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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a 2012 JGC with 92k miles on it. I recently had the radiator flushed, cleaned and filled with new coolant. I'm now seeing small puddles of bright yellow/green puddles under the front left side of the Jeep. Does anyone know what fluid is this color? Thanks.
 

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Antifreeze
 
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Could be right for a '12. Zerex HOAT is yellow, as is Ford's rebadge of Zerex. It can look greenish, especially if it's picked up some dirt on its way down.

That being said: what color's the fluid in the washer reservoir? Bug wash or RainX wash is often yellow/green, the reservoir's on the front left, and a tech could easily hit the bottle or pump while servicing the radiator.
 

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The aftermarket is using all sorts of different colors for their anti-freeze, you can't go by color anymore as too what type of antifreeze it is.

I've seen lost of Green OAT being hocked as universal antifreeze.

The Zerex HOAT, which is the same as Ford/Chrysler/Mercedes HOAT, dyed the Ford Amber, since Ford has the most vehicles using this antifreeze, the Amber is so light, it seems to pick up the color of any last trace of the old antifreeze left..... ....I have thoroughly flushed my Chrysler OEM HOAT in other vehicles and refilled with Amber Zerex G-05 HOAT, and it didn't take long before the antifreeze was picking up red/pink coloring of what could only be trace amounts of the original Chrysler OEM HOAT.

My 2011 WK2 I bought used and it had green coolant, and it did not look good, I flushed it right away and replaced it with Zerex G-05 Amber HOAT.... ....I replaced the Water Pump and later the radiator since then, there was a lot of white salty crud encrusted on the water pump and other cooling system parts, so it really seems a previous owner had added green OAT claiming to be universal to the system.... ....so after 3 very thorough flushes, I'm only barely getting a green tinge to the antifreeze color...
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks for all of the good input. I actually had a complete BG radiator service about 2 months ago/2k miles ago. It looks like it is actually seeping at the radiator drain cock. I tried to get at it but there is a plastic shield beneath it that is difficult to remove. I removed the front 4 fasteners but the shield is connected some how further back and I can't get at it as I don't have jacks. I would take it back to where I had the radiator flushed but that was in Florida and I'm now back in Michigan for the summer. 'Guess I'll just have to take it to a local shop here and have them take care of it.
 

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BG machines :rolleyes: Nothing against BG, but Dealers and Garages buy their machines or services and then hock them to their customers to perform services that are unnecessary or even recommended against. You'll find more than one Chrysler Dealership hocking transmission flushes to their customers, despite Chrysler (now FCA) repeatedly telling their Dealerships they recommend against flushing the transmission. When a vehicle actually needs the BG service, chemical or machine, my understanding is the BG solution works very well, the problem is they and the Dealers and Independent shops are pushing the products when they are not necessary to make money and performing services unnecessarily or worse, services that are recommended against and likely are doing more harm than helping.

Why did your vehicle need a radiator flush? Or did the shop just recommend to you that you should flush the radiator? Why not the whole cooling system?

I'm not aware of any HOAT antifreeze that is green. You may want to look into what was actually put into your cooling system and if it was mixed with the original antifreeze or did they do a thorough flush of the entire system to remove any trace of the original fluid.

The dirty little secret is, any antifreeze will work at least OK, if not just as well, in your vehicle as long as your not mixing incompatible antifreezes. But, that means you have to convert to another antifreeze, so you're not mixing them, not just adding another antifreeze. That means a thorough multiple drainings and multiple flushings to remove any traces of the previous antifreeze.

The breakdown on the different types of Antifreeze:
IAT, the original green antifreeze everyone used decades ago, hard to find today:
Protected the best, but had the shortest life and created more problems if you didn't change it.
HOAT, is long life and a hybrid, that uses some of the ingredients and protection methods of both antifreeze types, OAT and IAT.
Protected almost as well as the IAT, lasts longer and creates less problems if you don't change it on time. You can mix it safely with IAT, but you have to change the antifreeze at the shorter IAT interval, because the IAT mixed in it wears out, it starts to change into solids that clog up the system. It can protect older vehicles that had IAT recommended for them.
OAT, is long life that uses totally different technology and methods to protect against corrosion.
Protects the least, but lasts the longest, the most prone to have problems. This is the GM Dexcool that had so many problems when it was first introduced, it has been improved over the years, but there are still problems it is prone to. All OAT is GM Dexcool, so Ford and FCA that now have switched to OAT antifreeze, its not their version of OAT, its simply GM Dexcool. If you have the slightest cooling system problem and an air gets into the system so that the cooling jackets are not 100% covered in coolant you will have all sorts of problems. This can't be mixed with any other antifreeze, this won't protect certain metals like brass and copper, used in older cooling system, this will soften plastic parts and seals used in older vehicles, thus you would never want to use this in an older vehicle that IAT was recommended for. You never mix this with other antifreezes.

