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SRT Intake Design Flaw?

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14K views 43 replies 21 participants last post by  jwernatl 
#1 · (Edited)
Hi Guys,

I stumbled upon a youtube video that someone have driven through a 4-5 inches puddle and killed the car. His description as follow:

"I thought that when I purchased a Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT AT $93K that I would at least be able to drive through 4 to 5 inches of water, WRONG !!! MY JEEP sucked water into the engine (6.4 Litre V8) destroying it, now after seeing all the Jeep ads you would expect your jeep to be able to traverse a bit of water, after all the ads show the Jeeps barreling through creeks and rivers deeper than what I went through, covered by warranty you say? not a chance, the people that I contacted were rude and arrogant and would not even entertain the idea that it was warranty, as far as they were concerned it was end of story, one of them even inferred that I had driven through much deeper water, I had a look at the air intake and found that unlike other models that had a tube from the air box to the front of the car just under the bonnet/hood to take in air, my air box opened straight down to between the chassis and the wheel arch so that any water splashed up from the front wheel went straight into the air intake, very bad design flaw and Jeep do not want to address it, shame on Jeep Australia, anyone that owns an SRT should lift the top off their air box and remove the air filter and you can see straight down to the chassis, and above all do not take your SRT through water"



What do you think? I believed this is the 2nd one I have heard it happened.
 
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#2 ·
Whirlpool user Mosky had his SRT die while driving in rain, 3 months of the road and no fix other than saying you shouldn't drive in heavy rain. Jeep Aus did nothing, dealer purchased car back.
I will get him to check this out.
 
#6 ·
IMO this jeep did not drive through the water fast in any way if the vehicle is stock….usually its guys blasting through water when a hydrolock occurs… Very surprised this happened to a stock SRT…. if its truly stock…seems more like a CAI to me….Ive seen this happen a few times in person in the off road community…if its OEM this is definitely a problem for Jeep.
 
#9 ·
There have been about 38k wk2 srt's built since 2012...so 2 out of 38k aint bad. It sounds like dumb luck and a combination of mother natures hard luck to me. I drove almost 2 years with a true cai where the filter was just behind the drivers side lower air intake threw monsoons and 18" of fluffy snow and didnt have a problem.
 
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#10 ·
I'm sorry this has happened to him BUT, what a pelican, You dont drive thru any water at that speed, was he trying to impress someone maybe...that was more than 4-5inches of water as he was on the left which is the lower side of the road camber which can be up to 10inches drop (more in some cases). He should have been in the centre of the road. In all the adverts in Aus I have not seen one advertisement featuring the SRT off road. It is a performance AWD not 4WD. Hope the dealer doesn't see the video clip ;)
 
#11 · (Edited)
CBS News just now showed someone in a white WK2 Grand Cherokee trying to cross a flooded section of roadway down in TX during their weekend storm. The vehicle was swept off the road, floated downstream and then turned turtle as it was going past the camera.

Don't know if the driver was still inside or managed to get out.
 
#15 · (Edited)
These are the posts on an Aus forum from an SRT owner that had similar issues just driving in rain.

posted 2015-Jan-28, 1:34 pm

My SRT8 had to be towed, engine died as I was driving on the Hume highway at 80km/h (Was heavy rain) Was towing racing car at the time. Managed to pull over on the side of the road.

Tried to restart engine, after the fourth go it started, engine was pinging badly, running really rough, thudding coming from the cats and HUGE amounts of steam coming out of both exhaust pipes.

That was yesterday morning at 3am. Still hasn't been looked at, yet.My SRT8 had to be towed, engine died as I was driving on the Hume highway at 80km/h (Was heavy rain) Was towing racing car at the time. Managed to pull over on the side of the road.

Tried to restart engine, after the fourth go it started, engine was pinging badly, running really rough, thudding coming from the cats and HUGE amounts of steam coming out of both exhaust pipes.

That was yesterday morning at 3am. Still hasn't been looked at, yet.


posted 2015-Jan-28, 3:05 pm

Was the last batch of the series 1, 2013. Alpine white.


posted 2015-Jan-29, 1:43 pm

Report on my SRT8, multiple miss fire due to water ingestion. Engine shut down to protect itself. Jeep are at a loss on how so much water entered the inlet manifold since the vehicle was driving down a perfectly sealed highway during rain. (Was on the Hume, just South of Sydney)

Looks like a design fault if water can enter the engine when it rains. (Not talking about crossing rivers or driving through deep water)

posted 2015-Jan-29, 5:04 pm

being towed to Canberra (dealership where it was purchased and serviced all its life.) To be diagnosed properly. It's running really rough, though not misfiring. I'm hoping it's not bent rods.

Not that worried since it's under warranty. It's been perfect up until now.

