EPA ratings. Every diesel has exceeded it. I don't drive with different habits per engine type but may not replicate the EPA test cycle either. I'm not typically in a heavy traffic area and the terrain is relatively flat. I'm a regional service engineer and drive 35k a year.
I think what most people are saying that it just isn't a good idea to get the diesel ONLY to save money. The V6 may be a little anemic but you can still go off road, tow, and carry a lot of cargo. If you're looking to keep operating costs low yet still enjoy most of the functionality, the gas V6 is is a good option. The diesel is a good option for those who need it.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 02-11-2014, 11:36 AM
Shannon's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2014 3.0L WK2
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Lakeville, MN
Posts: 1,309
Thanks: 222
Thanked 177 Times in 106 Posts
Rep Power: 9757
Shannon has a reputation beyond reputeShannon has a reputation beyond reputeShannon has a reputation beyond reputeShannon has a reputation beyond reputeShannon has a reputation beyond reputeShannon has a reputation beyond reputeShannon has a reputation beyond reputeShannon has a reputation beyond reputeShannon has a reputation beyond reputeShannon has a reputation beyond reputeShannon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: USA Today - Test Drive: New diesel Cherokee not quite Grand

It's kinda like saying you can go from point A to point B on either a moped or a Harley. Both will get you there, but one definitely has more power.
__________________
SFU: : 2014 Overland 4X4 EcoDiesel, Billet Silver/Black. ORAII, Adv Tech, Engine Heater, 2000 coats of paint
Picked up 11/14


Current Ride:
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland Ecodiesel
2007 Wrangler (wife's ride)
2008 20' Four Winns bow rider speed boat
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Shannon For This Useful Post:
  #45  
Old 02-11-2014, 11:37 AM
Member
My Jeep: 2011 3.6L WK2
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Olathe, KS
Posts: 962
Thanks: 0
Thanked 13 Times in 13 Posts
Rep Power: 3636
kkreit01 has a reputation beyond reputekkreit01 has a reputation beyond reputekkreit01 has a reputation beyond reputekkreit01 has a reputation beyond reputekkreit01 has a reputation beyond reputekkreit01 has a reputation beyond reputekkreit01 has a reputation beyond reputekkreit01 has a reputation beyond reputekkreit01 has a reputation beyond reputekkreit01 has a reputation beyond reputekkreit01 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: USA Today - Test Drive: New diesel Cherokee not quite Grand

I think it's safe to say that all powertrains are great in their own way. They are all different, and have different goals in mind. We are lucky to have choices. A diesel may not be for me, and the V6 may not be for the next guy.
__________________
2014 Durango Limited AWD in Granite: Premium Package, 2nd Row Captain Chairs, 2nd row Console.
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 02-11-2014, 04:06 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Boston
Posts: 819
Thanks: 0
Thanked 31 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 73086
mswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond reputemswlogo has a reputation beyond repute
Re: USA Today - Test Drive: New diesel Cherokee not quite Grand

Quote:
Originally Posted by ExcursionDiesel View Post
Diesel is 3.80 where I live and gas is 3.20.

Based on that criteria, why are you not driving a Prius? The GC cost more! �� (Doesn't save money).

Diesel buyers are interested in V8 performance with better economy. I test drove the Pentastar and it is anemic by comparison...unless you like to drive with a heavy foot.….and there goes the efficiency.

Every gas powered SUV I've owned has fallen short of the EPA ratings. Every diesel has exceeded it. I don't drive with different habits per engine type but may not replicate the EPA test cycle either. I'm not typically in a heavy traffic area and the terrain is relatively flat. I'm a regional service engineer and drive 35k a year.
Every Vehicle I've owned does better than EPA.

If a Prius could tow my 4500LB boat, sure I'd be all over it.

The GC with V6 Gas is about the smallest I'd tow 4500LBs with.

Prior to the Dec Transmission update, the V6 was pretty doggy. But now it's pretty impressive, so yeah if you test drove one a while back I can see why you'd say it was anemic. You don't have to stomp on it or even take it out of Eco mode.