And that shop will likely try to claim you can mix OAT with other antifreezes, referring to the many bogus claims of aftermarket antifreeze companies, that they have lost in court every time...... ....show them your O.M. that specifically states not to mix the HOAT antifreeze in your vehicle with OAT....
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
BG machines :rolleyes: Nothing against BG, but Dealers and Garages buy their machines or services and then hock them to their customers to perform services that are unnecessary or even recommended against. You'll find more than one Chrysler Dealership hocking transmission flushes to their customers, despite Chrysler (now FCA) repeatedly telling their Dealerships they recommend against flushing the transmission. When a vehicle actually needs the BG service, chemical or machine, my understanding is the BG solution works very well, the problem is they and the Dealers and Independent shops are pushing the products when they are not necessary to make money and performing services unnecessarily or worse, services that are recommended against and likely are doing more harm than helping.

Why did your vehicle need a radiator flush? Or did the shop just recommend to you that you should flush the radiator? Why not the whole cooling system?

I'm not aware of any HOAT antifreeze that is green. You may want to look into what was actually put into your cooling system and if it was mixed with the original antifreeze or did they do a thorough flush of the entire system to remove any trace of the original fluid.

The dirty little secret is, any antifreeze will work at least OK, if not just as well, in your vehicle as long as your not mixing incompatible antifreezes. But, that means you have to convert to another antifreeze, so you're not mixing them, not just adding another antifreeze. That means a thorough multiple drainings and multiple flushings to remove any traces of the previous antifreeze.

The breakdown on the different types of Antifreeze:
IAT, the original green antifreeze everyone used decades ago, hard to find today:
Protected the best, but had the shortest life and created more problems if you didn't change it.
HOAT, is long life and a hybrid, that uses some of the ingredients and protection methods of both antifreeze types, OAT and IAT.
Protected almost as well as the IAT, lasts longer and creates less problems if you don't change it on time. You can mix it safely with IAT, but you have to change the antifreeze at the shorter IAT interval, because the IAT mixed in it wears out, it starts to change into solids that clog up the system. It can protect older vehicles that had IAT recommended for them.
OAT, is long life that uses totally different technology and methods to protect against corrosion.
Protects the least, but lasts the longest, the most prone to have problems. This is the GM Dexcool that had so many problems when it was first introduced, it has been improved over the years, but there are still problems it is prone to. All OAT is GM Dexcool, so Ford and FCA that now have switched to OAT antifreeze, its not their version of OAT, its simply GM Dexcool. If you have the slightest cooling system problem and an air gets into the system so that the cooling jackets are not 100% covered in coolant you will have all sorts of problems. This can't be mixed with any other antifreeze, this won't protect certain metals like brass and copper, used in older cooling system, this will soften plastic parts and seals used in older vehicles, thus you would never want to use this in an older vehicle that IAT was recommended for. You never mix this with other antifreezes.

And that shop will likely try to claim you can mix OAT with other antifreezes, referring to the many bogus claims of aftermarket antifreeze companies, that they have lost in court every time...... ....show them your O.M. that specifically states not to mix the HOAT antifreeze in your vehicle with OAT....
Wow, that's quite a diatribe. Hope the next guy who considers changing his engine coolant benefits from it. For me it's a bit too late...
FYI: I had it done because my '12 JGC 5.7L had 89k miles on it at the time and is 9 years old and I plan to keep it. It was a forum topic here with videos from a member who did it himself that motivated me to have it done but I didn't want to do it myself. It was a complete BG coolant system flush and fill with new coolant done at a very highly respected auto repair shop in Naples, FL. Perhaps it was over kill but what is done is done. What I need to do now is get the drain cock to stop seeping fluid although it is very slight. I will take it to a local radiator shop here in Fenton, MI to have it fixed since I am unable to do it myself.
 