Though driving for 10 hours in constant pouring rain on the Hume shouldn't have caused any issues.


posted 2015-Feb-25, 11:41 am

SRT8 Update:

Been at the dealership for a month now, they found water had been ingested into the engine. Air cleaner, inlet and plenum show signs of water. No idea how it got in there.

Dealerships advice, "Don't drive it when it rains!"

This is comedy gold!


posted 2015-Mar-24, 6:19 pm

SRT8 update:

It's STILL at the dealership, two months now. Have called Jeep Australia to find out what the hell is going on. (Apparently, according to the dealership, Jeep Australia are the ones holding up proceedings by denying fixing problems since the day the vehicle was delivered)

Where Jeep Australia said there is no such issue and will get to the bottom of it all.

(New front bar to be fitted, it kept popping out from it's mounts, even from the day it was delivered. Common issue.)

As for the water ingress, Jeep Australia and the dealership have no idea how it has happened, and keep suggesting not to drive it in the rain.

Apparently driving it for over a certain amount of time in the rain is considered "Excessive" thus is not warranted. When asking them what is the time limit that must be obeyed to pull over when it is raining, they keep refusing to answer, and refuse to give that to me in writing.

So there you have it, I have a vehicle that has a certain time limit allowed to be driven in the rain, yet no one can or will tell me what said limit is, except that it's under what I was doing to cause the issue. (Drove from Melbourne to Sydney in the rain) Apparently that's "excessive" driving time according to Jeep Australia!

Can anyone say 'Not fit for purpose' ?

(Considering my farm vehicle, a Great Wall X240 did the same trip, towing the same trailer, in the same conditions, without any issues. It was just a bit slower!)


posted 2015-Apr-24, 9:57 am

SRT8 UPDATE:

Vehicle has been at the dealer for three months now (No loan vehicle) It's been driven plenty of times in perfect weather to test for problems when it rains. (Yeah, go figure)

Jeep Australia have inspected the vehicle and report that everything is within manufacture specifications. The air cleaner element has been replaced with a new item, same as factory stock. Nothing else has been done/changed/modified to the vehicle to stop water ingress into the engine when towing on the highway in the rain.

Jeep Australia and the dealership have been requested to purchase the vehicle back, since it's not fit for purpose (Driving on perfectly sealed highways in the rain whilst towing)

Would I purchase another Jeep?

No.


posted 2015-May-14, 5:57 pm

SRT8 UPDATE:

Three and a half MONTHS later, vehicle has finally been purchased back by the dealership.

Dealer principle made an offer that was acceptable, paperwork completed yesterday.

I would like to say that whilst the dealership did the right thing, Jeep Australia REFUSED to acknowledge any issues and refused to offer any help (Loan vehicle, information, compensation)

In the end, if you purchase a Jeep and it is a good one, fantastic.

But if you are unfortunate to experience serious issues with it, forget about Jeep Australia helping.


posted 2015-May-15, 8:36 pm


not sure why Jeep Aust think it's perfectly fine for a 6.4lt engine to ingest water, hydraulic lock, and when it finally starts again, runs very rough, lost heaps of power and chews threw fuel.

Obviously their idea of fine is completely different to anyone elses idea of 'fine'.

Then for them to suggest to not drive it when it rains............

For me, Jeep Aust lost all credibility.

For all the others who are still owners, good luck. :}



THE ABOVE WAS SLIGHTLY EDITED TO DEAL WITH ANSWERS TO QUOTES.
 
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#16 ·
I wonder if they tried to pull the plugs out and then turn the motor over to clear the water out?


but I agree, that's crappy how that happened
 
#17 ·
Re the video - That is a lot of water coming up from the wheel arches, he is moving. And the water must be 12+ inches deep, you can see half the wheel of the 4wd crossing the intersection under water.

The guy whose car died from driving it in the rain is a bit different. Or perhaps he isn't being honest about traveling through water. Perhaps a CAI is safer, since you don't get pooling of water like you get in the OEM air intake.
 
#18 ·
You can see the depth on the left side by the two other vehicles crossing earlier. In both cases about half the wheel height.



 
#19 ·
Message from Mosky after I showed him this thread:


I can definately say that I did not drive through standing/flowing pooled water. (It was raining heavily all the way from Melbourne to Sydney.)

Only thing modified on that vehicle was a cat back exhaust. Dealer and Jeep Australia had/have no issues with that. (Though Jeep Aust suggested in passing comment to me that a modded exhaust 'may' have contributed to the engine sucking in water, but quickly dismissed that when I asked them to prove the exhaust could have done that)

As for removing the plugs and turning the engine over, water ingress was the last thing on my mind when driving down the main highway on the East coast at 3am in the dark, after I just spent 12 hours at the wheel. (That and I didn't have any tools with me to do that)

Mine was a case of water spray finding it's way into the aircleaner (Very easy, as the OP in that thread has pointed out) The SRT8 aircleaner is open at the bottom, water vapor can enter the aircleaner easily.

