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-   -   Two issues with the first 30 seconds (http://www.jeepgarage.org/f196/two-issues-with-the-first-30-seconds-21194.html)

Garaphin 04-02-2011 11:10 PM

Two issues with the first 30 seconds
 
Hey guys-

I have two questions related to how my '00 WJ V8 sounds and behaves when first starting up and the first 30 seconds or so of moving.

1.) The steering wheel can be hard to turn right away... as if the power steering requires a bit of warm up time. Oddly it doesn't seem like a problem when turning in reverse... just in D. It loosens up quickly, but definitely need to muscle the wheel at first.

2.) First gear sounds kind of loud... like it's revving extra hard but I'm not seeing an RPM spike or anything. It's also like it's reluctant to jump to 2nd, but once it does (after 30 seconds or so) the Jeep runs like a champ.

Any thoughts on these two issue? Related? I can tell you that I'm in Seattle and so the weather isn't extreme or anything. I do park the Jeep on a slight hill (facing down), but I've had a valet note the steering issue from flat surfaces too. Both fluids are probably due for a change as part of regular maintenance.

Thanks!

Frango100 04-02-2011 11:41 PM

Re: Two issues with the first 30 seconds
 
Did you check the power steering fluid level? Is the power steering pump making a whining sound or is maybe the serpentine belt slipping in the beginning?
First gear sounds a kind a loud, do you mean at the moment you put it into D? Its quite normal that you hear a sound as if gears are getting into contact when you put it in D or Rev.
What also can happen is at first start of the day or after sitting for quite some hours, when you put the tranny into gear and gives gas, that nothing happens (only engine revs up). This has to do with the spin-on return filter which can allow fluid from the torque converter to flow back to the oil pan. It can take quite some seconds for the torque converter to be filled up again after engine start and to be able to transfer the torque. Only filter change would solve this.

Garaphin 04-03-2011 12:14 AM

Re: Two issues with the first 30 seconds
 
Thanks for the feedback.

PS Fluid level looks fine (full) although it's dark--like it's seen some years. PS doesn't make any noise at any other time...not sure how I'd know if the belt is slipping.

First gear only sounds "loud" when I'm giving it gas accelerating up to the point where it should switch to 2nd. Its like you described it...the engine is just revving. Sounds like it could be the issue you described. What filter change are you talking about exactly? Tranny filter or "spin-on return filter (is that the spin-on oil change filter kind of filter?)?"

EDIT: You talking about this kind of filter? My WJ does have the Tow Group IV so I do have the tranny cooler.
http://www.amazon.com/ATP-TX-112-Aut...dp/B000C8PBCC/

Frango100 04-03-2011 07:17 AM

Re: Two issues with the first 30 seconds
 
A slipping serpentine belt makes a noise that for sure you would have mentioned, its a very loud yelling sound, which normally auments in volume when accelerating the engine. If you donīt know the service history of the car at least it would not hurt to change the PS fluid, but still strange though that the problem is only there in the first 30 sec. Looks almost if the pump is not delivering enough flow to build up the pressure quickly.
For the tranny, both filters are inside the tranny, a big flat one is the pump inlet filter and the round spin-on filter in the cooler return line. The round one is quite small and doesnīt look exactly as the one you showed here. But the problem with this filter is a valve inside it which doesnīt close properly and only gives problems when the engine is off for quite some time. So that only gives a problem when you first put it in D (or Rev), it just takes a 10 sec or so to fill up the torque converter and feel the converter kicking in. Your problem seems to be different, as it is at the moment of changing gear. What kind of noise is it making? The late shifting is only happening in the beginning, or always when you accelerate? Did you check the tranny fluid level as well? You donīt have the "Check Engine" light on?

mtbitt 04-03-2011 09:37 AM

Re: Two issues with the first 30 seconds
 
Not sure what kind of noise you have in first gear, but once in a while we run into a mechanical cooling fan clutch staying locked up and sounds like a 747 taking off until it kicks out.

Mark

Garaphin 04-03-2011 12:16 PM

Re: Two issues with the first 30 seconds
 
Thanks both for the follow ups.

So the noise it makes isn't alarming or anything... and I think that 747 analogy is pretty good. Just sounds like unecessarily loud revving as I approach 2nd gear from first then suddenly it sounds just fine. I should mention to that it really only occurs first startup in the morning, after it's sat for a day or two. It's not a daily driver for me and later startups in the day don't really have this issue.

Also, no Check Engine lights, no error codes when I do the key trick. Thanks also for the tranny filter explanation. I had a mental picture of the 4.0's filter in my head and realized just last night that the 4.7 has a two part filter system.

mtbitt 04-03-2011 05:08 PM

Re: Two issues with the first 30 seconds
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Garaphin (Post 388463)
Thanks both for the follow ups.

So the noise it makes isn't alarming or anything... and I think that 747 analogy is pretty good. Just sounds like unecessarily loud revving as I approach 2nd gear from first then suddenly it sounds just fine. I should mention to that it really only occurs first startup in the morning, after it's sat for a day or two. It's not a daily driver for me and later startups in the day don't really have this issue.

Also, no Check Engine lights, no error codes when I do the key trick. Thanks also for the tranny filter explanation. I had a mental picture of the 4.0's filter in my head and realized just last night that the 4.7 has a two part filter system.

Before you start it, open the hood and if possible have someone else start it while you see if a ton of air is being blown by the cooling fan. You can even hold the idle up by hand at the throttle body. If the noise goes away, as well as the air flow slows down, I would figure on a new fan clutch.

When you do this, please stay away from the fan and anything else moving under there. Just not sure how familier you are with underhood stuff, sometimes people just do not realize how dangerous it can be.


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