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The OEM HOAT is good for 100k miles or 5 years, whichever occurs first, so yes you were overdue....
This is why all the manufacturers have switched to long life antifreeze, if you had the original IAT Green antifreeze, likely you would have had scaling, massive corrosion or gunk in your cooling system by then.
I have my doubts a flush machine can clear out all the old coolant quickly, but I really don't know what the BG machine and the shop did. If they cleared all the old coolant and used an OAT in its place, you're probably fine. The only green antifreeze I have seen that is not IAT has been OAT, so I'd b suspicious you have OAT in your cooling system.

Keep in mind, leaks drain down to the lowest point that sticks out to drip off, so its possible your leak is somewhere else and might be just dripping off your drain spigot.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
The OEM HOAT is good for 100k miles or 5 years, whichever occurs first, so yes you were overdue....
This is why all the manufacturers have switched to long life antifreeze, if you had the original IAT Green antifreeze, likely you would have had scaling, massive corrosion or gunk in your cooling system by then.
I have my doubts a flush machine can clear out all the old coolant quickly, but I really don't know what the BG machine and the shop did. If they cleared all the old coolant and used an OAT in its place, you're probably fine. The only green antifreeze I have seen that is not IAT has been OAT, so I'd b suspicious you have OAT in your cooling system.

Keep in mind, leaks drain down to the lowest point that sticks out to drip off, so its possible your leak is somewhere else and might be just dripping off your drain spigot.
Thanks for your prescient insight and advice.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
I just found out from garage that did the BG coolant system service that they do not open the radiator drain petcock. They connect their machine to one of the large radiator hoses.
 

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Since my leak is very minor, I will try Bars Radiator Stop Leak.
You may want to rethink that if you plan on keeping the vehicle for a while. Use of stop leak products can clog radiator flow over time. It might be more prudent to have the radiator repaired. That's just my opinion from personal experience.
 
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I second the recommendation to have the radiator inspected before resorting to Bars. Once the stop leak chemicals are in the system they can really gunk up other places in the cooling system. I would only use it on a beater car that doesn't have much life left in it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
jacko15
"You may want to rethink that if you plan on keeping the vehicle for a while. Use of stop leak products can clog radiator flow over time. It might be more prudent to have the radiator repaired. That's just my opinion from personal experience."

I second the recommendation to have the radiator inspected before resorting to Bars. Once the stop leak chemicals are in the system they can really gunk up other places in the cooling system. I would only use it on a beater car that doesn't have much life left in it.
Thanks jacko15 and oilspot. I am doing as you advise and taking it in to my local radiator shop. I have an appointment next Monday. I think that this may be expensive but certainly cheaper than buying a new car. My '12 JGC 5.7L Hemi only has 91k miles on it so I think it still has a LOT of life in it. Besides, both my wife and I really love it!
 

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Hopefully the radiator shop can replace the petcock or tighten it.
If you haven't already, call the Fla. radiator shop and find out what type of coolant they used to fill the system, in case you need to add coolant down the road.
 

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Fingers crossed, your problem is just a $4 drain petcock, but Again, any leak from that side of the radiator would have coolant running down to drip off the extended spot, so you need to inspect closer, your problem might be something other than the petcock.

Look at how narrow the tubes are on the WK2'sradiator, if they are not micro-channel, they are close.... ....radiators sealants rarely work, and especially that Bar's Stop Leak with lots of particles in it, very likely to clog things up.....

I know its tempting, but most additives are snake oil, they do nothing if not hurt the situation.

I have had a used blue devil headgasket sealant for a very minor intermittent HG leak, with an Overhead Cam V6, I was not looking forward to a Headgasket Replacement, the fact it was a clear liquid that only seals/solidifies under the pressure/heat of the headgasket and not in the rest of the coolant system. I was surprised it work.

If my problem was a radiator leak, I'd replaced the radiator, its not expensive or hard to do. If you can't do it yourself, I'd shop independent shops for the best price. I wouldn't try that Bar's stop leak crap designed for 1970's and earlier radiators with all that solid gunk in it.
 

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Interesting! I used to work in the environmental business and know Crystal Clean well. That is a recycled antifreeze product. I'm glad all the antifreeze we sent them actually got recycled. I don't know the technical details of how antifreeze is recycled, but I'm sure they have a specification they need to meet. They call it "Global" because it is supposed to work in any car. That is why so many shops stock it and only it. I read some really good posts on here about the science of antifreeze and I won't try to duplicate it here.
 