The issue is, after driving for any length of time, the aircleaner element will become saturated with water, keep driving (Cause you have no idea this has happened) The water will now suck through the aircleaner element and start to pool inside the inlet plenum.

Throw elevated throttle angle (Was towing my race car) and a corner, guess where all that water is going to end up?

1 or two people complaining out of 38,000 of course Jeep Australia won't do anything. It's called an acceptable loss, one they can and do just ignore.

To the end consumer who paid $98k for a Jeep, and then be treated this way, leaves a VERY bady taste on ones maw.
 
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#20 ·
I'd love to see a pic of the intake. It does sound like poor design, and I'd expect more than 2 owners would suffer from the problem eventually.
 
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#21 ·
Here is the bottom of the stock air intak box... This opening feeds air up from the front ducts...

 
#25 ·
Yeah...2 out of 38k. Sorry...if the intake had a design defect or problem...more owners would have hydrolocked engines imho.

The video shows what is needed to hydrolock a 6.4 hemi on our platform. Drive 40 mph through 12-18" of standing water.
 
#24 · (Edited)
Yeah, and that owner was advised by the dealer that you aren't allowed to drive in heavy rain for extended periods. I guess the ducts that feed to the airbox are in the front airdam? It would be like a vacuum cleaner sucking up water. A CAI sounds like a safer option.
 
#27 ·
The so called "engineers" are always trying to find a spot to draw in cool air that hasn't passed through the engine area or the cooling system. This is a bad design. Even though the SRT isn't made to do much off roading, it still should be prepared to be a Jeep when it needs to. Ford used to put a snorkel in the lower part of the front grill on their first offering of fuel injected truck engines back in the early 80's. Well every hunter or off roader that dipped the front bumper under water gave their engine a drink of death too. A Hunyadi could probably hit that flooded area wide open and live. Its just another kink with Chryco mule testers and designers where coffee sipping and interstate driving comes before any actual real world testing.
 
#28 ·
Well if ya watched the video you'd see the driver was an idiot for driving that fast in that water.

My intake is up behind the head light but I bet an engine if I drove thru that water like he did it would ingest water and die too.

The driver blew his motor, not the intake
 
#29 · (Edited)
Just a couple points in the manual i found on driving through water....
Page 405
http://www.wk2jeeps.com/manuals/2014_wk_owners_manual_srt8_6th.pdf

DRIVING THROUGH WATER

Although your vehicle is capable of driving through
shallow standing water, consider the following Cautions
and Warnings before doing so.

STARTING AND OPERATING 403
WARNING!
• Driving through standing water limits your vehicle’s
traction capabilities. Do not exceed 5 mph
(8 km/h) when driving through standing water.
• Driving through standing water limits your vehicle’s
braking capabilities, which increases stopping
distances. Therefore, after driving through standing
water, drive slowly and lightly press on the
brake pedal several times to dry the brakes.
• Failure to follow these warnings may result in
injuries that are serious or fatal to you, your passengers,
and others around you.
CAUTION!
• Always check the depth of the standing water
before driving through it. Never drive through
standing water that is deeper than the bottom of
the tire rims mounted on the vehicle.
• Determine the condition of the road or the path
that is under water and if there are any obstacles in
the way before driving through the standing water.
• Do not exceed 5 mph (8 km/h) when driving
through standing water. This will minimize wave
effects.
(Continued)
404 STARTING AND OPERATING
CAUTION! (Continued)
• Driving through standing water may cause damage
to your vehicle’s drivetrain components. Always
inspect your vehicle’s fluids (i.e., engine oil, transmission,
axle, etc.) for signs of contamination (i.e.,
fluid that is milky or foamy in appearance) after
driving through standing water. Do not continue to
operate the vehicle if any fluid appears contaminated,
as this may result in further damage. Such
damage is not covered by the New Vehicle Limited
Warranty.
• Getting water inside your vehicle’s engine can
cause it to lock up and stall out, and cause serious
internal damage to the engine. Such damage is not
covered by the New Vehicle Limited Warranty.
 
#31 ·
I agree the guy in the video was being foolish, the other owner who apparently drove in heavy rain and experienced the same issue is a concern. I can see how rain pelting down on the road could get sucked up into the airbox. But as Scott says, if it was a design flaw then you'd expect more owners to be having the problem. Perhaps a lot of them modify their intake?
 
#33 ·
Looking at the front of a wk2 srt,if the intake box(air filter) is behind the driver side headlight and then ducked down to the hole on the drivers side of the lower grill and the water level is up to that hole.it could scoop up water at some speed.

Well i don't have a srt so i'm just guessing.
 
#36 ·
The SRT has NO duct leading from the right lower front to the airbox. There is a hole in the bottom of the airbox...thats it. The hole is probably 4-5" square
 
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