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-   -   "Moose Test" from consumer reports? (http://www.jeepgarage.org/f73/moose-test-from-consumer-reports-45281.html)

echostate 07-28-2012 09:25 PM

"Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
I posted a thread on the moose test performed by a Swedish magazine, and then I found this similar test result from consumer reports, a much more reputable organization. Starting from 2:30 of the video is a test similar to the moose test. It's not as bad as the Swedish moose test, but consumer reports did say "on our handling track, we found its limit is very low" ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6O9zSr-yAc

I think no matter the Swedish test is legit or not, Grand Cherokee's ESP and stability control is probably not the best in the class ...

I hope Jeep can come up with an update very soon. I'm in the market for a Grand Cherokee ...

jgc4ever 07-28-2012 09:42 PM

Re: "Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
Jeep already fixed that well over a year ago. There's a huge red link at the top of that Consumer Reports video to the updated Consumer Reports video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?annotat...&v=OionK7W8mvo
Also read our blog Chrysler fixes 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee handling problem: http://news.consumerreports.org/cars...g-problem.html

Update: Chrysler fixes 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee handling problem
Feb 10, 2011 4:02 PM


Chrysler has taken steps to rectify a handling problem we identified late last year with the new Jeep Grand Cherokee. Rest assured, Grand Cherokee owners and potential shoppers: The fix works.

When we tested the 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee V6 last fall, we were quite impressed overall, but found its on-limit handling performance disconcerting. In our double-lane-change avoidance maneuver, it skidded and hopped sideways on several runs (see video above). A V8 version we tested later didn't exhibit that problem.

Chrysler engineers asked to come to our track and review our findings. In early December we were informed that Chrysler had developed a fix. It's a software update focused on the stability control system. Chrysler started incorporating the update as of December production. All dealers have been performing that repair free for customers since early January and the fix has been applied to all vehicles in stock. It involves a "reflash" of the vehicle software. (Download Chrysler service bulletin pdf.)


We had the reflash performed on our V6 Grand Cherokee and have just repeated our emergency avoidance-maneuver tests. The Jeep performed much better, managing a top speed of 50 mph through the course. That's pretty good for a beefy SUV, but, more important, it behaved predictably when pushed up to and past its limits, instilling a lot more driver confidence. As a result the Grand Cherokee V6's overall test score has risen from 66 to 71, and it only adds to a vehicle that we find quite pleasurable to live with. (View our revised Grand Cherokee road test video.)

Gabe Shenhar

ENFORCER 07-29-2012 01:25 AM

Re: "Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
The look at that Jeep skipping all over the road in the first test, looks alot like the "moose test" video.
I wonder if the Export Spec models have not had this update ?
It is also a shame that testing by a magazine needed to find this failure, rather than Jeep's own testing.

echostate 07-29-2012 11:11 AM

Re: "Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jgc4ever (Post 662604)
Jeep already fixed that well over a year ago. There's a huge red link at the top of that Consumer Reports video to the updated Consumer Reports video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?annotat...&v=OionK7W8mvo
Also read our blog Chrysler fixes 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee handling problem: http://news.consumerreports.org/cars...g-problem.html

Update: Chrysler fixes 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee handling problem
Feb 10, 2011 4:02 PM


Chrysler has taken steps to rectify a handling problem we identified late last year with the new Jeep Grand Cherokee. Rest assured, Grand Cherokee owners and potential shoppers: The fix works.

When we tested the 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee V6 last fall, we were quite impressed overall, but found its on-limit handling performance disconcerting. In our double-lane-change avoidance maneuver, it skidded and hopped sideways on several runs (see video above). A V8 version we tested later didn't exhibit that problem.

Chrysler engineers asked to come to our track and review our findings. In early December we were informed that Chrysler had developed a fix. It's a software update focused on the stability control system. Chrysler started incorporating the update as of December production. All dealers have been performing that repair free for customers since early January and the fix has been applied to all vehicles in stock. It involves a "reflash" of the vehicle software. (Download Chrysler service bulletin pdf.)


We had the reflash performed on our V6 Grand Cherokee and have just repeated our emergency avoidance-maneuver tests. The Jeep performed much better, managing a top speed of 50 mph through the course. That's pretty good for a beefy SUV, but, more important, it behaved predictably when pushed up to and past its limits, instilling a lot more driver confidence. As a result the Grand Cherokee V6's overall test score has risen from 66 to 71, and it only adds to a vehicle that we find quite pleasurable to live with. (View our revised Grand Cherokee road test video.)

Gabe Shenhar


I heard that Jeep came up with an update quickly and then the Grand Cherokee performed normally when consumer reports tested it again. That's good! But still, the Swedish moose test discovers a problem that is similar to what Consumer reports discovered, this indicates a real problem existing ...

