Jeep Garage  - Jeep Forum banner

1 - 17 of 17 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Has been smooth sailing since picking up my 2014 JGC Altitude. However, a few months ago I would get an intermittent flashing engine light at WOT on the highway at around 75 MPH. Didn't think much of it since the car ran fine around town and I don't highway drive much.

Asked service to take a look during oil change today and wouldn't you know the #6 cylinder was misfiring and they diagnosed it as a bad head. Just thought I'd post about it.

I'll update once I receive the car back. Rent a car for now.
 

·
Registered
2015 Overland
Joined
·
19 Posts
Mine failed for coolant entering cylinder 6 causing a misfire. I am at 87K miles on a 2015 GC Overland
 

·
Registered
Grand Cherokee
Joined
·
3,132 Posts
Mine failed for coolant entering cylinder 6 causing a misfire. I am at 87K miles on a 2015 GC Overland
Did they say a bad Head "Gasket" or a bad Cylinder Head? It's common for a bad Head Gasket to allow coolant to enter the cylinder and cause misfires..... .....for the Cylinder Head to allow coolant into the cylinder, it would have to be cracked.

I though the bad head issue for certain years of the 3.6L V6 was valve seat dropping or the head warping..... ....I might be thinking of other head problems on past engines.... ...I do remember it was a flaw, that caused the same problem everytime and I don't remember it being coolant leaking into the cylinder....

And yes, pulling a head for either replacing the headgasket or replacing the cylinder head, will cause dirt and debri to drop down in the oil and coolant, it's considered part of the job to drain and replace the oil and coolant after putting it all back together and before starting the engine for the first time, to get out any dirt or debri that drop down inside the engine and into the oil and coolant..... ....for a dealership to charge for it on top of the job sounds like the behaviour of one of the rip-off dealerships.....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
I had the drivers side head replaced on my 2012 wrangler a few years ago. Same engine as the current GC. I was told it was bad valve seats. First solid check engine light, then eventually flashing yellow. Model years 2012-2013 and some into 2014. They replaced the head. Changed oil. Changed coolant. And I think even new spark plugs.
No charge for any of this.
What bothered me the most is that Jeep/Chrysler knew about this. Known faulty casted cylinder heads on all pentastar v6 engines. Yet instead of having a recall, they just decided to wait until everyone had the check engine light come on with misfires.
 

·
Registered
Grand Cherokee
Joined
·
3,132 Posts
I had the drivers side head replaced on my 2012 wrangler a few years ago. Same engine as the current GC. I was told it was bad valve seats. First solid check engine light, then eventually flashing yellow. Model years 2012-2013 and some into 2014. They replaced the head. Changed oil. Changed coolant. And I think even new spark plugs.
No charge for any of this.
What bothered me the most is that Jeep/Chrysler knew about this. Known faulty casted cylinder heads on all pentastar v6 engines. Yet instead of having a recall, they just decided to wait until everyone had the check engine light come on with misfires.
Daimler started this, since they planned to just suck as much out of Chrysler as they could, then dump it, they cheapened everything and tried to run away with as much profit as possible.... ....the 41TE trans, that Chrysler had solved all the problems and had it perfectly reliable, they went back to failing left and right because Daimler made Chrysler switch back to undersized coolers and paper gaskets to save a few bucks......

They had a valve seats dropping, because Daimler made Chrysler switch to low interference fit valve seats (they are pressed into the head) any Chrysler "V" engine that had a cooling problem and got hot, definitely if you overheated, would drop a valve seat.......

Before this switch, valve seats dropping never happened, cause they spent a tiny bit more to have high interference fit valve seats that took a little more to press into the head, but never came out after that......

Daimler made Jeep design their mid-sized SUV, wonder why its first Generation was a disaster (it was designed by Daimler), 2nd Generation was a bigger success because Chrysler designed the suspension and other parts (which is why the WK/XK had front Independent suspension, it was the suspension they designed for the Mercedes. 3rd Generation was a "joint venture" its the WK2 basically, and that is why we have funny front diffs, there from Daimler....

Everything I've seen, Fiat is even worse, so still having heads with valve seats dropping, why am I not surprised.... ...or lifters that break requiring thousands of dollars in repairs.....
 

·
Registered
2015 Overland
Joined
·
19 Posts
Did they say a bad Head "Gasket" or a bad Cylinder Head? It's common for a bad Head Gasket to allow coolant to enter the cylinder and cause misfires..... .....for the Cylinder Head to allow coolant into the cylinder, it would have to be cracked.
The service advisor told me it needs a cylinder head. Looking forward to learning more when I go by there.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
The service advisor told me it needs a cylinder head. Looking forward to learning more when I go by there.
Make sure they don’t keep your car for 5 days like they did with me. It’s a one day job at the most to complete. They milked it by billing Fiat/Chrysler for 5 days of labor.
I’ve done similar jobs at my work and it can be done in a half day. That’s BOTH heads.
 