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The website listed on the jug only speaks of their anti-freeze in general and claims it is OAT. It also looks like it is re-cycled and not new antifreeze, that may not be as bad as it sounds.

OAT is not "Global" because it will not work in every car. At least if they are interpreting OAT as the "2-EHA" (the primary anti-corrosion chemical) Dexcool OAT, there are other types of HOAT antifreezes that people go back and forth on calling HOAT or OAT.

Peak sells an antifreeze product that has global in the name, I thought it used to be Propylene Glycol, which FCA recommends against using this in their vehicles, but people have done it with very little problem. But I just checked their SDS at the Peak website and its says it uses Ethylene Glycol like most antifreeze.

The antifreeze has three parts, the actual antifreeze, an anticorrosion package and water. No kidding, the antifreeze ingredient itself will freeze at close to the same temp as water, it has to be mixed with water to have a lower freeze temperature. So concentrated antifreeze already comes premixed with some water, that you mix 50/50 with demineralized* water to get the actual proper proportions. The actual antifreeze part, Ethylene Glycol and a little bit of Diethylene Glycol doesn't wear out. Its the anticorrosion package that wears out, and its the anticorrosion package that causes all the problems with antifreeze, especially when it wears out or gets depleted. And its the anticorrosion package that makes different types of antifreeze. Besides the Propylene Glycol alternative that was around before Long Life antifreeze.

I don't know everything involved in recycling antifreeze, but what I know from above, it must involve recovering the re-usable part, the actual antifreeze components, Ethylene and Diethylene Glycols and then adding in a new anticorrosion package and water.

IAT (the original green shorter life antifreeze) = coats the metal with silicates and fills in corrosion and cavitation pock marks with phosphates to prevent corrosion. The package of these chemicals gets depleted over time and with use and breaks down and changes into solids floating in the cooling system and lets corrosion/rust start. They will react with the minerals in the water added to the antifreeze and form scaling and deposits. This is why you should mix it with Demineralized (distilled or de-ionized) water instead of tap water, especially if you live in an area with hard water (lots of minerals in the water).

OAT (the Dexcool that uses 2-EHA) = doesn't coat anything, it uses a chemical that reacts with the surface of aluminum and steel that doesn't allow rust. It takes longer for this reaction to start to burnish the surface of the metal than it does for the IAT package to coat the surfaces and the chemical has to be in constant contact with the metal. So if you develop the minor and mostly unnoticeable leak in the cooling system that allows some air in the system, that causes rust, that then reacts with the antifreeze to form a brown goop. It doesn't wear out, it doesn't react with minerals in the water. So you can mix it with Hard Water from the tap without problems. It doesn't wear out, but the stated life is 10 years/150k miles, people speculate that is more a case of any car needs to have a cooling system flush by 10 years/150k miles, regardless if the antifreeze is worn out or not, is behind that life recommendation.

HOAT, H stand for Hybrid, = uses anticorrosion ingredients from both IAT and OAT, so it both coats metals and burnishes the surface to prevent them from corroding. The Chrysler/FCA/Ford/Mercedes HOAT uses benzoates as the OAT ingredient and uses silicates to coat. Some of the Japanese and European OAT's, that some call OATs, may not have silicates but phosphates instead. HOATs are suppose to be more tolerant of hard water, I have even seen guidance you should use tap water instead of de-mineralized water. But I personally use Demineralized water with HOAT. I'm sure some are more tolerant than others for hard water, I can't understand why unneeded minerals in the water would be better than almost pure water instead to be mixed with it. Its long life, but not as long life as OAT. OAT, I've seen said will never wear, but considering the problems OAT is prone to, you'll likely need to replace before its life is up anyway to repair the system, as well, after 150k miles you should flush out your cooling system anyway, so that might be why they make that recommendation of a 150k mile life.

OAT is not universal, yet many in the industry try to hock their OAT products claiming it is universal.
OAT can NOT be mixed with other antifreezes, it may have been improved over the years that it takes longer for the adverse reactions to happen, but they will eventually happen.
OAT will not protect older cars that have metals that OAT does not protect (copper and brass) and plastics or seals that OAT will soften.
OAT (IMO) is more prone to problems than the others, but it does last much longer.

BUT, as far as the WK2, as long as you have thoroughly flushed away any traces of the previous antifreeze in the cooling system, you could switch to OAT if you wanted to use another type of antifreeze, just don't mix it with another type when topping off, and it should protect adequately.
 
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