BTW,
the "updated" consumers report video is actually funny. It's not a new video at all --- it is just the original video with the "negative" parts removed (the part that the climate control panel dropped and the part that Jeep performed poorly at the handling test). Consumer reports just simply removed these two parts from the video and then called it "updated" -- I wonder what happened between Jeep media relation and Consumer reports ...

ColdCase 07-29-2012 01:56 PM

Re: "Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ENFORCER (Post 662651)
It is also a shame that testing by a magazine needed to find this failure, rather than Jeep's own testing.

That magazine is a tabloid looking for exposure and web hits ti enhance ad revenue. As with most "super market" tabloids they are no beyond cheating for effect. There was no Jeep failure, just a failure of folks seeing through the tabloid effort.

echostate 07-29-2012 06:00 PM

Re: "Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ColdCase (Post 662779)
That magazine is a tabloid looking for exposure and web hits ti enhance ad revenue. As with most "super market" tabloids they are no beyond cheating for effect. There was no Jeep failure, just a failure of folks seeing through the tabloid effort.


I don't think Consumer Reports falls into this category. Consumer reports relies on its millions of subscribers for revenue. My own impression is that most of their tests and reports on a variety of products (computers, cell phones, other electronics, airlines, car rentals, etc -- basically everything people buy) are quite good.

JeepersCreepers 07-30-2012 10:17 AM

Re: "Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ColdCase (Post 662779)
That magazine is a tabloid looking for exposure and web hits ti enhance ad revenue. As with most "super market" tabloids they are no beyond cheating for effect. There was no Jeep failure, just a failure of folks seeing through the tabloid effort.

So you're saying that this pre-fix behavior: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6O9zSr-yAc#t=2m33s

Is acceptable, even though most if not all other cars equipped with ESC and tested by CR don't exhibit such behavior at those speeds?

If it wasn't truly a failure, then you have to wonder why Chrysler didn't contest the findings like they did with the Swedish magazine, and why they released a software update to fix the behavior?

andyh 07-30-2012 12:51 PM

Re: "Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
Consumer Reports seems concerned in their latest article on the issue.

jgc4ever 07-30-2012 01:54 PM

Re: "Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by andyh (Post 663290)
Consumer Reports seems concerned in their latest article on the issue.

What do they say?

andyh 07-30-2012 01:56 PM

Re: "Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
Jeep Grand Cherokee fails Swedish moose test, lessons for U.S. consumers

I posted this link in one of the other threads.

frayedsheet 08-01-2012 07:43 PM

Re: "Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by andyh (Post 663311)
Jeep Grand Cherokee fails Swedish moose test, lessons for U.S. consumers

I posted this link in one of the other threads.

good reading. sounds like this isnt over yet.

Okokius 08-03-2012 11:56 AM

Re: "Moose Test" from consumer reports?
 
Hello everyone,

I own a 3.0 CRD Overland model identical to the one that was tested.

After more than 5.000 miles I'm very confident that the problem is due to the air suspension setup. It is way too soft in extensions (please forgive my English, if I do not use the exact technical words, I am from Spain and I'm trying my best!)

This can be clearly seen in the consumer reports first video as the car bounces two times on the second and the third turn. In both turns, the suspension is not capable of absorbing the big inertia this car has, and that is why it bounces without control (well, with very little control).

This cannot be fixed by an ESP software fix. It is just a problem of the shock absorber which should be stiffer in extensions. The problem can be maybe reduced with the ESP, but the problem will still be there. The worst of it is that if the limits are so low, or if you are close to them like when towing or loading the car on a family trip, the ESP will try its best but the suspension will not let it control such a bouncy behavior.

When I drive on the Spanish highways, the extension softness it is very noticeable if there is a big bump like the ones we have here at the entrance and exits of some highway bridges.
In the moose test videos, this is also the cause for the tires to blow, as the bouncing is like if you where jumping with the car on a hard turn... the front tire does its best but there is no way a single tire will hold 2.5 tons coming down from a bounce like that. It is so bouncy that I believe this is also the cause for the inner wheels to come up and cause the rollover.

I was not very concerned about this behavior until I saw the moose test videos, and I am now a bit disappointed, as one of my priorities was on road safety when I got this car.

The car is great and the CRD engine is fast and is now making 28.25MPG, which is what I expected, it is awesome in off road conditions, the best I have had, but this issue and my deep believe that it can only be really fixed tweaking or modifying the suspension, is now worrying me.

I wanted to share these impressions with you and also ask if any of you are aware of any possible tweak on the air suspension units to make them stiffer. As I can see, the rear suspension could accept the replacement of the shock absorber for a stiffer one, but the front suspension has everything in one piece.

Well, this was my first post and I would have preferred to write something about how much I liked the car. I hope Jeep will come back with a valid solution rather than a software patch.


I would really appreciate your feedback on this. Thanks in advance.


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