The V6 Gas is faster at Quarter Mile and Faster at 0-60 than the Diesel.
__________________
08-10-2014 Limited 3.6L Red W/Black Int, Tow Group IV, 8.4AN Radio, ProClip, OBDLink/Torque, Zeigler Lifetime MaxCare
OEM: Mud Flaps, Matts, Cargo Liner, Cross Rails
UConnect: 13.48.3 TSB: 21-007-13C (Yippy) Tires: OEM/Nokian
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 02-11-2014, 07:09 PM
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2014 3.0L WK2
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Castle Rock, CO
Posts: 56
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 539
Skijackz is on a distinguished road
Re: USA Today - Test Drive: New diesel Cherokee not quite Grand

Quote:
Originally Posted by ExcursionDiesel View Post

Diesel buyers are interested in V8 performance with better economy.
Amen - the V6 I drove would be interesting in the mountains. Just on the hills around Denver it was searching for some get up and go. The Diesel solves two problems for me: Mountains and Economy. It does both equally well.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 02-11-2014, 10:57 PM
ExcursionDiesel's Avatar
Premium Member
My Jeep: 2014 3.0L WK2
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: W. TN.
Posts: 1,564
Thanks: 4
Thanked 221 Times in 149 Posts
Rep Power: 2935
ExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond reputeExcursionDiesel has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by mswlogo View Post
Every Vehicle I've owned does better than EPA.
You are the rare exception! I admire your skills. I generally drive with the traffic flow or a bit faster and have been disappointed with gas mileage vs EPA estimates of my gas engine vehicles thus far. Extremely conservative driving was the only way I could meet or exceed EPA estimates. This is consistent with what many others have said.
Quote:
The V6 Gas is faster at Quarter Mile and Faster at 0-60 than the Diesel.
...vey true, if you floor it. Peak horsepower is better. In daily driving and and part throttle conditions, which is 99.9% of the time, the CRD drives like a V8, actually better in some respects (my wife has a V8 GC), and anyone that has driven the Pentastar and CRD for more than a day will tell you there really is a huge difference. 400+ ft-lbs of torque at 1800 rpm is twice that of the Pentastar and all available underfoot at normal operating rpms...no gas gulping dramatic upshifts.

I must confess that my GC has a BlueSpark tuner and would probably spank a Pentastar in the 1/4 but who knows, I don't race. I just like the extra grunt.

FYI....I rented a GC V6 gasser before ordering my CRD. It was nice to drive and convinced me to order based on chassis quality and ride...but it worked pretty hard at merging and pulling hills. It does use the 8 speed to its advantage, no doubt!

A gasser operating near its peak torque is extremely inefficient and would suffer a premature death under those load conditions. My neighbors small motor home gutted its 454 gasser every 40k miles...until he switched to one that was powered by a little Cummins 5.9. He was still running it at 120k miles the last time I checked. He also went from 9mpg to 14mpg.

The 3.0 diesel in the new Ram is going to really shine since its a larger working vehicle. Reviews so far have been very favorable. Efficiency won't nosedive under load like the gassers do. Towing with a gasser KILLS the economy. Mark my words...the Ram will be extremely popular as a light to medium weight travel trailer hauler.

Life is full of choices and everyone likes to think their choice is the right one. Anyone interested in the real advantages of a small displacement diesel should test drive one before forming any preconceived notions based on uninformed internet naysayers. Find out for yourself. Everyone that has taken a ride in mine has been very impressed with the smooth quiet power and economy.

Whatever someone chooses, drive it and enjoy it!
__________________

__________________
----------------------
The founder of JeepGarage.org, Scottina06, has a son Max who is in need of corrective surgery from an infection at birth that left one leg 4 inches short. We need to support our Jeep brothers. His family has started a fund on giveforward.com. If you have ever been helped by someone else, now is a good time to pay it forward. Here is a link to that page. God bless you! http://gfwd.at/1rz33PW
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
TEST DRIVE: Cherokee vs. Grand Cherokee ColoradoJeep Grand Cherokee - WK2 - 5 01-05-2014 01:02 AM
Is the Diesel GC Coming to the USA, with 8-speed Tranny? echo7tango Diesel Powered 2012+ Export Grand Cherokee 14 03-24-2013 01:55 PM
Test drove the 3.0L Diesel today! WK2JGC Diesel Powered 2012+ Export Grand Cherokee 42 08-27-2012 06:57 AM
2nd test drive of Overland today, one problem arose ucla95 Trouble Shooting/Problems/Service 14 12-29-2011 12:56 PM
Oil Change Interval - Article in USA Today Dan JGC Engine Performance/Intakes/Exhausts 12 06-19-2011 07:24 AM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:20 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2012 - JeepGarage.Org
The Jeep Grand Cherokee Owners Community