·
Registered
2015 Overland
Joined
·
19 Posts
Make sure they don’t keep your car for 5 days like they did with me. It’s a one day job at the most to complete. They milked it by billing Fiat/Chrysler for 5 days of labor.
I’ve done similar jobs at my work and it can be done in a half day. That’s BOTH heads.
Unfortunately, I was told the cylinder head is on national backorder with Mopar. I am expecting it to take more than a week. I have their loaner car to ease the burden.
 

·
Registered
Grand Cherokee
Joined
·
3,132 Posts
Make sure they don’t keep your car for 5 days like they did with me. It’s a one day job at the most to complete. They milked it by billing Fiat/Chrysler for 5 days of labor.
I’ve done similar jobs at my work and it can be done in a half day. That’s BOTH heads.
I doubt they can get away with charging corporate for 5 days labor. Corporate knows how long each job takes, likely they don't pay more than the book rate, that is already cut-rate, if the job takes longer that is on the Dealership and Corporate doesn't pay for it......

More likely, its just a poorly run Dealership Service Department, that doesn't have all the parts they need, or could care less about the customer and takes drive-ups while they let your vehicle sit till they can get to it..... ...its always possible the tech broke something they had to wait to come in.... ...but a lot of bad service departments don't prepare for appointments and then think nothing of letting a customer go days without their vehicle as they let it sit for what-ever reason......
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
I doubt they can get away with charging corporate for 5 days labor. Corporate knows how long each job takes, likely they don't pay more than the book rate, that is already cut-rate, if the job takes longer that is on the Dealership and Corporate doesn't pay for it......

More likely, its just a poorly run Dealership Service Department, that doesn't have all the parts they need, or could care less about the customer and takes drive-ups while they let your vehicle sit till they can get to it..... ...its always possible the tech broke something they had to wait to come in.... ...but a lot of bad service departments don't prepare for appointments and then think nothing of letting a customer go days without their vehicle as they let it sit for what-ever reason......
I can assure you they did take 5 days to do the job. it was there Monday to Friday and they even called and said they wanted to keep it over the weekend to test it out. Which I said no fn way. The head was also in stock before I decided to have the work done. I checked with them every day or every other day and was told they were still working on it. Supposedly. It didn’t cost me a penny to fix and the other head (passenger side), was extended to 10 years warranty if needed.
Knowing what I know now I would have given them 2 days tops to have it done.
 

·
Registered
Grand Cherokee
Joined
·
3,132 Posts
I have no doubt they had the car for 5 days and the job wasn't finished. I'm saying I doubt they can get away with charging Corporate for 5 days worth of labor, they get the going rate in the book, whether they finish it quicker or later......

Replacing the head takes a whole lot more than just the Head, so they may have had the head in stock, but in the middle of job discovered they were out of stock on the proper gaskets/seals, chemicals and lubes, etc..... ....it either spent most of that 5 days sitting or they did a little bit each day..... ...even 2 days is too long for a professional with the proper tools.... .....I've swapped both heads on a V-8 (granted an older engine) in a single afternoon.....
 

·
Registered
Grand Cherokee
Joined
·
3,132 Posts
.....I've swapped both heads on a V-8 (granted an older engine) in a single afternoon.....
Thinking back to it, that was a CAM in the block V8, which is much easier to remove and install the heads than a Overhead Cam Engine....
So, yea, 2 days to swap a head on the 3.6L? I say it can be done in a day, many shops might not get started on it first thing in the morning and that would put them into a 2nd day, so two days is a reasonable expectation for a shop. The Dealership taking 5 days, does reflect they are not a well run and staffed Service Department.....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
88 Posts
My experience was they took there time and got it right, didn’t rush it, also at the front of the head there is some sort of sealant used and needs to cure over night,

In my case I’ve now done 4000 kilometres and the engine is running perfectly

I did an oil and filter change after 2000k just for peace of mind
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
My experience was they took there time and got it right, didn’t rush it, also at the front of the head there is some sort of sealant used and needs to cure over night,

In my case I’ve now done 4000 kilometres and the engine is running perfectly

I did an oil and filter change after 2000k just for peace of mind
That sealant is high temp RTV. Its used along the corner with head and manifold gaskets. Pretty common. I use it often that way at work.
 

·
Registered
Grand Cherokee
Joined
·
3,132 Posts
They often use anaerobic sealant on some of the major block and head components, I don't know for a fact if the head of the 3.6L needs anaerobic sealant at some points.

RTV instructions often say to give the RTV a full 24 hours to cure before use. Depending on the application, you can use it within a couple of hours and not have any problems....
Anaerobic sealant needs the full 24 hours to cure...

And yes, RTV has an anaerobic/aerobic element to its curing as well, but it's not the same as most anaerobic sealants.
 
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Top